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milehiiu

Does Archie get one more "honeymoon" year .....

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There were too many surprising turns this season to overcome.  Rob Johnson: inconsistent; guard play in general disappointing; DeRon injury, Collin battling injury; poor 3pt shooting and free throws.  Some of this will go away naturally and some will need to be overcome.   Really, really like class coming in and am not concerned about the freshman shrinking.  Still think back to Jay Edwards as a freshman.  Fearless, and the same way on the road.  

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What exactly does honeymoon mean?  I think most IU fans will have increased expectations as Archie recruits, coaches, manages the IU program.  I would imagine that he expects improvement also.  That means better offense, defense...better record.  I don't believe he will accept anything less.

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Archie's smart enough to know that while people understand it takes a year or two to get your guys in, recruit who you want,etc....he also should understand we are a fan base that has been quite honestly patient enough. 

1) Started with Knight in late 90's. Teams faded every year.

2) Davis was never the answer. Our AD showed zero leadership by naming him head coach. Gave us obvious great run in 2002. His tenure ended in bickering. 

3) Sampson would have won big. Couldn't get out of his own way.

4) Crean took over Chernobyl. Gave out early ships that he shouldn't have to just get a team out there. Never should take until year 4 to produce. Missed his window vs Cuse and many gave up at that time.

My point is this. Should Archie get another year? Yes...but we as fans have been pissed off for about 20 years minus 2-3 seasons. Archie doesn't have the luxury of patient fan base. I think he gets that. 

We get Romeo and Morgan comes back. I see 22-23 win team and as another poster said we are on our way. We miss on Romeo and Morgan leaves. People will be testy. No fault of Archie. People will come calling for AD Glass.

 

Edited by Seeking6

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24 minutes ago, milehiiu said:

....or not ?  

Discuss.  Explanations would be welcome as well. 

I think any new coach should get at least 4 years before they are really judged on how they are performing.  Give them one recruiting cycle where that coach has all of his players playing and then judge him.

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If Morgan comes back and we get Romeo, we need to be an NCAA team. If Morgan comes back and we don't get Romeo, still need to be a NCAA team. If Morgan leaves and we don't get Romeo, NCAA appearance would be tough.

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Like it or not, if CAM lands RL, then I don't think he'll get much of one next season. RL will raise expectations immensely and if our team wins don't meet or exceed expectations then CAM would be the focus of most of the criticism. 

As HTD pointed out somewhere, CAM exceeded expectations this season based on writer's B1G projections, but some fans were disappointed anyway. The number of disappointed fans would grow if we don't meet/exceed expectations with RL on campus for a limited time.

The good thing is that if we add RL to our recruiting class and returning players, I really believe IU/CAM will have a great year and the honeymoon won't be needed anyway.

If we don't get RL, expectations will be lower and the chance of a 2nd year honeymoon increases. I still think IU/CAM will meet/exceed those expectations and won't need a honeymoon in that scenario either.

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Next year should just be better.  No home losses to teams we should destroy.  Better than average Conference play.  Make the Tourney.

Year 3, we better be competing for B1G title and shooting for S16 or better in Tourney

Yeah 4 we need to be competing for Final 4s

Year 5, hang that banner (not realistic but what we should hope for) 

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i think that all depends on what we call honeymoon.  #1 talent matters.  is Morgan back?  does Romero come?  i personally don't even know that i call this a honeymoon season because i don't think we underachieved.  as long as i see improvement and better basketball, i am good.  of course i would love to see us in the big dance, but if we don't have Morgan or Romeo, that probably just isn't a fair expectation.

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I expect to see an improvement from last year. If we have a mass exodus of players this year and are mostly freshmen then my expectations will adjust accordingly but still expect to be more consistant than this year. 

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I honestly think our floor is the NCAA next year, I think that is fair if Morgan comes back.  With Romeo I think maybe 2nd weekend, but it honestly all depends on how the season goes.

I want to see our effort and defense like it was during the 2nd half of big ten play, from the start of the season.    

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1 hour ago, IU Scott said:

I think any new coach should get at least 4 years before they are really judged on how they are performing.  Give them one recruiting cycle where that coach has all of his players playing and then judge him.

This. You have to give this kind of thing at least 4 years, assuming we don't pull a Pitt sometime in the next 3 years. Culture takes time to change.

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I don't think he will need it.  Based on what I see coming in minus any unexpected departures, the team should be tournament ready and pointed in the right direction next year.  I can see that the defensive mindset has been established.  C'mon shooters!!

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Honeymoon?  I've had 9 of them.  They are overrated.

Seriously.  There should be no honeymoon period for Archie.  The program is not in the kind of shape it was when Crean took over.   This is not a major rebuild.

Archie has a team worthy of making the NCAA  next year with or without Romeo.  And, if he loses Romeo to Vandy, I think it's fair to ask why.  

I will never expect a championship.  But the team should be capable of making the Sweet 16 every year.  No excuses.

 

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No, simply because we’re not that far from becoming a solid team. 

We should expect to finish top 5 in the B1G next season, given what teams ahead of us are losing and what teams behind us have coming in. That’s reasonable. Not to mention some addition by subtraction. We’re going to miss the occasional RoJo. Definitely won’t miss Newkirk, an injured Hartman, stone hand Freddie, and last but not least...a guy that took 4 years worth of scholarships in Priller, but didn’t contribute at all.

Our incoming class is under the radar good. If we land Romeo, a top 5 or 6 class. If Juwan returns and Romeo is in the fold... it would be a shame for that team to not get past the first weekend of the NCAA’s.

Now, season number three is where I see Archie making his move, especially if Romeo isn’t a one and done. We could potentially bring in a pair of 5 Star bigs that would give us a dangerous combination in both the front and backcourt alike.

Just licking my chops... 

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6 hours ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

Next year should just be better.  No home losses to teams we should destroy.  Better than average Conference play.  Make the Tourney.

Year 3, we better be competing for B1G title and shooting for S16 or better in Tourney

Yeah 4 we need to be competing for Final 4s

Year 5, hang that banner (not realistic but what we should hope for) 

Agree except maybe better than just make the tourney next year if Morgan and Romeo are here.

 

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2 hours ago, 5fouls said:

Honeymoon?  I've had 9 of them.  They are overrated.

Seriously.  There should be no honeymoon period for Archie.  The program is not in the kind of shape it was when Crean took over.   This is not a major rebuild.

Archie has a team worthy of making the NCAA  next year with or without Romeo.  And, if he loses Romeo to Vandy, I think it's fair to ask why.  

I will never expect a championship.  But the team should be capable of making the Sweet 16 every year.  No excuses.

 

I agree mostly but next year’s roster is still in flux and in regards to Romeo I think it’s important to remember that a year ago Romeo had no interest in indiana. Archie has outlasted some big time programs to be in the top 3 and has almost no natural advantages. Being on the north side of the Ohio river is about the only natural connection. I feel like Archie built the relationship with romeo from scratch.

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7 minutes ago, mchenry34 said:

 I feel like Archie built the relationship with romeo from scratch.

That he did.  And I am going to add some more fuel to the fire.  This past week, I was informed that Archie received a call from NA.  And the person making the call was not Tim.

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I wouldn't call it a "honeymoon" year next year, but I would opine that at least until year 3, we need to give him some latitude to do his job. That said, I do expect that we make a big jump next year with or without Romeo and/or Juwan. Part of the mythos surrounding him, and no doubt one of the reasons Glass made Archie his pick, was his ability to do so much with so little at Dayton. At the very least, I would think the IU faithful would like to see that kind of magic happen in Bloomington sooner rather than later. I don't think it's a make or break year for CAM, but it will tell us a lot about how hard he'll have to work to make the jump to the big leagues. 

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7 hours ago, cybergates said:

Like it or not, if CAM lands RL, then I don't think he'll get much of one next season. RL will raise expectations immensely and if our team wins don't meet or exceed expectations then CAM would be the focus of most of the criticism. 

As HTD pointed out somewhere, CAM exceeded expectations this season based on writer's B1G projections, but some fans were disappointed anyway. The number of disappointed fans would grow if we don't meet/exceed expectations with RL on campus for a limited time.

The good thing is that if we add RL to our recruiting class and returning players, I really believe IU/CAM will have a great year and the honeymoon won't be needed anyway.

If we don't get RL, expectations will be lower and the chance of a 2nd year honeymoon increases. I still think IU/CAM will meet/exceed those expectations and won't need a honeymoon in that scenario either.

While getting RL does increase everyone's expectations (myself included)...our ceiling increases dramatically for him to have "big time" success. As a fan, in general I'd want a deep run (getting past the Sweet 16 at least once everyone recruiting cycle). If he gets past that next year, then that puts a little less pressure on him the following years. So, yes, while I agree our expectations need to increase as a fanbase because the talent is there, I'm also not going to penalize him for landing RL. Seems a bit backwards to punish CAM for succeeding in the Romeo sweepstakes.

Looking at a high level, I don't care as much when he picks up these "big win" years (while remaining top 5 or so in the conference in down years), but they need to happen somewhat consistently for me as a fan to remain happy with him. Seems like a perfect opportunity for CAM to capitalize next year if we land RL.

Side note, I think our team is GOOD on paper if we land RL. Throw out a tandem of Juwan and RL with a strong supporting cast against anyone and I like our chances.

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32 minutes ago, milehiiu said:

That he did.  And I am going to add some more fuel to the fire.  This past week, I was informed that Archie received a call from NA.  And the person making the call was not Tim.

Is this good or bad?

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