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Nebraska Postgame Thread


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29 minutes ago, Artesian_86 said:

I want Archie to show and chew on his players.....That is what was been missing from the last several coaches at IU. It also tells me that he is passionate, intense and focused on detail. You have to remember that Archie is seeing/coaching this game through the eyes of a former point guard....If feel the point guard is arguably one of the most important, if not, the most important players on the team. No excuses from me, but I will keep repeating this same statement over and over, until Archie has a full team of "Miller recruited" players, there will be growing pains. It really hurts right now!

I'm beginning to wonder if he will ever get a "full team of Miller recruited players"  because there will never be enough of them healthy to be a "full team"

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I think coaches today micro manage to much and try to run every second of the game.  I think they should let the players have some freedom in the game and let them just go out and play and not have to think to much.  John Wooden always said that his job wa sin practice and game time was for the players and they should be able to play during the game because of what they were taught in practice.

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Just now, hoosiertildeath said:

IU Scott  :  please read the rest of my original post !  I am in a nursing facility and I kept being interrupted and had to edit the original post to make my point several times ! Experience usually beats youth !

HTD, I hope all is well with you my friend. 

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Horrible performance last night. Nebraska is a really good team, but that effort was just sub-par. Not sure how this is going to shake out the rest of the season, but IU is going to have to get it together. With that said, I am still 10000% aboard the Archie train! This is going to take time and patience.A few ramblings...

- It took Beilein 5 years to get Michigan rolling consistently (six years to get past the second round of the tournament).  

- Jay Wright didn't make the NCAA Tournament until his 4th year at Villanova

- In a seamless, planned transition, it took Izzo until his 3rd year as head coach to get MSU to the NCAA Tournament. His first two years he went 16-16 (9-9) and 17-12 (9-9).

- It took Tony Bennett 5 years to get UVA really good. He made the NCAA Tournament 1 time his first 4 years. His first two years he went a combined 31-31 (12-20).

- As much as people want to say it doesn't matter or their tired of hearing about it, the injuries have 100%, absolutely negatively impacted how good this team could be. Look at Duke last night, Reddish didn't play and Jones got hurt in the first half and they lost to Syracuse at home. The injuries matter. We've been without anywhere from 3-5 scholarship, rotation players. You can't plan, you can't practice effectively and it's impacted the versatility and depth a great deal

- Yes, I know they're freshmen and we haven't seen them play, but both Hunter and Thompson would be playing ahead of Fitzner, Moore and Davis (injuries for him) right now. We're getting killed because none of them can play a lick of defense (Davis mostly because of injury).

- Even if we could go big, we can't because we need Smith on the floor for his D, but he's so bad with the ball in his hands that you can't slide him to the 3.

- I really liked the energy Moore gave last night, but he is really far behind defensively. We had cut the lead to 6 near the end of the half, and instead of going into halftime with all the momentum, Moore got lost on one of Nebraska's final possessions and gave up a wide open 3 to push the lead back to 9. It was a back-breaker

- We've got to find a way to get Morgan to the 4 without sacrificing the D. 

- Archie is not above criticism, and if there's anything I would say I was hoping Green and Smith would be further along. Smith has been really good defensively, but his lack of offensive improvement is killing this team. Nebraska basically didn't guard him at all last night unless he got in the paint, then they either just took the ball from him or blocked his shot, but anytime he got the ball the perimeter they just sagged off him big time. 

- The slow starts are more about defense than offense. Our defense is usually pretty bad the first 5 minutes, which prevents us from getting in transition, getting easy buckets early and getting off to a fast start. The good start at UMD was more about defense than offense. 

- This team can't shoot, has no confidence on offense outside of Langford and Morgan. Some other guys are going to have to step up offensively. 

 

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For all the over-reactors, I think back to Villanova losing to Furman at home in November. One game does not define a team or a coach.

Nebraska is #11 in Kenpom now (Furman is 99 and Nova is 21), so they are better than what most people think of a normal Nebraska team. They are 13-4. I was as disgusted as anyone watching the game last night, but it doesn't diminish what the team has done before this game (good and bad) and doesn't control what the team does going forward. It can impact what the team does going forward (good or bad), and hopefully the team uses the disappointment in this game and the 3 game losing streak to ignite a much needed surge of passion, pissed-off, etc. to get this team going in the right direction.

 

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One more thing, I watched the end of the Michigan-Northwestern game the other night. Postgame Beilein was interviewed by Jon Crispin and was asked something to the effect of, "how did you get the Michigan program rolling like this?" I tried to find the video, but couldn't. If I do I will post it. 

But, his answer was essentially that when he took the job he saw what programs like Wisconsin and MSU we're doing. They made the tournament every year and were in contention every year, and that he has to instill that type of 'winning culture' at Michigan. But he said instilling a winning culture, with guys that are on the same page and understand what you're doing takes time. It doesn't happen overnight. It takes several years to where you have the veterans that 'get it' and then the new guys fall right into line. 

He must of had said "culture" 3-4 times in the one answer. Again, it took patience and it took time. I know it's hard and the IU fan base is getting tired of waiting, but we can't hold the sins of the past against Archie, he needs time to get this rolling again. 

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45 minutes ago, BGleas said:

Horrible performance last night. Nebraska is a really good team, but that effort was just sub-par. Not sure how this is going to shake out the rest of the season, but IU is going to have to get it together. With that said, I am still 10000% aboard the Archie train! This is going to take time and patience.A few ramblings...

- It took Beilein 5 years to get Michigan rolling consistently (six years to get past the second round of the tournament).  

- Jay Wright didn't make the NCAA Tournament until his 4th year at Villanova

- In a seamless, planned transition, it took Izzo until his 3rd year as head coach to get MSU to the NCAA Tournament. His first two years he went 16-16 (9-9) and 17-12 (9-9).

- It took Tony Bennett 5 years to get UVA really good. He made the NCAA Tournament 1 time his first 4 years. His first two years he went a combined 31-31 (12-20).

- As much as people want to say it doesn't matter or their tired of hearing about it, the injuries have 100%, absolutely negatively impacted how good this team could be. Look at Duke last night, Reddish didn't play and Jones got hurt in the first half and they lost to Syracuse at home. The injuries matter. We've been without anywhere from 3-5 scholarship, rotation players. You can't plan, you can't practice effectively and it's impacted the versatility and depth a great deal

- Yes, I know they're freshmen and we haven't seen them play, but both Hunter and Thompson would be playing ahead of Fitzner, Moore and Davis (injuries for him) right now. We're getting killed because none of them can play a lick of defense (Davis mostly because of injury).

- Even if we could go big, we can't because we need Smith on the floor for his D, but he's so bad with the ball in his hands that you can't slide him to the 3.

- I really liked the energy Moore gave last night, but he is really far behind defensively. We had cut the lead to 6 near the end of the half, and instead of going into halftime with all the momentum, Moore got lost on one of Nebraska's final possessions and gave up a wide open 3 to push the lead back to 9. It was a back-breaker

- We've got to find a way to get Morgan to the 4 without sacrificing the D. 

- Archie is not above criticism, and if there's anything I would say I was hoping Green and Smith would be further along. Smith has been really good defensively, but his lack of offensive improvement is killing this team. Nebraska basically didn't guard him at all last night unless he got in the paint, then they either just took the ball from him or blocked his shot, but anytime he got the ball the perimeter they just sagged off him big time. 

- The slow starts are more about defense than offense. Our defense is usually pretty bad the first 5 minutes, which prevents us from getting in transition, getting easy buckets early and getting off to a fast start. The good start at UMD was more about defense than offense. 

- This team can't shoot, has no confidence on offense outside of Langford and Morgan. Some other guys are going to have to step up offensively. 

 

Really don’t think you can compare Duke losing two 5 star starters that have played every game to IU losing 2-3 bench players, most of whom haven’t played at all this season.

But to your last point, do you have any concerns with the offensive system?  I’m no basketball genius, so I’m really not sure... But this is the second straight year now that the team “can’t shoot and has no confidence on offense.”  It seems to me that Archie is micromanaging the offense, and players are struggling to get in a rhythm and get good looks, especially from three.

Edit: As I’ve mentioned in the past, Archie’s offensive philosophy also involves taking very few threes (we’re 13th in the conference in adjusted three point attempts per game right now, and this is typical for his teams going back to Dayton).  We’re also seeing a potential lack of emphasis on recruiting shooters going forward.  I’m just not sure that’s sustainable with the way basketball is played today.

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Terrible effort last night. However, I still believe Archie is a rock solid coach. As it relates this season, we're definitely at a crossroads with some big road games we need to execute in order to win @ Purdue and Northwestern. We'll see what happens for the remainder of the year, but something has to start clicking with the guys to get them going...hoping Archie can find a way to capture the intensity and attention. I'll give Archie a full recruiting cycle before I start to cast real doubt unless the wheels come completely off. I still think we've got a good coach...and honestly I don't think our program could lure somebody with a much higher ceiling that Archie.

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21 minutes ago, FW_Hoosier said:

Really don’t think you can compare Duke losing two 5 star starters that have played every game to IU losing 2-3 bench players, most of whom haven’t played at all this season.

But to your last point, do you have any concerns with the offensive system?  I’m no basketball genius, so I’m really not sure... But this is the second straight year now that the team “can’t shoot and has no confidence on offense.”  It seems to me that Archie is micromanaging the offense, and players are struggling to get in a rhythm and get good looks, especially from three.

I wouldn't call missing or still having in recovery mode, Phinisee, Davis, Hunter, Thompson, and at other times McRoberts, Green and Forrester, 'missing 2-3 bench players'. At times we've been missing as many as 5 scholarship players, and as many as 4 rotation guys. Phinisee isn't back to 100% yet and that's a big one. Injuries have absolutely impacted this season. Yes, Duke was missing two 5* starters, but still had two other 5* starters and a host of other top, highly ranked guys. The injuries matter. 

On the offensive side, I'm not saying Archie is an offensive genius, clearly he's more of a defensive, ball-control type of coach, but IMO this is mostly about the Jimmy's and Joe's than it is about the X's and the O's. There isn't a ton of difference in offenses anymore in basketball. Most teams run action to get favorable matchups in the pick and roll game. IU does the same things. I didn't see anything Nebraska did very different than IU offensively last night, they just had more guys that could actually make plays and make shots. Same thing with Michigan. They didn't do anything sophisticated that Archie doesn't know about or can't do, they just had more play/shot makers. 

Nebraska has 4 guys (Palmer, Copeland, Watson, Roby) that can make plays and shots that you can run plays through, and then a 5th guy (Allen) that is a threat because he shoots 40% from 3. Indiana has two guys that can make plays/shots (Langford/Morgan) and then a few guys that on occasion (but you don't know what occasion) can receive a pass and score if open. We are an offensively challenged team. Open shots are there, just like they were for Nebraska and Michigan, we just don't have the guys to hit them or take advantage of opportunities. 

The problem with IU right now is that we only have two reliable play/shot makers. Maybe two and a half if you count Phinisee. If there is anything I'm going to keep my eye on as Archie's program develops is the tempo with which the offense operates at. It does seem right now that we're playing a slow, deliberate pace. I hope when the options improve (play makers and shooters) that the pace does too.

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2 hours ago, dwtaylor1055 said:

Yes I have watched on tv and in person multiple times this season.  Who ahead of him at the Shooting Guard or Small Forward spot is worse at defense than Demezi is, go on enlighten me.  I'll wait, here are a few to name: Romeo(better defender), Durham(better defender), Green(better defender but not by much IMO), McRoberts(better defender)? Of course they all could improve on defense, every single college athlete could. 

 

Now if we are talking offense with those 4 I mentioned, Demezi is better offensively than McRoberts.

Throw Romeo out..duh, Durham(not better imo), Green is constantly lost and McBob is not a good defender(this year). That is exactly my point...those you mentioned are horrible at defense and offense. Why not have a kid that is horrible at defense, but MIGHT possibly help us on the offensive side...at least he would shoot when wide open unlike several others.

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2 hours ago, IU Scott said:

Even RMK very rarely call timeouts to stop momentum because he said players need to play through it and do what they were taught in practice.

Exactly.  And John Wooden, felt the same.  If they have learned and absorbed in practice, what we have taught them, there is no need to call time outs in end of game crunch time.  All that does is give the other coach an opportunity to instruct his players what they were not taught in practice.

Great observation Scott.  Not just one, but two of the greatest college basketball coaches in the history of the game, professed, it's not what is taught in a timeout.... but rather what is taught in practice.

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1 hour ago, IU Scott said:

I think coaches today micro manage to much and try to run every second of the game.  I think they should let the players have some freedom in the game and let them just go out and play and not have to think to much.  John Wooden always said that his job wa sin practice and game time was for the players and they should be able to play during the game because of what they were taught in practice.

So you want Crean back.

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54 minutes ago, BGleas said:

I wouldn't call missing or still having in recovery mode, Phinisee, Davis, Hunter, Thompson, and at other times McRoberts, Green and Forrester, 'missing 2-3 bench players'. At times we've been missing as many as 5 scholarship players, and as many as 4 rotation guys. Phinisee isn't back to 100% yet and that's a big one. Injuries have absolutely impacted this season. Yes, Duke was missing two 5* starters, but still had two other 5* starters and a host of other top, highly ranked guys. The injuries matter. 

 

 

I'd like to expand a little more on De'Ron.  Saw some questionable comments about him for the Monday Night Massacre in Assembly Hall.

De'Ron is still hobbled by an ankle injury.  Observed around campus in a walking boot, prior to the game.

  And.... and..... did no one notice, how taped up his legs were for the game ?  He gave it a go.  He should be applauded for that. Not derided.  At least he tried.  Geesh !

 

And another response.  Injuries to this team are not an excuse.  They are a fact. 

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What happens if we lose 5 in a row?  Do we worry then?  Do we look at the next 5 and say we can do it, we just need to get healthy?  What if we don't get healthy?  What if this is the team we have this year and we miss the tourney?  Are we ok with it?  Do we say lets see how next year turns out?  Do we need to wait 3 more years to get a full CAM recruited team? Is it ok to be in the bottom of the B1G multiple years in a row? 

I am disappointed with how this team has played.  I am disappointed in some of our players growth from year to year.  I am disappointed in the health of our squad.  I am disappointed in our coaching staff.  I am disappointed in [insert reason].  Repeat.

I think my biggest issue is the wasted opportunity we have with Romeo.  A very special talent being wasted in a very mediocre team.  I definitely had higher expectations than this, and maybe that is my fault.  Maybe i expect more.  Maybe i am lost in the past of IU glory.  Maybe...

 

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Just now, milehiiu said:

I'd like to expand a little more on De'Ron.  Saw some questionable comments about him for the Monday Night Massacre in Assembly Hall.

De'Ron is still hobbled by an ankle injury.  Observed around campus in a walking boot, prior to the game.

  And.... and..... did no one notice, how taped up his legs were for the game ?  He gave it a go.  He should be applauded for that. Not derided.  At least he tried.  Geesh !

Agree, and I actually think it was wrong to even play Davis the last two games. I guess that goes on Archie, but clearly Davis was not ready/able to play the last two games because of injury. He's clearly hobbled and can't get up and down the court. It wasn't fair to him to play him. 

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3 minutes ago, CauseThatsMyDJ said:

So you want Crean back.

Nope, because he like most coaches today doesn't trust their players to play and micro manage every aspect of the game.  I hate seeing kids look over to the sidelines coming up the court instead of just getting into their offense.  I see it in college football as well when the team gets to the line of scrimmage but they look over to the sidelines.  Why is it today that coaches can't trust their players to play the game without all the micro managing.

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Just now, BGleas said:

Agree, and I actually think it was wrong to even play Davis the last two games. I guess that goes on Archie, but clearly Davis was not ready/able to play the last two games because of injury. He's clearly hobbled and can't get up and down the court. It wasn't fair to him to play him. 

Coaches make mistakes. Even Knight admitted to bringing Scott May back too soon.

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1 minute ago, milehiiu said:

I'd like to expand a little more on De'Ron.  Saw some questionable comments about him for the Monday Night Massacre in Assembly Hall.

De'Ron is still hobbled by an ankle injury.  Observed around campus in a walking boot, prior to the game.

  And.... and..... did no one notice, how taped up his legs were for the game ?  He gave it a go.  He should be applauded for that. Not derided.  At least he tried.  Geesh !

Mostly i think people are bashing CAM for even playing DD.  He shouldn't even being played this year in all honestly.  And he might never get enough back to compete at this level.  The Achilles is a tough injury for man of his size to return from.

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1 minute ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

Mostly i think people are bashing CAM for even playing DD.  He shouldn't even being played this year in all honestly.  And he might never get enough back to compete at this level.  The Achilles is a tough injury for man of his size to return from.

Earlier in the season Davis was giving IU quality minutes. He should not have played the last two games, but he was playing well before this recent ankle (or whatever the injury is) injury. 

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