Coaching Change

[IUfaninIllinois]

1 minute ago, Sea Turtle said:

Ok but he has had 30 games now. They are getting worse, not better. How long does it take to build a team that can win at home against Rutgers on senior night? He has an all american for Pete's sake. 

And yes, it does bother me to see my team as a laughing stock. 

And that all American turns the ball over at the end of games and missed wide open point blank shot that would’ve given us the lead. That all American misses more layups than any all American I’ve ever seen. The coaches can only do so much when kopp goes 1-6 and Stewart goes 2-7 from 3. Stewart was wide open on those 3s and missed. Coaches don’t make shots. You hold the coaches accountable but do you hold players accountable? 

[Sea Turtle]

7 minutes ago, MoyeCowbell said:

I'm all for fit and character. I've said it on another thread that I believe winners are an absolute necessity in recruiting. Finding players that have won high school/prep championships is a big, if somewhat underrated, factor.

All that said, making a declaration as a program to go after the absolute best of the best players in the country is paramount. We can get those plucky, homegrown kids with ties to the program/state to fill out the back half of our roster, but we need to go after the thoroughbreds.

And I don't mean, just go after in a hopeful way, a la "Gollee, it'd be nice to have so-so."  No, I think IU needs to decide/declare that this is what we are. We are the best and we go after the best.

It's a swagger. A confidence. A decision.

And not just the best players, but the best coaches, compliance and academic support.

From day one, Calipari and UK had everyone on the same page to allow him to do whatever it took to win without blatantly cheating. Their compliance helps them navigate the rules, not play gotcha with them. We could have had him or several other really good coaches.

But indiana doesn't want to do that. They don't want to do what it takes these. You have Universities telling the NCAA and the Freaking FBI to eff off and we are blowing up the program over a phone call. You can't win that way. 

[Sea Turtle]

4 minutes ago, IUfaninIllinois said:

And that all American turns the ball over at the end of games and missed wide open point blank shot that would’ve given us the lead. That all American misses more layups than any all American I’ve ever seen. The coaches can only do so much when kopp goes 1-6 and Stewart goes 2-7 from 3. Stewart was wide open on those 3s and missed. Coaches don’t make shots. You hold the coaches accountable but do you hold players accountable? 

I do but who brought those players in? Bring in guys who can shoot the ball better than I do in the B gym during lunch in high school.

[IU Scott]

8 minutes ago, Sea Turtle said:

Ok but he has had 30 games now. They are getting worse, not better. How long does it take to build a team that can win at home against Rutgers on senior night? He has an all american for Pete's sake. 

And yes, it does bother me to see my team as a laughing stock. 

Lucky for Coach K that you wasn't making coaching decisions at Duke. Look at what his record was after 30 games or even after 4 years.  If he was just starting out today he would have never made it to be the all time wins leader.

[Sea Turtle]

3 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

Lucky for Coach K that you wasn't making coaching decisions at Duke. Look at what his record was after 30 games or even after 4 years.  If he was just starting out today he would have never made it to be the all time wins leader.

I know. Same with Tom Landry. But they weren't 63 either.

[IUfaninIllinois]

8 minutes ago, Sea Turtle said:

I do but who brought those players in? Bring in guys who can shoot the ball better than I do in the B gym during lunch in high school.

Miller Kopp was a shooter. He had Anthony Leal and Parker Stewart he also was hired when most recruits were already committed. You’re being absolutely unreasonable with the coaching staff getting recruits. Also he got Tamar bates who was 21st best player in college who shot well in high school but it hasn’t fully translated yet as it typically doesn’t with freshman. If you think In a college game you could ever shoot better than those kids then you’re clearly crazier than I thought.

[MoyeCowbell]

5 minutes ago, Sea Turtle said:

And not just the best players, but the best coaches, compliance and academic support.

From day one, Calipari and UK had everyone on the same page to allow him to do whatever it took to win without blatantly cheating. Their compliance helps them navigate the rules, not play gotcha with them. We could have had him or several other really good coaches.

But indiana doesn't want to do that. They don't want to do what it takes these. You have Universities telling the NCAA and the Freaking FBI to eff off and we are blowing up the program over a phone call. You can't win that way. 

But that has changed. Miles Brand is gone. President McRobbie, whose decisions to downplay sports have certainly hurt us, is gone. 

But you act like Glass and Dolson don't want IU to succeed. They've put an emphasis on getting IU's luster back. It'll happen.

[KoB2011]

1 hour ago, IU Scott said:

If you mean cheat to get talent I hope we don't do that. I see teams like UW and PU who doesn't get highly ranked players but can develop them into a great team.  There is no reason we can't have a program like those teams.  I don't see how those programs having to stoop to that level to be successful.

I don't know what I mean in terms of doing what it takes. I know that I aspire to be more than Wisconsin or Purdue. 

[5fouls]

It's becoming clear to me that IU should have hired one of us to coach.  We are so much smarter.  

[Coach Robby]

5 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

It's becoming clear to me that IU should have hired one of us to coach.  We are so much smarter.  

I’m in for academic advisor 

[5fouls]

1 minute ago, Coach Robby said:

I’m in for academic advisor 

I'll take responsibility for the cheerleaders.

[BDB]

1 hour ago, IUFLA said:

Rome wasn't built in a day...

It wasn't; however, I bet the project manager wasn't 63.

 

[5fouls]

Exactly what does Woodson's age have to do with our won / loss record?

[BDB]

5 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

Exactly what does Woodson's age have to do with our won / loss record?

Rome wasn't built in one day has nothing to do with a record either.  It has to do with time.

[Sea Turtle]

23 minutes ago, MoyeCowbell said:

But that has changed. Miles Brand is gone. President McRobbie, whose decisions to downplay sports have certainly hurt us, is gone. 

But you act like Glass and Dolson don't want IU to succeed. They've put an emphasis on getting IU's luster back. It'll happen.

I think they do. They just don't know how in this day and age.

Notre Dame finally got the right guy in Jack Swarbrick. The way the football program now operates is night and day from before. They have played for three national championships since 2012.

And they even got into a bit of trouble with a few kids not writing their own papers. Did they blow up the entire freaking football program? No. They cleaned it up on that part and basically told the NCAA that they would never turn themselves in again and would handle it in house. Mind you, this was when the UNC scandal was going on. 

They were considered dead and irrelevant. They got real. They got serious. This gives me hope that Indiana may one day. 

[MoyeCowbell]

3 minutes ago, Sea Turtle said:

I think they do. They just don't know how in this day and age.

Notre Dame finally got the right guy in Jack Swarbrick. The way the football program now operates is night and day from before. They have played for three national championships since 2012.

And they even got into a bit of trouble with a few kids not writing their own papers. Did they blow up the entire freaking football program? No. They cleaned it up on that part and basically told the NCAA that they would never turn themselves in again and would handle it in house. Mind you, this was when the UNC scandal was going on. 

They were considered dead and irrelevant. They got real. They got serious. This gives me hope that Indiana may one day. 

I'm truly trying to understand what you're implying. Is it that IU should look the other way when improprieties occur? Worse, create them? And simply tell the governing bodies "sorry, won't happen again"? That's dangerous.

I agree in that IU needs to get away from being self-sanctimonious, but it doesn't need to operate in the dark shadows either.

And to the 'serious' implication, how is IU currently the opposite?

[BGleas]

8 hours ago, KoB2011 said:

I don't know what I mean in terms of doing what it takes. I know that I aspire to be more than Wisconsin or Purdue. 

I want IU recruiting at the level of these schools, doing what they do to get their players. 

Michigan State

Michigan 

Villanova

UCLA

Kansas

Kentucky

Duke

UNC

Auburn

I don’t think you bring in an NBA guy, Thad Matta, Dane Fife, Hunter and Ya to recruit like Archie Miller.

You bring that staff in to significantly upgrade the level of recruits IU is landing. 

[KoB2011]

8 hours ago, MoyeCowbell said:

I'm truly trying to understand what you're implying. Is it that IU should look the other way when improprieties occur? Worse, create them? And simply tell the governing bodies "sorry, won't happen again"? That's dangerous.

I agree in that IU needs to get away from being self-sanctimonious, but it doesn't need to operate in the dark shadows either.

And to the 'serious' implication, how is IU currently the opposite?

I don’t think what Notre Dame did is the ‘dark shadows’. 

[IUFLA]

9 hours ago, BDB said:

It wasn't; however, I bet the project manager wasn't 63.

 

😁

And you're right...if, at the end of year 3, we're not seeing a vast improvement in the overall program, and the record in particular, it'll be time to look at a different direction...

But we have to give Mike Woodson the time to effect this program overhaul...and year one should be the barometer, not the finish line...

Are we better than last year? On defense we certainly are. Last year conference teams shot 45% overall against us which was 11th in the conference. This year conference foes shot 41% against us, qualifying for 1st. We get open looks, we just don't have the consistent shooters or that one guy that can lift can lift a team to victory when the game is on the line...

So, yeah, it is about time...time to upgrade the talent and perpetuate the culture Coach Woodson has started...

And the patience on our part to let the man do his job...

[rico]

55 minutes ago, KoB2011 said:

I don’t think what Notre Dame did is the ‘dark shadows’. 

Depends on your definition of 'dark shadows.'  Some of these institutions lower their academic criteria for admissions for athletes.

[BGleas]

5 minutes ago, rico said:

Depends on your definition of 'dark shadows.'  Some of these institutions lower their academic criteria for admissions for athletes.

I think almost every school does that. I was a D2 recruit and every school that was recruiting me sent me an application with "basketball" stamped at the top so admissions knew I was a recruit. 

I had a coach from a highly regarded academic school that was recruiting me call and say he was going to a special meeting with admissions to see if he could me in. I wasn't the best student so told him not to waste his time 🤣.

[rico]

12 minutes ago, BGleas said:

I think almost every school does that. I was a D2 recruit and every school that was recruiting me sent me an application with "basketball" stamped at the top so admissions knew I was a recruit. 

I had a coach from a highly regarded academic school that was recruiting me call and say he was going to a special meeting with admissions to see if he could me in. I wasn't the best student so told him not to waste his time 🤣.

And what was that Prop 48 thing?  The one that made Glenn Robinson and Dwayne Wade ineligible their frosh years.

[BGleas]

25 minutes ago, rico said:

And what was that Prop 48 thing?  The one that made Glenn Robinson and Dwayne Wade ineligible their frosh years.

Prop 48 was for kids that couldn't meet the NCAA's minimum requirements to be eligible/cleared coming into college. That's different then a school like Norte Dame lowering their entrance requirements to allow a football player admission to the school. 

[RJPaisley]

10 hours ago, 5fouls said:

I'll take responsibility for the cheerleaders.

And papas all over the state are saying...Oh, hell the damn NO!

[KoB2011]

21 minutes ago, BGleas said:

Prop 48 was for kids that couldn't meet the NCAA's minimum requirements to be eligible/cleared coming into college. That's different then a school like Norte Dame lowering their entrance requirements to allow a football player admission to the school. 

Just to add to this… even Ivy League schools do this.

I know a few guys who played football or basketball at Ivy League schools that would have never gotten in without sports. They weren’t complete idiots, but like mid 3s GPA.