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1 hour ago, IU Scott said:

I love what Victor did at IU but I just don't see how anyone would put him in the top 7 players to play at IU from 1970.  He was good his first two years and great his junior year but his teams never won much

Hang on.  Didn't you have Big Mac on your team?  If so what did he win?

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16 hours ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

 One  thing stands out to me -- a Vic / IT back court would literally kill the other teams. I LOVE that back court. Just imagine the in-your-face aggressive attacking and D. 

Agree that would be something to behold!

Going back to my roots, Buckner/Wilkerson from a defensive perspective were incredible. However Vic/IT scored much better. 

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I'd also add a couple of things on Vic...he didn't have the pedigree to come in and start day one like Romeo does. He really had to earn that with his play.

Also, you have to look at what he did on both sides of the ball and the leadership he showed. Vic obviously did a lot right and the NBA noticed. I mean, really...how many IU guys were drafted as high as Vic was?

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On ‎10‎/‎10‎/‎2018 at 10:14 AM, IU Scott said:

 

Career stats

McGinnis  30pts, 14 rebs

Cheaney  19.8 pts, All time leading scorer in big ten history

IT 15.4 pts, 3.5 rebs, 5.8 assist  NCAA champion

Alford  19.5 2.8 rebs, 3.1 asssit  NCAA champion, US Olympic champion, 2nd all time leading scorer at IU

May 17.7pts, 6.6 rebs,  1.8 asst,  NCAA champion

Benson15.3 pts, 9rebs, NCAA Champion, 1st pick in draft

Buckner  10 pts, 4.5 rebs, 3.8 asst,  NCAA champion, US Olympic champion

VO 10.7 pts, 5.2 rebs, 1.7 assist, 2nd pick of draft

 

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50 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

Probably talent wise but not production

By what measure? Are you just looking at scoring? Vic is the quintessential two-way player, he flat out shut down other teams' scorers, while being one of IU's top scorers by his junior year and shooting like 43% from the arc. This also goes to how we personally, subjectively, value players - if you consider both sides of the ball, it's pretty hard not to consider Vic one of IU's best ever. 

Looking up at your post above, you're only looking at offensive stats.

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37 minutes ago, FKIM01 said:

I'd also add a couple of things on Vic...he didn't have the pedigree to come in and start day one like Romeo does. He really had to earn that with his play.

Also, you have to look at what he did on both sides of the ball and the leadership he showed. Vic obviously did a lot right and the NBA noticed. I mean, really...how many IU guys were drafted as high as Vic was?

Off the top of my head 3......Zeke, Benson, and Walt Bellamy.

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Gotta expand a bit on Vic, since he's my favorite Hoosier ever (vbg)

Here's a better look at his stats, and awards, in college - https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/victor-oladipo-1.html

They include

-- Top 10 in steals per game in the B1G all three of his years, and 1st as a junior (2.2 per game)

-- Top 10 in FG percentage as a soph and junior, and 1st overall as a junior -- .59 --  as a GUARD (how many guards can you name who accomplished that?)

-- 5th overall in 2-pt FG's as a junior

-- 2nd overall in PER as a junior

-- 1st overall in effective field goal percentage, as a junior

-- 1st overall in true shooting percentage as a junior, and 8th overall in the NCAA, again, as a guard

-- 4th overall in offensive rebounding percentage as a junior

-- 10th overall in ppg as a junior (just saying he scored 13 points is at best misleading)

-- 2nd overall in offensive rating as a junior

There are more at the link -- he flat out dominated the B1G as a junior, and really nationally, and it began with his D as a frosh

 

 

 

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8 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

Gotta expand a bit on Vic, since he's my favorite Hoosier ever (vbg)

Here's a better look at his stats, and awards, in college - https://www.sports-reference.com/cbb/players/victor-oladipo-1.html

They include

-- Top 10 in steals per game in the B1G all three of his years, and 1st as a junior (2.2 per game)

-- Top 10 in FG percentage as a soph and junior, and 1st overall as a junior -- .59 --  as a GUARD (how many guards can you name who accomplished that?)

-- 5th overall in 2-pt FG's as a junior

-- 2nd overall in PER as a junior

-- 1st overall in effective field goal percentage, as a junior

-- 1st overall in true shooting percentage as a junior, and 8th overall in the NCAA, again, as a guard

-- 4th overall in offensive rebounding percentage as a junior

-- 10th overall in ppg as a junior (just saying he scored 13 points is at best misleading)

-- 2nd overall in offensive rating as a junior

There are more at the link -- he flat out dominated the B1G as a junior, and really nationally, and it began with his D as a frosh

 

 

 

He was a stud.......history isn't written yet but he very well could be the greatest player IU ever had.  But he didn't win enough?  LOL

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8 minutes ago, rico said:

He was a stud.......history isn't written yet but he very well could be the greatest player IU ever had.  But he didn't win enough?  LOL

Yes his IU history is written since he will never play another game in an IU uniform.  We are only talking about a college career and not what they did once they left IU.  I think VO is a great player but would not put him in with the others as one of the greatest in that time frame.

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32 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

Yes his IU history is written since he will never play another game in an IU uniform.  We are only talking about a college career and not what they did once they left IU.  I think VO is a great player but would not put him in with the others as one of the greatest in that time frame.

The question was who's in your starting lineup.  Seriously...who do you start in front of Vic?  I'm not talking as a freshman...I'm talking as a junior.  I can't think of a soul I'd start in front of him and that includes Eric Gordon...a player I absolutely loved. Sure, as a freshman, Gordon is in front of him but had they both stayed three years...as much as I loved Gordon, I don't see it.

Primary emphasis on college production but for those who left early you have to at least look at what they did beyond college. Vic Blossomed and an all-American Alford got exposed.

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14 minutes ago, FKIM01 said:

The question was who's in your starting lineup.  Seriously...who do you start in front of Vic?  I'm not talking as a freshman...I'm talking as a junior.  I can't think of a soul I'd start in front of him and that includes Eric Gordon...a player I absolutely loved. Sure, as a freshman, Gordon is in front of him but had they both stayed three years...as much as I loved Gordon, I don't see it.

Primary emphasis on college production but for those who left early you have to at least look at what they did beyond college. Vic Blossomed and an all-American Alford got exposed.

I would definitely  start Alford over VO at the 2 and maybe even Jay Edwards.  I also couldn't care less what the players did once they left IU because we are talking the starting lineup when they played at IU.  I also would think about Randy Wittman as well because he was a great shooter and leader of those teams.

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5 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

I would definitely  start Alford over VO at the 2 and maybe even Jay Edwards.  I also couldn't care less what the players did once they left IU because we are talking the starting lineup when they played at IU.  I also would think about Randy Wittman as well because he was a great shooter and leader of those teams.

LOL...in the words of former Pacer scout Courtney Witte, "Jay couldn't guard a sidewalk."  Frankly, Alford wasn't much better.  I'd give you either of them on your team and take Oladipo all day long.  I'll bet we'd beat the brakes off your team.😂

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5 minutes ago, FKIM01 said:

LOL...in the words of former Pacer scout Courtney Witte, "Jay couldn't guard a sidewalk."  Frankly, Alford wasn't much better.  I'd give you either of them on your team and take Oladipo all day long.  I'll bet we'd beat the brakes off your team.😂

I am not trying to sound condescending but did you actually see those players that you are talking about.  People tend to choose what they know and see and discount what they never seen before.  There is nothing wrong with doing this because everyone does it but if you never saw a player play  then it is hard to know everything about that player.  Again I think VO is a great player but just going by what he did at IU I just could not put him in my top 7.

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13 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

I am not trying to sound condescending but did you actually see those players that you are talking about.  People tend to choose what they know and see and discount what they never seen before.  There is nothing wrong with doing this because everyone does it but if you never saw a player play  then it is hard to know everything about that player.  Again I think VO is a great player but just going by what he did at IU I just could not put him in my top 7.

Dude, I'm older than you are.  I saw them all from McGinnis forward.

...not trying to sound condescending either, but VO as a junior would have eaten seniors Alford and Edwards alive.

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14 minutes ago, FKIM01 said:

Dude, I'm older than you are.  I saw them all from McGinnis forward.

...not trying to sound condescending either, but VO as a junior would have eaten seniors Alford and Edwards alive.

Just agree to disagree on that but no VO would not eat up Alford because it is not who would be better playing one on one but fitting in with your team.  Alford as a freshman lead a mediocre team at best to the elite 8 after beating the #1 team in UNC led by Jordan.

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10 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

Just agree to disagree on that but no VO would not eat up Alford because it is not who would be better playing one on one but fitting in with your team.  Alford as a freshman lead a mediocre team at best to the elite 8 after beating the #1 team in UNC led by Jordan.

And what did Alford do the following year, and the year after that?  Nothing except getting benched.  

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13 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

Just agree to disagree on that but no VO would not eat up Alford because it is not who would be better playing one on one but fitting in with your team.  Alford as a freshman lead a mediocre team at best to the elite 8 after beating the #1 team in UNC led by Jordan.

Yeah, we'll have to disagree and that's OK. VO as a player not only excels on both ends of the floor, he also makes everyone around him better. Very few players at any level are such good all-around players and leaders.

...and besides...everyone knows it was all because of Dakich that IU beat UNC. 😋

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7 minutes ago, rico said:

And what did Alford do the following year, and the year after that?  Nothing except getting benched.  

Benched one game his sophomore year and that had to do more with RMK being burnt out.  He then led his team to a national championship scoring 23 points. 

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