Jackson State Post Game Thread

[rico]

1 minute ago, NCHoosier32 said:

i mean, i think so?  i'm just not 100% sold because we are looking good beating bad teams.  like i keep saying, i'm excited about the season for sure.  i am just reluctant to make a big deal of anything until we play a ranked team.  i always watch the entirety off all of the games, but i have been bored the last few.  all of the teams ahead of us have played one of the other top dawgs other than NC.   

I completely understand how and why you would feel this way.

[NCHoosier32]

Just now, Kdug said:

I agree with the premise that I’d like to see us play some more good teams before making judgements…but an away win against Xavier is a really good win based on how they’ve looked this far. Kenpom has them ranked around 30th, which would be a Q1 win

agreed.  i was very happy with that.  also, i know we have plenty of tests coming up.  at the same time, #30 isn't the same as top 10 that the other guys have played.  that's all i'm saying.  that said, i think we'll beat NC.  just ready to see it!  then i will be really excited about this team!

[BGleas]

5 minutes ago, NCHoosier32 said:

i mean, i think so?  i'm just not 100% sold because we are looking good beating bad teams.  like i keep saying, i'm excited about the season for sure.  i am just reluctant to make a big deal of anything until we play a ranked team.  i always watch the entirety off all of the games, but i have been bored the last few.  all of the teams ahead of us have played one of the other top dawgs other than NC.   

Agree, to an extent. I probably don't feel as strongly as you do on this, as I think Xavier has a chance to be ranked this year and is definitely a tournament team. They good. 

But to your point, everyone is talking about our depth and its been good in 5 of our 6 games. But in the Xavier game, outside of Reneau, the depth didn't really show up. 

When we play good teams are Bates, Geronimo and to a lesser extent Galloway (he's more proven) going to be reliable and make our depth a big strength? 

Some of that remains to be seen. 

[NCHoosier32]

sure would make me feel better if Xavier could pull it off at home vs. Duke.  only down by 6 at half is a good sign.  i'm also not saying Xavier is terrible, or not a potential top 25 team, or not a tourney team.  just not a top 15 team.  pretty good team.  i think we said something similar about St. John's last season.  

[IU Scott]

Comparison of thebfirst 6 games from this year to last year.

Last year                    This year

EMU 68-62                 Morehead 88-53

NIU 85-49                   Bethune 101-49 

St.Johns 76-74.          Xavier 81-79 

Louisiana 76-44.         Miami 86-56 

JSU 70-35.                  Little Rock 87-68 

Marshall 90-79.           JSU 90-51 

Last year average score offense 77.5 

This year average score 88.8 

Last year defense 57.2 

This year's defense 59.3 

Last year's scoring margin 20.2 

This year's scoring margin 29.5 

Last year's team had Phinnisee, Durr, Stewart and Lander. 

This year's team had JHS, Reneau, Gunn and Banks. 

To me I see a lot of improvement from last year 

 

[NCHoosier32]

what difference does it make if we beat bad teams by 20.2 or 29.5?  i definitely like this year's roster much better.  i think it's gonna be a great season!  just ready to see it against the big dawgs.  ready for Weds.!  i'll be up waaaaaaaaay past my bedtime.  

[IU Scott]

Just now, NCHoosier32 said:

what difference does it make if we beat bad teams by 20.2 or 29.5?  i definitely like this year's roster much better.  i think it's gonna be a great season!  just ready to see it against the big dawgs.  ready for Weds.!  i'll be up waaaaaaaaay past my bedtime.  

It shows that this year's team is scoring better and playing as good as defense as last year. You said you don't see any difference from last year but I think these stats show otherwise 

[bluegrassIU]

6 minutes ago, NCHoosier32 said:

what difference does it make if we beat bad teams by 20.2 or 29.5?  i definitely like this year's roster much better.  i think it's gonna be a great season!  just ready to see it against the big dawgs.  ready for Weds.!  i'll be up waaaaaaaaay past my bedtime.  

I hear and understand all you are saying. My fear for you is that if we lose and don't play well against UNC then you are almost at a point of feeling its a lost season.

Don't put too much emphasis in a single game, or even mini stretches.

It's a long season. There will be ups and downs.   🍻 

[NCHoosier32]

Dear Scott -

I do my best not to engage with you.  Please show me where I said I don't see any difference from last year.  I simply said we haven't proven anything yet because we haven't played anyone yet.  I also respectfully disagree that it matters if you beat bad teams by 20.2 or 29.5.

Sincerely,

NCHoosier

[NCHoosier32]

2 minutes ago, bluegrassIU said:

I hear and understand all you are saying. My fear for you is that if we lose and don't play well against UNC then you are almost at a point of feeling its a lost season.

Don't put too much emphasis in a single game, or even mini stretches.

It's a long season. There will be ups and downs.   🍻 

no, i gotcha.  i'll be devastated for a few days if that happens as i have a ton of UNC fans to deal with.  i won't think all is lost though.  they are #1 after all.  i personally don't think they're the best team in the nation, but they are good.  i just like the idea of being in the top 10.  i think we could be a top 10 caliber.  if we lose, we'll get the chance to show what we are made of again vs Kansas and AZ.  

[IU Scott]

I just feel sad for people who can't truly enjoy a game or season because you always look at the negative aspect of a game.  We are fans and not coaches so. why worry about things we have no control over. If people can't see improvement this year from last either don't want to see it or don't know what they are looking at.

People are worried about our game with UNC but look at their games so far this year and have struggled against weak competition. They beat Portland yesterday 88-81 and had finish the  game on a 10-1 run to win it.

Edited November 25, 2022 by IU Scott

[NCHoosier32]

3 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

I just feel sad for people who can't truly enjoy a game or season because you always look at the negative aspect of a game.  We are fans and not coaches so. why worry about things we have no control over. If people can't see improvement this year from last either don't want to see it or don't know what they are looking at.

People are worried about our game with UNC but look at their games so far this year and have struggled against weak competition. They beat Portland yesterday 88-81 and had finish the  game on a 10-1 run to win it.

thank you Scott.  i feel loved.  

[IU Scott]

1 minute ago, NCHoosier32 said:

thank you Scott.  i feel loved.  

Main reason I say that was when I was younger I was one of those people who only saw the negative part of the game. I use to be miserable to be around during IU games especially after a loss.

[Seeking6]

I think Butch mentioned it a few times today. The thing about depth that doesn't always show up in box score is that fresh bodies keep coming. As we move into conference play or I guess what we call more challenging games I can't wait to see what our 6-10 or 11 does to opposing teams. If someone like Illinois or Purdue or Wisconsin is say only 7-8 deep....the pounding our bench guys can deliver will wear other teams starters/first subs throughout a game which sets us up for always winning the final 10 minutes.

Kind of like tackling Derrick Henry. Might work in the first half but by end of game the pounding just wears you out. 

[NCHoosier32]

5 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

I think Butch mentioned it a few times today. The thing about depth that doesn't always show up in box score is that fresh bodies keep coming. As we move into conference play or I guess what we call more challenging games I can't wait to see what our 6-10 or 11 does to opposing teams. If someone like Illinois or Purdue or Wisconsin is say only 7-8 deep....the pounding our bench guys can deliver will wear other teams starters/first subs throughout a game which sets us up for always winning the final 10 minutes.

Kind of like tackling Derrick Henry. Might work in the first half but by end of game the pounding just wears you out. 

true, but we have to see how some of these guys look vs B1G competition.  also playing devil's advocate, i would argue that i'd rather have TJD, XJ, JHS, Race, and Malik a little tired than any of our other guys fresh.  Bates and Geronimo may prove me wrong though!

[IU Scott]

29 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

I think Butch mentioned it a few times today. The thing about depth that doesn't always show up in box score is that fresh bodies keep coming. As we move into conference play or I guess what we call more challenging games I can't wait to see what our 6-10 or 11 does to opposing teams. If someone like Illinois or Purdue or Wisconsin is say only 7-8 deep....the pounding our bench guys can deliver will wear other teams starters/first subs throughout a game which sets us up for always winning the final 10 minutes.

Kind of like tackling Derrick Henry. Might work in the first half but by end of game the pounding just wears you out. 

Might see it Wednesday against UNC. All 5 of their starters average over 30 minutes and don't go very deep at all. Also they will have played 3 games in 4 days and playing Sunday in Portland.  They will get back home late on Sunday or early Monday then have to travel to Bloomington on Tuesday.

[Seeking6]

9 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

Might see it Wednesday against UNC. All 5 of their starters average over 30 minutes and don't go very deep at all. Also they will have played 3 games in 4 days and playing Sunday in Portland.  They will get back home late on Sunday or early Monday then have to travel to Bloomington on Tuesday.

Yep. Noticed their minutes. Will be the first time I get to see it if it as important as I think it will be. Of course the depth will be a season long benefit. Hate to use the word load management for 20 year olds and I'm not saying it is crucial.... it's just nice to preserve some of the guys as the season goes along.

5-6 minutes a game over 30+ games is saving 6-7 games on the guys. Could be important down the stretch and nobody like a NBA Coach understands that. 

[Seeking6]

37 minutes ago, NCHoosier32 said:

true, but we have to see how some of these guys look vs B1G competition.  also playing devil's advocate, i would argue that i'd rather have TJD, XJ, JHS, Race, and Malik a little tired than any of our other guys fresh.  Bates and Geronimo may prove me wrong though!

Time will tell for sure. Don't forget Trey. I saw him blow by Big 10 starters last year routinely...imagine those fresh legs coming at you full steam ahead with 10 to go when the starters get a breather before final 8,etc...to your point though and I think others mentioned earlier. X doesn't tire. Kid had the same burst late today as he did early. 

[5 championships]

Who’s the guy that sits right next to coach Woodson every game but isn’t an assistant?

[IUFLA]

2 minutes ago, 5 championships said:

Who’s the guy that sits right next to coach Woodson every game but isn’t an assistant?

Armond Hill... Director of Basketball Administration 

[cthomas]

18 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

Time will tell for sure. Don't forget Trey. I saw him blow by Big 10 starters last year routinely...imagine those fresh legs coming at you full steam ahead with 10 to go when the starters get a breather before final 8,etc...to your point though and I think others mentioned earlier. X doesn't tire. Kid had the same burst late today as he did early. 

Agree completely. A good bench is a useful tool. But I've been watching a lot of games from the 80's and 90's and CBK didn't use the bench all that much. In fact, I'm not sure IT came out of any game I watched. I think we probably over value depth when everyone is healthy. Depth, however, is really important when the inevitable injuries occur. It's the difference between a season falling apart and maintaining success.

[5fouls]

1 hour ago, NCHoosier32 said:

true, but we have to see how some of these guys look vs B1G competition.  also playing devil's advocate, i would argue that i'd rather have TJD, XJ, JHS, Race, and Malik a little tired than any of our other guys fresh.  Bates and Geronimo may prove me wrong though!

I'll take a fresh Geronimo over a tired Race every day of the week and twice on Sundays.  Given that Malik is a freshman, I likely could say the same thing about him as well.  And, we need Bates to provide offense from the wing.  Galloway will not score much and JHS will be an inconsistent scorer.  

[btownqb]

22 minutes ago, cthomas said:

Agree completely. A good bench is a useful tool. But I've been watching a lot of games from the 80's and 90's and CBK didn't use the bench all that much. In fact, I'm not sure IT came out of any game I watched. I think we probably over value depth when everyone is healthy. Depth, however, is really important when the inevitable injuries occur. It's the difference between a season falling apart and maintaining success.

Do you think we have a future HOFer/NBA All Star on our current roster? A top what?.. 6 or 7 PG ever right? Top 10 for sure. 

It's pretty hard for me to go along with the idea that guys getting 35mpg+ regularly is a good way to go if the evidence says to the contrary. And ESPECIALLY with our team.. our rotation vs Xavier could not have been better. Some guys needed to play/shoot better sure.. but our guys were rested, ready to go. 

Bates, as mentioned by others, absolutely has a chance to take mins from JHS/Kopp.. we saw that today. And as mentioned before.. its the consistency thing and the def end that will get Bates more mins. 

But.. to just say "well CBK doesn't use a bench" ok, but..  our team is undoubtedly better running 9 guys, and there might just be one or two marginal roles... (end of half situation/pressure the ball situations) where Gunn will be in. 

But.. in all honesty.. the only one that's a candidate for being dropped from the rotation is JG. All the others have to play. We aren't running 7. 

It's hard for me to think this is still being brought up. 

[btownqb]

And Race is WAY better at 26-28 mpg, imo. 

[IU Scott]

3 minutes ago, btownqb said:

Do you think we have a future HOFer/NBA All Star on our current roster? A top what?.. 6 or 7 PG ever right? Top 10 for sure. 

It's pretty hard for me to go along with the idea that guys getting 35mpg+ regularly is a good way to go if the evidence says to the contrary. And ESPECIALLY with our team.. our rotation vs Xavier could not have been better. Some guys needed to play/shoot better sure.. but our guys were rested, ready to go. 

Bates, as mentioned by others, absolutely has a chance to take mins from JHS/Kopp.. we saw that today. And as mentioned before.. its the consistency thing and the def end that will get Bates more mins. 

But.. to just say "well CBK doesn't use a bench" ok, but..  our team is undoubtedly better running 9 guys, and there might just be one or two marginal roles... (end of half situation/pressure the ball situations) where Gunn will be in. 

But.. in all honesty.. the only one that's a candidate for being dropped from the rotation is JG. All the others have to play. We aren't running 7. 

It's hard for me to think this is still being brought up. 

In his example of the 81 team there was a huge drop off from our starters to the bench guys. For the most part RMK played 6 or 7 guys that year especially in the tournament. In the tournament the only times he subbed was if a guy got his 3rd foul in the first half.