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Maedhros last won the day on September 22 2019

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  1. You're using the example of a player who was kicked off the team... as evidence that Archie isn't being allowed to kick players off the team?
  2. Izzo was 22-8 his third season, won the Big Ten and made the Sweet Sixteen. He won the conference again in year four and made the Final Four. In year five he won the National Championship.
  3. Yeah man, I read your entire post. I'm not happy either and share your concerns; that's not the part that prompted my response. It was your last line that had me curious enough to research to whom it was you were referring. Doing so also led to likely reasons why Wright was able to get things going in the right direction. Do we share those reasons for optimism? At this moment in time, I don't believe we do. Sure, maybe we hired our Tony Bennett and in Archie's fifth season he'll bust into the tournament for good with fringe top 100 recruits and a top 50 kid sprinkled on top. I hope we do! But hope makes for a lousy strategy. It's also a lot easier to hold out hope when your school has only won one Tournament game in the 14 years prior to the new coach being hired than it is at an Indiana school trying to level up from Big Ten titles and three Sweet Sixteens in six years. I've been labeled anti-Archie by some over on my main board. In truth, I'm just waiting for him to show me something. I'm not willing to take it on faith alone that the new guy is an upgrade on the old guy. We get glimpses for two or three games each season, then long stretches where everything goes to shit. I'm not now and have never called for Archie to be fired, and the terms of his contract dictate that he'll be here at least through next season and probably the season after that. He'll have time to show us what he can do. But there's no causal connection between sticking with a coach and having a successful program. Doing the former is no guarantee of the latter. I need to see reasons to think we have the right guy in place, otherwise we're just committing the sunk costs error.
  4. I think we'd feel a lot better about it if we were rolling into the upcoming season with a 7 man rotation composed entirely of RSCI top 65 recruits, four of them juniors, and adding a freshman point guard who would go on to be a six time NBA All Star. My issue with the constant use of early records is that it's such a 30,000 foot view. Wins and losses alone tell us very little about the direction of the program. For every successful coach that struggled early there are many more that just kept struggling. So what details are we seeing to make us think Archie will be the former, not the latter? Does he have a Cody Zeller coming in next season, and an All American point guard in the class after that? Does he have a stellar four man freshman class this season that just needs time, with two All Americans coming in next season, as Coach K did when he turned it around in year 4? What specifically about the current program inspires confidence that we'll be in the Sweet Sixteen next season and the Elite Eight after that, like your example of Jay Wright?
  5. This doesn't pass the smell test. It requires one of the hottest names in college coaching, who turned down high major offers including from his alma mater NC St to take the Indiana job, rolling over upon getting it. Archie has options, even if his stock is dropping. He's by far the most visible face of the program and had overwhelming support from the time he arrived in Bloomington. No one could have been able to make him a puppet unless he allowed it.
  6. Sure it does. FKIM01 did a great job just above. Let's try this: there's a real mob mentality this afternoon, on this board and others. People are posting single frames from an entire game, and claiming proof of their preconceived notions. As if they know a single thing that player is thinking or saying to his teammates, or dealing with personally at that moment in time. It's getting ugly out there, and why? Because our coach signaled his permission in front of the press. Archie's always had his detractors. Getting run by Indiana State in your debut will do that. But it took a turn in the last month or so, and even some who had supported him completely began to express their doubts. Those supporters are back on board, and all it took was for coach to call out his upperclassmen. The same players he's been coaching for two and a half years. The same players, De'Ron and his injuries aside, to whom he's been giving the most minutes all season long. And only now, with the Big Ten season looming and the possibility of missing the Tournament, is when he wants to start talking about accountability and buy in? I don't want to hear him talk about it. The same way I don't want to hear about what our guys looked like in practice, or how we're going to have an eleven man rotation, or how our guys really can shoot from three after all. I want to see it on the court. Archie says a lot of great of things, but in his time at Indiana he's not yet proved capable of finding the right buttons to push to produce results. He's not earned my benefit of the doubt. I have no reason to believe new tougher Archie is going to be any more effective than the version we've seen for three seasons now. Neither does anyone suddenly convinced we're back on the right track. I need to see it in the court first. Then he can tell us how it did it. There's no reason he needed to call his guys out in public pressers, nothing that couldn't be accomplished behind closed doors. But it sure got people talking about our players, Archie's players, instead of Archie.
  7. It's been a little scary to see how easily and swiftly a coach who's been underperforming for three years now, with three different teams, has been able to redirect so much fan frustration from himself on to his players with just one postgame press conference. Before we've seen any actual actions or improvements in play.
  8. The picture thing is nonsense. It's just one moment in time. Watch the game, and you'll see plenty of instances when both Green and De'Ron were cheering right along with the rest of their teammates. Those moments aren't being screen-grabbed and posted to social media because they don't fit a certain narrative. This picture might as well be an ink blot, because it serves whatever confirmation bias you wish to bring to it. I see Devonte clapping along with everyone else. I see that he doesn't have his warm-ups on, likely indicating he just came out of the game. He played 20 minutes, more than everyone else within the frame of that picture combined. The reason he's sitting could be as simply as the fact that he's getting some needed rest. It doesn't need to be any more complicated than that.
  9. And... Archie himself. If those four are the root of our problems, why haven't they been replaced? Why are three of those four in our starting lineup, and getting the most minutes per game of anyone else but Trayce? The rest of Archie's underclassmen gave us next to nothing tonight. If it were truly the upperclassmen stunting this program, it should have been easy to recruit our develop over them. That it hasn't happened suggests the problems run deeper than those four guys.
  10. The only player we have reason to believe is not 100% healthy is Rob. In his case, we've been told he has an undisclosed injury he may have to deal with the entire season, but it's apparently not serious enough to hold him out of any games. At best when you say "get every player healthy" you're talking about one guy. I don't think that's enough to explain our struggles, especially not when just about every team in the country stuffers at least one injury of some kind or another. This isn't at all like last season.
  11. I've always found that tale to be nonsense. We had two commits ask for their release when Crean was fired, two spots that could have been given to McKinley Wright. Archie had to convince Durham and Moore to stay, and that's a two-way street, not the kind of thing you can force as an AD. What's more, we booted Grant Gelon that May, and had Curtis Jones transfer mid-semester. Clearly roster turnover wasn't a forbidden thing. It's also struck a wrong chord with me that tales of Archie being hamstrung only came out well after the fact, when results on the court haven't been what we wanted to see. The far simpler explanation to me is that Archie just made a mistake. He chose to roll with the guys currently on or committed to the roster, before quite knowing what he had, and perhaps without quite knowing how good Wright would turn out to be. Evaluation misses happen to every coach. This one became a problem only because we haven't recovered. Imagine this team with DJ Carton. Or Anthony Harris. Jahmius Ramsey, Tyrell Terry, Kira Lewis, James Bouknight, Lester Quinones or any of the other guard targets we missed. We've swung and missed too often for me to shed any tears over the McKinley Wright recruitment, whatever role the AD may or may not have had to play in it.
  12. It's perhaps telling of Archie's lack of success at Indiana that so many narratives keep forming to explain why he hasn't gotten us there yet. This is one such example. Make no mistake, Thad Matta was fired for performance. OSU had dropped from 2nd to 5th, 6th, 7th and 10th place in the B1G since 2013. His last team finished 17-15 overall, 7-11 in the Big Ten, and failed to make the NIT. The year before, when Indiana was winning the Big Ten, OSU was a three seed in the NIT. Recruiting had also dried up; the incoming 2017 class only had one commit, legacy Kaleb Wesson, and he had pledged two years prior. The entire five-man 2015 class was gone from campus. Matta's health was a consideration to be sure, and led the AD to doubt Matta would be able to right the ship, but make no mistake, the program was definitely headed in the wrong direction. 2017 was the first year Brendan Quinn ran the Unofficial Big Ten Media Poll. Ohio St was selected 11th, two spots behind Indiana; they finished the year 15-3 and 2nd in the conference. If Archie had a year like that in his first season he'd be hailed as a conquering hero. His supporters rightly praise him for finishing 9-9 that season and 6th in the conference, ahead of what was projected. How strange, then, that I keep hearing how Holtmann's even greater accomplishments are a product of the situation he inherited.
  13. Or it could be as simple as the fact that Marquette started recruiting him first, they've been on him the longest, and he could very well have developed the best relationship with that staff. Marquette was always perceived as the leader. Looking for red flags in why he didn't choose Indiana is starting from a faulty premise. Dawson Garcia grew up in Minnesota. He has no reason to be interested in Indiana whatsoever. The tradition we love to tout is the result of titles and coaches from before Dawson was born. It's to Archie's credit he was able to sell this program so well that we ended up as the ostensible runner-up, over Garcia's hometown Minnesota and bluebloods like Kansas and UNC. Because remember, this wasn't always a two horse race. If Garcia's decision is truly down to Indiana or Marquette, it means he valued the situation at Indiana so highly that he placed us ahead of 20 other offers reported on 247. That list includes situations where Garcia's talent would have been relied on even more than at Marquette, and schools where he would have won far more games than at Indiana. This post, and those prior, just reek of post hoc rationalization. It's myopic to think that Indiana is always the best choice for any recruit we choose to pursue, and I reject this sense of Indiana Exceptionalism that always rears its head when we miss on a recruit. By virtue of participating on this board, we're all passionate Indiana fans, emotionally invested in the travails of this program. But just because we can't see the reasons why a recruit might choose Marquette over Indiana, that's not proof such reasons don't exist. There are hundreds of schools that play Division I ball, and hundreds of coaches. Every prospective student, even the athletes, needs to pick the situation that's right for them. Acting in your own rational self interest in this manner doesn't make you "me first" or selfish, and thinking it does is just silly. Genuinely, what mentality is it that you think made Hulls, Lewis, Cheaney, Hornsby and Coverdale choose Indiana? If fit and playing time weren't factors, what was? This entire exercise appears to exist because those players chose Indiana and Garcia might not.
  14. I'll vouch for him, he's a good dude from the main site I frequent. I know this place holds CoachSS in high regard; Sam has said there he's of the belief Garcia will pop for Marquette.
  15. Slater is that guy. I've watched many a pundit on that site follow his lead, even Jerry Meyer. Slater was the first to call the Garland flip to Vanderbilt.The only guy with more pull is probably Evan Daniels.
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