Jump to content

Peegs Preseason B1G Rankings


Recommended Posts

9 minutes ago, KoB2011 said:

We do return three key players from a Big Ten title team. Sure, it wasn't last year but why is that less valuable experience than what some of the other returners in the conference have?

I think our issue last year was coaching and chemistry more than. Anything, assuming those are addressed then what is actually better about these teams, sans MSU? 

Wisconsin's best player is a liability at the end of the game. 

Iowa's sophomores seem impressive, but life gets hard when you don't have a 20 PPG guy. 

Purdue is similar. They've got some nice role players, but Caleb Swanigan made everyone much better. And let's be real, Matt Painter has shown when he doesn't have players competing for CPOTY his teams are average. Anyone really think Vince Edwards can carry Purdue to a high level like Swanigan, Johnson or Moore? I sure don't. 

Michigan lost as much as we did two years ago. Unless the kid from UK can pick up where Walton left off that was a huge loss from a team that really wasn't that good most of the season anyway. 

Northwestern will be tough, but surely no one actually thinks they have better talent? If Archie was the right hire over a guy like Collins, then he should have us playing greater than the sum of our parts much like Collins does. Only our parts are better than theirs. 

 

This team has experience, toughness and they're hungry. We will finish top 3 in conference. 

I think the toughness and hunger of the team remains to be seen.  The off-season talk is all well and good, but it's just talk.  After the way last season went down, I'll believe it when I see it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 84
  • Created
  • Last Reply
1 hour ago, KoB2011 said:

We do return three key players from a Big Ten title team. Sure, it wasn't last year but why is that less valuable experience than what some of the other returners in the conference have?

I think our issue last year was coaching and chemistry more than. Anything, assuming those are addressed then what is actually better about these teams, sans MSU? 

Wisconsin's best player is a liability at the end of the game. 

Iowa's sophomores seem impressive, but life gets hard when you don't have a 20 PPG guy. 

Purdue is similar. They've got some nice role players, but Caleb Swanigan made everyone much better. And let's be real, Matt Painter has shown when he doesn't have players competing for CPOTY his teams are average. Anyone really think Vince Edwards can carry Purdue to a high level like Swanigan, Johnson or Moore? I sure don't. 

Michigan lost as much as we did two years ago. Unless the kid from UK can pick up where Walton left off that was a huge loss from a team that really wasn't that good most of the season anyway. 

Northwestern will be tough, but surely no one actually thinks they have better talent? If Archie was the right hire over a guy like Collins, then he should have us playing greater than the sum of our parts much like Collins does. Only our parts are better than theirs. 

 

This team has experience, toughness and they're hungry. We will finish top 3 in conference. 

Not sure why you're discounting Purdue so much here. Purdue has 4 players that are capable of making the All B1G team. I'd say that's better than having "some nice role players." Sure we lost Swanigan and that will be hard to replace but we increased our athleticism and our senior class is very talented. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, FW_Hoosier said:

I think the toughness and hunger of the team remains to be seen.  The off-season talk is all well and good, but it's just talk.  After the way last season went down, I'll believe it when I see it.

That applies to literally every team in the country. There are countless, and I do mean countless, examples of teams going from tough and hungry one year to weak minded the next and vice versa. Question that about us if you must, but then don't ascribe those attributes to other teams in counting them ahead of us. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 minutes ago, Stlboiler23 said:

Not sure why you're discounting Purdue so much here. Purdue has 4 players that are capable of making the All B1G team. I'd say that's better than having "some nice role players." Sure we lost Swanigan and that will be hard to replace but we increased our athleticism and our senior class is very talented. 

Not sure I discounted Purdue in the least, but the fact remains Painter has a poor track record with this type of team. 

It somewhat amazes me that you don't understand how you don't understand the impact Swanigan had on everyone else. Purdue was really good last year because of Caleb Swanigan, you get that right? I'm not saying Purdue is going to suck but I do not see them as an elite team in the conference. 

You have Purdue 3 and IU 8, what about those rosters makes you think Purdue is a top 3 team and IU is a bottom half team? Do you think Painter is the type of coach that can elevate a roster lacking a player with elite talent? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, KoB2011 said:

Not sure I discounted Purdue in the least, but the fact remains Painter has a poor track record with this type of team. 

It somewhat amazes me that you don't understand how you don't understand the impact Swanigan had on everyone else. Purdue was really good last year because of Caleb Swanigan, you get that right? I'm not saying Purdue is going to suck but I do not see them as an elite team in the conference. 

You have Purdue 3 and IU 8, what about those rosters makes you think Purdue is a top 3 team and IU is a bottom half team? Do you think Painter is the type of coach that can elevate a roster lacking a player with elite talent? 

 

I do understand the impact Swanigan had and his loss will be a big one. That being said, I still really like our roster. Our senior class has won a lot of games and has some really good talent. In terms of comparing IU to Purdue, I like our starters better and think they're a more talented unit. 

Haas> Davis. I like Davis and think he will be a stud but Haas impacts games like no one else in the league can. 

Vince>Morgan- I think Vince is the better all-around player. He shoots better and is a better offensive player. I like him better than Morgan. 

Mathias>Hartman- Hartman is obviously a question mark coming off of injury but even if he was healthy, I'd give the nod to Mathias. He's a better all-around player than Collin because of his shooting, passing, and defensive abilities. 

Carsen>Johnson- I think Carsen is poised to have a breakout year and Johnson was very disappointing last year. I think this is a close one but I like Carsen better. He's going to be a stud. 

PJ=Newkirk. I think they're pretty equivalent. Newkirk had a solid year but PJ is just so solid. Doesn't turn it over and can really shoot. 

 

As far as the bench, you guys have a better one more than likely but I'll take our starting 5 over yours any day of the week. I think that's the biggest difference. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wisconsin has found a way to finish in the top 4 of the Big Ten for a few years now ! However, when I look at their current roster , I see only ONE SENIOR and HE IS A WALK ON !!!!!!!!!! The Badgers have usually had A few Senior Scholarshipped players when they have finished in the TOP 4 ! I just can't see them finishing ahead of The Hoosiers this season ! ONLY time will tell !! Pee yew has a good team !! But , I question whether they will be as good against Big Ten Teams this season as they have looked against teams like The UNITED ARAB STATES , VERY BIG GRIN !! I certainly believe that he Big Ten Teams will be much better than the teams pee yew have played thus far[ in the World University games] !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I could be wrong , but I think the Hoosiers will finish in the TOP 5 of the B10 ?? At any rate , it looks like another tough CONFERENCE  RACE in 2017-2018 !! MUCK THE BOILERS !1 BANNERS UP-BOILER DOWN !!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

46 minutes ago, KoB2011 said:

Not sure I discounted Purdue in the least, but the fact remains Painter has a poor track record with this type of team. 

It somewhat amazes me that you don't understand how you don't understand the impact Swanigan had on everyone else. Purdue was really good last year because of Caleb Swanigan, you get that right? I'm not saying Purdue is going to suck but I do not see them as an elite team in the conference. 

You have Purdue 3 and IU 8, what about those rosters makes you think Purdue is a top 3 team and IU is a bottom half team? Do you think Painter is the type of coach that can elevate a roster lacking a player with elite talent? 

Can't overstate how bad Painter is.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

PURDUE lost a ton in losing BIGGIE !!- However ,I think basketball fans are missing the point on what else pu lost from last season's roster . Basil Smotherman transferred  away and he was a very good bench player ! They also lost some back up EXPERIENCE at the guard position !! pee yew will be good in 2017-2018 !! I just don't think they will be as good as they were last year ? Carson Edwards surprised me last year ! He was better as a Freshman than I expected him to be ! That could happen with another pu freshman [or 2 ] this season ! OF COURSE , that is always the X FACTOR when making predictions   about a team ! That is ::HOW WELL WILL THE NEWCOMERS PLAY(Or how much improvement the returning players show from the previous season)NO one really knows !! One can only GUESS [or hope] until the games actually begin !!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

44 minutes ago, hoosiertildeath said:

PURDUE lost a ton in losing BIGGIE !!- However ,I think basketball fans are missing the point on what else pu lost from last season's roster . Basil Smotherman transferred  away and he was a very good bench player ! They also lost some back up EXPERIENCE at the guard position !! pee yew will be good in 2017-2018 !! I just don't think they will be as good as they were last year ? Carson Edwards surprised me last year ! He was better as a Freshman than I expected him to be ! That could happen with another pu freshman [or 2 ] this season ! OF COURSE , that is always the X FACTOR when making predictions   about a team ! That is ::HOW WELL WILL THE NEWCOMERS PLAY(Or how much improvement the returning players show from the previous season)NO one really knows !! One can only GUESS [or hope] until the games actually begin !!

 

Smotherman was not a "very good bench player." He was average at best and we won't miss him. Biggie was the only loss (yes a huge one) but losing Spike and Basil isn't a big deal. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, KoB2011 said:

Northwestern will be tough, but surely no one actually thinks they have better talent? If Archie was the right hire over a guy like Collins, then he should have us playing greater than the sum of our parts much like Collins does. Only our parts are better than theirs.

Talent wise...no. But Northwestern plays better team ball.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I personally think this year is gonna be a good year to see coaches actually coach instead of relying on talent overall. Besides Michigan St anybody this year can come in second place....but Michigan St is only one injury(hate to even say that) or a issue preventing a player to play to being a middle of the pack team this year. I know the league isn't as strong as it has been in years past but this is also gonna be a exciting year to watch. I'm throwing a prediction out now (probably gonna get hell for this) but there is a good chance CAM will get B1G COY this year if he finishes 2nd or 3rd. That's if all the cards align right......

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Stlboiler23 said:

 

I do understand the impact Swanigan had and his loss will be a big one. That being said, I still really like our roster. Our senior class has won a lot of games and has some really good talent. In terms of comparing IU to Purdue, I like our starters better and think they're a more talented unit. 

Haas> Davis. I like Davis and think he will be a stud but Haas impacts games like no one else in the league can. 

Vince>Morgan- I think Vince is the better all-around player. He shoots better and is a better offensive player. I like him better than Morgan. 

Mathias>Hartman- Hartman is obviously a question mark coming off of injury but even if he was healthy, I'd give the nod to Mathias. He's a better all-around player than Collin because of his shooting, passing, and defensive abilities. 

Carsen>Johnson- I think Carsen is poised to have a breakout year and Johnson was very disappointing last year. I think this is a close one but I like Carsen better. He's going to be a stud. 

PJ=Newkirk. I think they're pretty equivalent. Newkirk had a solid year but PJ is just so solid. Doesn't turn it over and can really shoot. 

 

As far as the bench, you guys have a better one more than likely but I'll take our starting 5 over yours any day of the week. I think that's the biggest difference. 

Hard to have a conversation with a guy who says a guy who has proven he can't play more than 20 minutes is the choice over a guy with tons of potential then then around and says a guy who has proven less RoJo (more proven than Hass) and has less potential than Davis is better than RoJo. With your logic, Purdue probably will go undefeated. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, KoB2011 said:

Hard to have a conversation with a guy who says a guy who has proven he can't play more than 20 minutes is the choice over a guy with tons of potential then then around and says a guy who has proven less RoJo (more proven than Hass) and has less potential than Davis is better than RoJo. With your logic, Purdue probably will go undefeated. 

I'll take Haas over Davis even if he only plays 20 minutes a game. The guy draws fouls at an insane rate, has a high FG%, and makes his free throws. How would you rank the starters for both teams?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, KoB2011 said:

Not a lot to base that on. We have a new coach and lost a back hole on both sides of the ball. We sure played good team ball last time we didn't have Blackmon. 

I wouldn't say that Blackmon was a blackhole on offense.  The kid scored tons of points last year.  I will give you that he was a horrible liability on defense and that led to alot of easy points and less transition offense for us.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Stlboiler23 said:

I'll take Haas over Davis even if he only plays 20 minutes a game. The guy draws fouls at an insane rate, has a high FG%, and makes his free throws. How would you rank the starters for both teams?

I think Haas is overrated.  He is just a big guy with a limited ceiling and game.  Now,  he is more experienced and has a bigger body than Davis.  Davis is also just a sophomore this year and I haven't seen him play as a starter so i would give the edge to Haas today.  But 10 games into the season, i would like to revisit this conversation.  Haas has had the benefit of Simmons and Biggie to hide his limits.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

I wouldn't say that Blackmon was a blackhole on offense.  The kid scored tons of points last year.  I will give you that he was a horrible liability on defense and that led to alot of easy points and less transition offense for us.

Blackhole on offense just means once he got the ball it was going up. Sure, he scored well but he stalled the offense. Ball movement was much better without him two years ago than with him last year. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

I think Haas is overrated.  He is just a big guy with a limited ceiling and game.  Now,  he is more experienced and has a bigger body than Davis.  Davis is also just a sophomore this year and I haven't seen him play as a starter so i would give the edge to Haas today.  But 10 games into the season, i would like to revisit this conversation.  Haas has had the benefit of Simmons and Biggie to hide his limits.

 

 

Haas is huge but he has skills too. He can score and has a good shooting stroke. He's not just a big dude who clogs up the lane. He's got skill. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just now, Stlboiler23 said:

 

Haas is huge but he has skills too. He can score and has a good shooting stroke. He's not just a big dude who clogs up the lane. He's got skill. 

We're gonna find out this year if that is true.  But i stand by the fact he has benefited by not having to be the man for the last 3 years

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Stlboiler23 said:

I'll take Haas over Davis even if he only plays 20 minutes a game. The guy draws fouls at an insane rate, has a high FG%, and makes his free throws. How would you rank the starters for both teams?

It certainly wouldn't be 4-1, but I don't think it's a good way to just say who is better at each spot and decide better starting lineup by that anyway.  For instance, if Haas has a slight edge of Davis but RoJo has a big edge over Edwards then that's not a 1:1.  However, I'll play along and say:

Haas and Davis is too close to call.  Davis was really coming on at the end of the year, has transformed his body and has more raw talent.  

Edwards over Morgan -- but this is closer than you probably think if you look at their advanced numbers.  Morgan is much better on the glass and finishes much better at the rim.  Edwards is the better overall player though.

SF is really hard to say, who knows how Hartman will look or if maybe Smith starts.  Having said that, probably leans Mathias either way

Johnson is easily the choice at 2 guard.  Can you name a single thing Edwards is better at?  He had a nice freshman year but Johnson was better, even with a terrible slump, in every single way.  

Newkirk.  They're pretty close, both are about even at setting guys up, Thompson takes better care of the ball and Newkirk is a much better scorer.  Both are above average defenders.  I also expect Newkirk to take a bigger jump as it's his second year back from a knee injury.  

 

So Purdue has a better front court, IU has a better back court and better depth.  Coaching we can call a wash, I guess, since Archie has coached but I feel pretty confident Archie is better than Pork Chops. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.




×
×
  • Create New...