Massive topic on why the B1G sucks, why defense is overrated, why you should give Crean more credit, and some potential red flags with Archie.

[BoomBaby]

1 hour ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

He did have 2 teams with a top 30 D and I think 1 with a top 20, might’ve been 25 (Vic). He definitely valued O at the expense of D generally though and that’s a large part of why he’s gone. Had several top 5 offenses, but lacked balance 

According to Pomeroy, 19th in defensive efficiency in '13, and 38th in '14.  Elite offensive coach, but lacking somewhat defensively.  I'd contend that his suboptimal roster management is the biggest reason he's gone, resulting in uneven results from year to year.  Not that roster management is easy in college basketball these days, but I feel much better about Archie in that regard.  I've thought a little about this given that my son-in-law is a Georgia grad.  😊😉

[MSHoosier]

10 hours ago, dgambill said:

I could be wrong but the B1G coaches has had a lot to do with it but as @Leathernecks pointed out.... a majority of the championships have been won by a handful of schools. I wouldn't say Duke and NC nor Florida or Villanova played with a more up tempo pace than any other teams. Fact was the champion is usually a very talented very well coached team that is good on BOTH ends of the floor. They are just well rounded and very skilled teams. I just think the B1G has not been keeping the talent at home like in years past. It used to be the best players from their home states the coaches kept them home...recruiting with AAU etc has changed the game and kids have an opportunity to go all over the country and be visible by more programs especially ones like UNC, Duke, Kansas etc and have more options. The coaches and programs that have been best at recruiting and building a program have benefited the most. It just so happens the a couple of the most consistent and dominant programs in the B1G have been Michigan St. and Wisconsin whose identity was with a slow down pound you inside, methodical offenses with hardened defenses. While some other schools went through some identity changes with losing iconic coaches etc those two coaches filled a void at the top. Then coaches and programs in trying to compete followed their model as to out tough, grind out possessions etc to beat them at THEIR game. Thus you have 8-10 programs all playing the same way and when they face a different style in the tournament...they struggle with it. I agree with the OP in that one dimensional basketball isn't enough..and when you get to the tournament (outside the first round) you are typically playing the best of the best and to run into a hot offense and find yourself playing catch up. A great defense will typically keep you in the game but you may not be able to put the game away without a really good offense to go with it. Sometimes the ol saying holds true. There is no defense for great offense. Hot shooting...making contested shots...some things you just can't do anything about...so you better be able to go score yourself. So anyways...I think that is why sometimes we see that the B1G team that does the best in the tournament doesn't necessarily win the league...they play an adaptable style of ball that can win against multiple style teams....and not just built to win one way.

I think you have hit the heart of the problem.  There will come a game in the tournament  where no matter how highly ranked your defense was coming into the game, you are getting lit up and you won't win unless you can keep pace offensively. That's  what it appeared to me happened to Michigan in the final.

[hoosiertildeath]

Do you realize that it has now been FORTY TWO YEARS Since Knight and The Hoosiers went Undefeated during the regular season and then Won the NCAA Tournament Championship that same season ! And YET , I get the impression that some IU fans still expect that will happen  every season ???? It may happen again some day , who knows what the future holds ? I always hope that IU will repeat that fantastic season , but I do not expect it to happen !   Having said that , I rapidly await the 2018-2019 season with high hopes that this upcoming season will be the Best Indiana University Basketball Season since that Unbelievable roller coaster ride of 1976 !!! GO Hoosiers !!

[greg haggard]

On 8/11/2018 at 9:49 PM, MSHoosier said:

I think you have hit the heart of the problem.  There will come a game in the tournament  where no matter how highly ranked your defense was coming into the game, you are getting lit up and you won't win unless you can keep pace offensively. That's  what it appeared to me happened to Michigan in the final.

Conversely, you may have a great offense and have a bad shooting night, and if you have no defense....

I saw that happen to IU a great deal during the Crean years!

[IowaHoosierFan]

On 8/11/2018 at 8:42 PM, BoomBaby said:

According to Pomeroy, 19th in defensive efficiency in '13, and 38th in '14.  Elite offensive coach, but lacking somewhat defensively.  I'd contend that his suboptimal roster management is the biggest reason he's gone, resulting in uneven results from year to year.  Not that roster management is easy in college basketball these days, but I feel much better about Archie in that regard.  I've thought a little about this given that my son-in-law is a Georgia grad.  😊😉

I think Coach Cream's biggest issue was game substitution and adjustments.  He had a great eye for talent and ran a fun up tempo offense but made strange and often head scratching sustitutions and on floor team combo's.  He also lost many games because he could not adjust to a team or the other team easily adjusted to us.

[3Ballin]

13 hours ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

I think Coach Cream's biggest issue was game substitution and adjustments.  He had a great eye for talent and ran a fun up tempo offense but made strange and often head scratching sustitutions and on floor team combo's.  He also lost many games because he could not adjust to a team or the other team easily adjusted to us.

Ahhhhh......the 'ole "you just had 2 steals, a dunk, 2 3's and an assist in 45 seconds....lets get you out for a while."

[Maedhros]

On 8/9/2018 at 2:14 AM, ADegenerate said:

I don't know what his long term plan and philosophy will be but I imagine it'll be similar to Seans. I'm not sure that a slower tempo with a heavy focus on attacking the rim, and a big insistence on playing inside out will take you very far. Especially without two high level scoring guards and little shooting. I'll let him build the roster but it's looking pretty odd to me at the moment. 

Wish I could like this post multiple times. Archie's focus on defense feels like a high floor/low ceiling approach out of step with the best teams in today's college basketball. Teams like Villanova and even Purdue showed the value of having shooters everywhere, while Archie is working hard to implement a pack line defense designed to encourage shots from the perimeter. 

It's early and we don't yet know what his Indiana teams will eventually look like or what adjustments Archie will make, but I have concerns. His recruiting priorities so far seem to reflect his desire for length and defense over playmaking ability on offense. Landing Romeo was a coup, but outside DJ Carton we've been awfully late to the party on guards in the 2019 class.