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Proud2BAHoosier

So Very Sad....

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I am a gun guy.  I sit right now at my computer desk and have an AR-15 sitting in the corner.  Got a .25 handgun on top of the printer.  I sit here in my nice little world with my little lady.  Life is good.  All our kids our grown.  Got one grandchild.......she is 2.  

At this point in time I don't care what they do........I just want it to stop.  I have had enough.  Kids killing kids makes no sense to me.  

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22 minutes ago, rico said:

I am a gun guy.  I sit right now at my computer desk and have an AR-15 sitting in the corner.  Got a .25 handgun on top of the printer.  I sit here in my nice little world with my little lady.  Life is good.  All our kids our grown.  Got one grandchild.......she is 2.  

At this point in time I don't care what they do........I just want it to stop.  I have had enough.  Kids killing kids makes no sense to me.  

I'm with you. Its gotta stop one way or another. I dont care who comes up with the solution so long as kids stop getting hurt or killed. 

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On 5/25/2018 at 5:32 PM, KoB2011 said:

Given how close to home this hits for some this is an incredibly insensitive post. Not a single person has posted anything about taking away guns in relation to Noblesville yet here you are, doubling down for no goddamn reason. 

Maybe when we have a Memorial Day for kids injured and killed at schools people will have an ounce of human decency in how they talk about it  

I'm talking about solutions to prevent kids from dying and that is insensitive? Maybe if teachers / school administrators had access to firearms they wouldn't have to resort to tackling armed shooters. Not every school is going to have a teacher step up that way. They sure didn't in Parkland. I didn't say anything about taking away guns so not sure where your comment even came from. You have an FBI study showing that armed civilians can help reduce the severity of mass shootings and an example of such at a restaurant. I'm sorry if I want kids to be protected and feel safe (Students and parents in TX were in favor of schools having firearms on site). 

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9 minutes ago, Reacher said:

I'm talking about solutions to prevent kids from dying and that is insensitive? Maybe if teachers / school administrators had access to firearms they wouldn't have to resort to tackling armed shooters. Not every school is going to have a teacher step up that way. They sure didn't in Parkland. I didn't say anything about taking away guns so not sure where your comment even came from. You have an FBI study showing that armed civilians can help reduce the severity of mass shootings and an example of such at a restaurant. I'm sorry if I want kids to be protected and feel safe (Students and parents in TX were in favor of schools having firearms on site). 

Stop it, this is ridiculous. You didn't offer a solution, you threw out two links just reinforcing your viewpoint. The FBI didn't do a study and it wouldn't be their study to do; it would be the CDC. The FBI releases statistics that a far-right website took to write an article from their point of view; they don't mention that the gun lobby has prevented any actual studies into gun violence.

As for the second story, it's nothing more than anecdotal evidence that is easily dismissed. There was another story of a shooter at a restaurant that was stopped by a good guy without a gun. Neither story is worth much because they are anecdotal, but at least the one in TN (and the Noblesville shooting) prove that the line about "only a good guy with a gun can stop a bad guy with a gun" is complete BS. 

Edited by KoB2011

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5 minutes ago, KoB2011 said:

Stop it, this is ridiculous. You didn't offer a solution, you threw out two links just reinforcing your viewpoint. The FBI didn't do a study and it wouldn't be their study to do; it would be the CDC. The FBI releases statistics that a far-right website took to write an article from their point of view; they don't mention that the gun lobby has prevented any actual studies into gun violence.

As for the second story, it's nothing more than anecdotal evidence that is easily dismissed. There was another story of a shooter at a restaurant that was stopped by a good guy without a gun. Neither story is worth much because they are anecdotal, but at least the one in TN (and the Noblesville shooting) prove that the line about "only a good guy with a gun can stop a bad guy with a gun" is complete BS. 

I did offer a solution. Many solutions. Better school security, more proactive monitoring/ outreach by school mental health professionals, more responsibility from gun owners and yes- access to firearms by school personnel. I'm sorry if FBI Statistics back up that latter claim. Maybe you shouldn't be so quick to dismiss actual facts and instances as "anecdotal". Not everyone is willing to "easily dismiss" such facts. Schools all around the country now have increased security including metal detectors and armed school personnel and you do not hear about those schools having mass shooter incidents. Maybe there is a correlation? 

I regulary read from far left and right websites as well as everything in between and have quoted countless articles from both in this thread, don't be so quick to dismiss something you do not agree with because it comes from a website you label a certain way. 

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42 minutes ago, Reacher said:

I did offer a solution. Many solutions. Better school security, more proactive monitoring/ outreach by school mental health professionals, more responsibility from gun owners and yes- access to firearms by school personnel. I'm sorry if FBI Statistics back up that latter claim. Maybe you shouldn't be so quick to dismiss actual facts and instances as "anecdotal". Not everyone is willing to "easily dismiss" such facts. Schools all around the country now have increased security including metal detectors and armed school personnel and you do not hear about those schools having mass shooter incidents. Maybe there is a correlation? 

I regulary read from far left and right websites as well as everything in between and have quoted countless articles from both in this thread, don't be so quick to dismiss something you do not agree with because it comes from a website you label a certain way. 

4

The FBI statistics aren't a study; the gun lobby has made it illegal for an actual study to take place. So yeah, it is easy to dismiss something that wasn't an actual study from a far-right source. I, personally, interpret the FBI statistics much different than the far-right National Review. The FBI doesn't offer analysis, because it wasn't a study. 

The second article was anecdotal evidence. I'm not sure how anyone that understands what that is could argue otherwise. 

All your previous posts in this thread have nothing to do with the lack of tact in that post. 

 

EDIT: To be clear, I don't have a problem with your other posts in this thread. I disagree with many of them obviously, but don't have a problem with them. 

Edited by KoB2011

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I can't speak for every state.  But around me the school districts are in financial trouble.  People are way over taxed the way it is.  Some if this stuff just ain't gonna work when we talk money.

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I'm against arming teachers as a solution to this crisis.  You can't arm and train them all, so the shooter will simply choose a classroom where the teacher is not armed.  And, it unnecessarily brings yet another weapon to someplace that should be totally free of weapons in the first place.

Real change involves taking measures to prevent armed perpetrators from getting onto school grounds (simply keeping them out of the building is not enough, with all of the common areas that exist outside the building itself).

  • Better identification of warning signs
  • Prosecute those that purchase the guns for, or make the guns available to, those that commit these crimes
  • Security checkpoints at the school entrance.
  • Education of the student to help prevent bullying

 

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1 hour ago, rico said:

I can't speak for every state.  But around me the school districts are in financial trouble.  People are way over taxed the way it is.  Some if this stuff just ain't gonna work when we talk money.

We have State and Federal governments full of lawmakers in both political parties that need to stop funding 'pork' and use that money to help fix this crisis.  Lack of money is not a valid excuse when kids are getting slaughtered.

 

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1 hour ago, rico said:

I can't speak for every state.  But around me the school districts are in financial trouble.  People are way over taxed the way it is.  Some if this stuff just ain't gonna work when we talk money.

I was talking about that with someone over the weekend. It's amazing the disparity among states in teachers pay . In some areas they are vastly overpaid (I personally know a retired teacher collecting $200k+ pension- that's overpaid IMO) and in some woefully underpaid.

Don't tell me that even poor districts could not get a retired police or military vet to randomly volunteer a few hours at a school. If you had a dozen people, you would only need a few hours per week per person. Could always offer tax breaks to entice more people if necessary. Combine that with some state / federal grants to cover a metal detector and other measures. Its all about priorities. Where there is a will, there is a way.

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3 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

I'm against arming teachers as a solution to this crisis.  You can't arm and train them all, so the shooter will simply choose a classroom where the teacher is not armed.  And, it unnecessarily brings yet another weapon to someplace that should be totally free of weapons in the first place.

Real change involves taking measures to prevent armed perpetrators from getting onto school grounds (simply keeping them out of the building is not enough, with all of the common areas that exist outside the building itself).

  • Better identification of warning signs
  • Prosecute those that purchase the guns for, or make the guns available to, those that commit these crimes
  • Security checkpoints at the school entrance.
  • Education of the student to help prevent bullying

 

I'm with you on all of the above except arming teachers. I think every district should decide what works best for them. Maybe its arming teachers, coaches, administrators. Some probably already have some level of training. If the gun was kept locked in a biometric safe in a desk or otherwise located through the school, students would not know exactly where they are located (or be able to gain access to them). If students knew people were armed, it would be a deterrent. It would be best if they didn't know who was.  If the guns don't make it in to the school, no issue. If they do, even having a gun - even in just the school office will be a quicker response than the police. 

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31 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

We have State and Federal governments full of lawmakers in both political parties that need to stop funding 'pork' and use that money to help fix this crisis.  Lack of money is not a valid excuse when kids are getting slaughtered.

 

No it is not, but sadly that is the way it is.  Makes me want to puke.  We gotta a problem here that needs to be resolved quickly.  And it appears that nobody is concerned other than the people on this board.

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