The tip of the iceburg for Underwood ?

[Seeking6]

2 things. First and what was very apparent to most fans is the team Groce had was just brutal. That was the amazing part they kept bringing him back year after year. Look where their BIG 10 players are headed? Second...I have no problem with a coach taking over a team and booting kids in year 1. The idiots on their boards still use the term creaning but as always...most Illini hoops fans are about 10 years late.

The biggest issue Underwood will have is recruiting Mr. Illinois (deserved or not is a different conversation), hyping his 4/5 star talents....and basically failing with him. Whether player or coach deserves more of the blame is the larger question...but Underwood will have to battle other coaches who actually recruit against Illinois (joke I know) reminding recruit and his family what happened there. It does and will cause concern.

Anyway. I'll reiterate what I said in this and other threads. See the Illini in 2020 at the earliest. 

[addictedtoIU]

22 minutes ago, FKIM01 said:

Vanderbilt goes from competing with IU and Kansas to losing to Grand Canyon State.

{chuckle}

Vandy had some joy competing against IU and KU. 10-minute fame was over. Now back to the abyss. 

[milehiiu]

35 minutes ago, FKIM01 said:

Vanderbilt goes from competing with IU and Kansas to losing to Grand Canyon State.

{chuckle}

 

At least one Vandy fan has an explanation as to why Finke, snubbed Vanderbilt.

Check the first post on page 2 :

Michael Finke visiting Vandy tomorrow for an official 

[Zuckerkorn]

40 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

2 things. First and what was very apparent to most fans is the team Groce had was just brutal. That was the amazing part they kept bringing him back year after year. Look where their BIG 10 players are headed? Second...I have no problem with a coach taking over a team and booting kids in year 1. The idiots on their boards still use the term creaning but as always...most Illini hoops fans are about 10 years late.

The biggest issue Underwood will have is recruiting Mr. Illinois (deserved or not is a different conversation), hyping his 4/5 star talents....and basically failing with him. Whether player or coach deserves more of the blame is the larger question...but Underwood will have to battle other coaches who actually recruit against Illinois (joke I know) reminding recruit and his family what happened there. It does and will cause concern.

Anyway. I'll reiterate what I said in this and other threads. See the Illini in 2020 at the earliest. 

Since things are a little slow in the IU Universe today (calm before the storms), I ventured over to the UI 247 site.  In the thread about Vesel, in almost every post they refer to the situation as "if this was a creaning" or "creaning or not" - they can't even accept the fact that this type of thing happens everywhere.  The old "shoe on the other foot" kind of deal.

[Seeking6]

15 minutes ago, Zuckerkorn said:

Since things are a little slow in the IU Universe today (calm before the storms), I ventured over to the UI 247 site.  In the thread about Vesel, in almost every post they refer to the situation as "if this was a creaning" or "creaning or not" - they can't even accept the fact that this type of thing happens everywhere.  The old "shoe on the other foot" kind of deal.

Yep...about 10 years late on most things. I had to stop reading some of their boards. Became almost scary to read what some typed about Bruce or Groce or now Underwood....beat goes on. With that said I know a few of those guys/posters and some are very dialed in but in Illinois fashion it's Chicago vs Downstate arguments on everything. That's why the Mark Smith transfer really hurt a core there. He was the downstate kid who was going to help start the new era....and he jetted as quickly as he could to a rival no less.

[milehiiu]

50 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

Yep...about 10 years late on most things. I had to stop reading some of their boards. Became almost scary to read what some typed about Bruce or Groce or now Underwood....beat goes on. With that said I know a few of those guys/posters and some are very dialed in but in Illinois fashion it's Chicago vs Downstate arguments on everything. That's why the Mark Smith transfer really hurt a core there. He was the downstate kid who was going to help start the new era....and he jetted as quickly as he could to a rival no less.

People in Michigan have a name for people from Chicago. 

[BruceDouglas]

On 4/17/2018 at 5:30 PM, Jerry Lundergaard said:

Respect a poster from another fan base who comes here and joins in respectful conversation.

That said, sorta lost me with the statement "Mizzou is a lower level program " as compared to the basketball power that is the Illini

Heh, I didn't word that very well, although it is accurate that Mizzou is below Illinois in the pecking order. Yes, they managed to get to the dance last year and we didn't, but we've dominated the Braggin' Rights game and have been the better program over time.

On 4/26/2018 at 9:07 AM, milehiiu said:

Underwood loses another one :

Vesel leaving Illini 

Don't know why they ever signed this kid, he was clearly lost at this level. I guess they had an open spot and took a chance, but it was a poor move.

On 4/26/2018 at 9:22 AM, FKIM01 said:

The move to quickly and aggressively hire Underwood is looking questionable to say the least.

How so? Seems a bit overboard to make any judgement after just one season.

[BruceDouglas]

Sorry for the duplicates, after submitting a post I was left in the edit mode so assumed it didn't work.

[milehiiu]

^^^ Bruce.  Always good to hear from you.  As far as Vesel.... well... Crean had more than his share of those types, and without naming names.... had us all scratching our heads. All I can say, is in the quest to find the diamond in the rough.... a coach occasionally is going to find coal, instead of a diamond.

I would say that Oladipo was that diamond in the rough, for Crean.... which caused him to continue to look out for others.

[BruceDouglas]

Sure, but I'm guessing Crean actually saw Oladipo play before signing him, right?

[milehiiu]

3 minutes ago, BruceDouglas said:

Sure, but I'm guessing Crean actually saw Oladipo play before signing him, right?

True.  However, many IU fans... and one in particular dissed on Victor... while seeing him dunking balls at an IU frat house in the Summer before starting his Freshman year. Others jumped on board, questioning Vic's overall BB ability, as well as BB I.Q.

[FKIM01]

13 minutes ago, BruceDouglas said:

How so? Seems a bit overboard to make any judgement after just one season.

He may turn out OK but that seemed to be a really quick hire based on a limited track record as a power 5 head coach. Bruce Weber has a history of starting strong at a new school and them flaming out on the recruiting trail. Just makes me wonder if it was as good a hire as was originally thought.

[milehiiu]

26 minutes ago, FKIM01 said:

He may turn out OK but that seemed to be a really quick hire based on a limited track record as a power 5 head coach. Bruce Weber has a history of starting strong at a new school and them flaming out on the recruiting trail. Just makes me wonder if it was as good a hire as was originally thought.

I think Underwood is an improvement over Groce.  Whether  Underwood flames out...well, that is up to Illinois to decide.  And yes... unlike Weber... Underwood did not start out very good.  But he did pull off one win against IU.  So there is that.  Jury is still out on Underwood, IMHO.  While in contrast... it looks to me that the IU fan base is fully bought in to Archie.... despite a similar, but better lackluster first year, compared to Underwood. 

[Seeking6]

Growing up in Illinois I have roughly a couple dozen friends who are either alumni or fans. I can say this unequivocally.  Fan apathy is as low as I've ever seen with them. Many don't even go to games anymore, turn down free tickets....and genuinely make fun of all things Illinois related. Couple still holding out. My point is this. Because of last few years with Bubbles and Groce being a guy who never should have been hired...Underwood has to hit it and hit it quick. Smith gave them hope last summer. 4/5 star recruit, Mr. Illinois,etc..... After one season people are saying the same again. 

I realize this is just one little area of the city, suburbs and others scattered from NYC to LA...but Underwood unfortunately doesn't have a normal time table. Just my opinion. 

 

[milehiiu]

5 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

Growing up in Illinois I have roughly a couple dozen friends who are either alumni or fans. I can say this unequivocally.  Fan apathy is as low as I've ever seen with them. Many don't even go to games anymore, turn down free tickets....and genuinely make fun of all things Illinois related. Couple still holding out. My point is this. Because of last few years with Bubbles and Groce being a guy who never should have been hired...Underwood has to hit it and hit it quick. Smith gave them hope last summer. 4/5 star recruit, Mr. Illinois,etc..... After one season people are saying the same again. 

I realize this is just one little area of the city, suburbs and others scattered from NYC to LA...but Underwood unfortunately doesn't have a normal time table. Just my opinion. 

 

Illini fans don't have  anything to hang their hat on, right now.  BB sucked.  And FB was even worse.  Lovie, to me has been a major disappointment. I really expected much more from him.

Still... can't feel sorry for them.  Due to the way they treated us, after the Gordon defection.... and Crean's empty cupboard, his first couple of years.  Mega thread on the old Scout board, titled "laughing at IU" by Clockwork Loonie, is something I will never get over.  Plus the many vile P.M's I got for years from Illinois fans, when I was moderating John Decker's Hoosier Nation at that time, only reinforces in my mind as to why Michiganders have a three letter word for people from Illinois.

[Seeking6]

6 minutes ago, milehiiu said:

Illini fans don't have  anything to hang their hat on, right now.  BB sucked.  And FB was even worse.  Lovie, to me has been a major disappointment. I really expected much more from him.

Still... can't feel sorry for them.  Due to the way they treated us, after the Gordon defection.... and Crean's empty cupboard, his first couple of years.  Mega thread on the old Scout board, titled "laughing at IU" by Clockwork Loonie, is something I will never get over.  Plus the many vile P.M's I got for years from Illinois fans, when I was moderating John Decker's Hoosier Nation at that time, only reinforces in my mind as to why Michiganders have a three letter word for people from Illinois.

All day long Mile. Clockwork still has to be in some asylum muttering Kelvin to himself and Gordon to himself. Won't ever feel sorry for any of them for that 4 year window. I've been tempted a couple of times to throw some information out about the Illini but given some of the lunacy....I've always decided to keep it off the boards. Some of their legends aren't pure is all I'll say. 

[rico]

If there is a true sleeping giant in this country........it is Illinois.

[Seeking6]

1 hour ago, rico said:

If there is a true sleeping giant in this country........it is Illinois.

Actually given our 20 years...I think it's us. Illinois could return to being good again but so many factors in play. Chicago namely being the biggest. Rival AAU coaches don't get along and won't ever allow multiple kids to go and play for Illinois at same time without threatening the coach. Example this past year. Ayo and THT.

 

 

[rico]

17 hours ago, Seeking6 said:

Actually given our 20 years...I think it's us. Illinois could return to being good again but so many factors in play. Chicago namely being the biggest. Rival AAU coaches don't get along and won't ever allow multiple kids to go and play for Illinois at same time without threatening the coach. Example this past year. Ayo and THT.

 

 

Can't disagree with you, but if Illinois does get that Chicago pipeline going they will become a force and in a hurry.  

[Seeking6]

1 hour ago, rico said:

Can't disagree with you, but if Illinois does get that Chicago pipeline going they will become a force and in a hurry.  

Yep. Always been that way. Only thing now..if every recruit from Chicago starts heading to Champaign the NCAA will be on I-74 West pretty fast. Not saying all of Chicago nor all of it's players, coaches,etc are on the take....plenty of great kids/coaches from the area. But the high end recruits typically have some baggage to come with it. If all of those recruits start heading to UI...it's a sign somethings up.

[rico]

3 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

Yep. Always been that way. Only thing now..if every recruit from Chicago starts heading to Champaign the NCAA will be on I-74 West pretty fast. Not saying all of Chicago nor all of it's players, coaches,etc are on the take....plenty of great kids/coaches from the area. But the high end recruits typically have some baggage to come with it. If all of those recruits start heading to UI...it's a sign somethings up.

You mean to tell me that Chicago is even corrupt when it comes to basketball?  LOL

[milehiiu]

Francis Okoro, 4-star center, picks Oregon over Illinois and Purdue

[BobSaccamanno]

If I were Illinois (a school that doesn't bother me), I'd recruit (a) suburbs of Chicago; (b) Catholic league kids of Chicago; (c) downstate Illinois; (d) Indiana.  As for public league Chicago kids, I'd make exceptions like, say, Jabari Parker types where I am comfortable, but I would really focus more on the other categories.  

[Seeking6]

15 hours ago, BobSaccamanno said:

If I were Illinois (a school that doesn't bother me), I'd recruit (a) suburbs of Chicago; (b) Catholic league kids of Chicago; (c) downstate Illinois; (d) Indiana.  As for public league Chicago kids, I'd make exceptions like, say, Jabari Parker types where I am comfortable, but I would really focus more on the other categories.  

They've recruited A and B since the beginning of time. Depending on a few factors and who was the coach....determined their success.  Regarding C. Everyone has a different definition of downstate. Natives of Chicago think downstate is South of I-80. But for this discussion I'll assume you mean Peoria, B-N, and other SOIL schools....I think the university has had 1 maybe 2 players from Indiana that chose Illinois. Groce tried again. Not worth the resources in my opinion given the colossal failures over the last 40 years.

Biggest issue with Illinois much like us they keep making bad hires or aren't getting rid of the guys soon enough. Any AD with vision/leadership can tell when a program is heading South. Weber should have been fired earlier. Groce never should have been hired. Jury is out on Underwood. There are days when I think he might have something in 1-2 years....and days where I realize how bad the Illini were last year and that program has been.

[rico]

1 hour ago, Seeking6 said:

They've recruited A and B since the beginning of time. Depending on a few factors and who was the coach....determined their success.  Regarding C. Everyone has a different definition of downstate. Natives of Chicago think downstate is South of I-80. But for this discussion I'll assume you mean Peoria, B-N, and other SOIL schools....I think the university has had 1 maybe 2 players from Indiana that chose Illinois. Groce tried again. Not worth the resources in my opinion given the colossal failures over the last 40 years.

Biggest issue with Illinois much like us they keep making bad hires or aren't getting rid of the guys soon enough. Any AD with vision/leadership can tell when a program is heading South. Weber should have been fired earlier. Groce never should have been hired. Jury is out on Underwood. There are days when I think he might have something in 1-2 years....and days where I realize how bad the Illini were last year and that program has been.

I would be curious as to exactly how many Indiana kids went to Illinois?  I actually can  only think of one and he wasn't there long.  Scott Haffner.