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Northwestern Postgame Thread


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59 minutes ago, hoosier_exotics said:

IU isnt IU !  We are far from elite at this point..  what crean left was mediocre at best.  This is going to take time, regardless who took the job.  

Everyone that has responded is proving my point.  IU does have an elite history but to truly still be elite you make an elite hire for an elite school.  IU did not.  I have no problem with Archie but the earlier post about Glass was hands down correct.  IU athletics has continuously made the non elite pick.  This is all on Glass and the trustees for not wanting a coach that’s bigger than the school.  Unfortunately if you are elite your coach is that presence.  You are all correct, IU is not elite anymore and until the IU board, President, and AD change their approach with every new coach we will be on a five year plan in perpetuity.  What a sad state.

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1 hour ago, 5 championships said:

IU is considered elite? We havnt been to a final four in 17 years. To say that IU roster is anywhere close to being constructed well when Archie toke over is a complete joke. We held on to Crean WAY to long. 

 

IU isn’t elite because the university and those who control the sport don’t treat it as such.  Any high level coach immediately brings in the recruits to make the difference because they have that name to do so.

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18 minutes ago, Billingsley99 said:

I have not seen anyone on here calling for his head. My beef is that we have no shooters and our offense looks like crap. I for one do not feel like our guys are competing.  I dont like losing but can accept it if playing and and we are moving in right direction.  Right now I dont see those things.  I feel as though we are wasting a great opportunity.  Still lots of time to turn it around 

Never said it was people on this board but on some other boards they are already talking about replacements for Archie

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13 minutes ago, FW_Hoosier said:

Clifton Moore gets in the game, grabs two boards and gets a block in 2 minutes... Immediately gets benched and doesn’t see the floor for the rest of the game.  So sick of hearing this from Archie.

FBBF1753-3343-4868-A683-C54A88D1ABD9.png

I have never understood the Cliff situation.  he does good things every time he is in

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Sounds like we might getting to the "need to clarify" part of this thread. I'm frustrated. I'm frustrated at the totality of 20 years with 3-4 great seasons. I believe in patience and I believe Archie will deliver....but my frustration is a peripheral view of IU hoops. I'm just tired of continually being asked to be patient and pony up $ every single year. That's where I'm at. Nothing to do with current staff (which I think recruiting wise is the best we've had since Knight actually cared about recruiting)....it just becomes taxing to love something so much and continue to be asked to be patient.

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11 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

Never said it was people on this board but on some other boards they are already talking about replacements for Archie

Thats all part of big boy athletics. The media has been replacing Tom Brady for years. If a coach cant handle the message boards they need to find a profession no one outside the company takes passion it.  Not too many message boards for accountants. 

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12 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

Sounds like we might getting to the "need to clarify" part of this thread. I'm frustrated. I'm frustrated at the totality of 20 years with 3-4 great seasons. I believe in patience and I believe Archie will deliver....but my frustration is a peripheral view of IU hoops. I'm just tired of continually being asked to be patient and pony up $ every single year. That's where I'm at. Nothing to do with current staff (which I think recruiting wise is the best we've had since Knight actually cared about recruiting)....it just becomes taxing to love something so much and continue to be asked to be patient.

I think that is where many of us are at this time

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6 minutes ago, iuthruandthru said:

Everyone that has responded is proving my point.  IU does have an elite history but to truly still be elite you make an elite hire for an elite school.  IU did not.  I have no problem with Archie but the earlier post about Glass was hands down correct.  IU athletics has continuously made the non elite pick.  This is all on Glass and the trustees for not wanting a coach that’s bigger than the school.  Unfortunately if you are elite your coach is that presence.  You are all correct, IU is not elite anymore and until the IU board, President, and AD change their approach with every new coach we will be on a five year plan in perpetuity.  What a sad state.

When most top teams have openings they don't hire guys away from other top teams.  When coach K leaves do you really think they will be able to hire another elite coach away from where they are right now.  Duke will probably go with a former player and assistant coach like Collins or Wojo or Capel.  There are very few that can hire an elite coach away line UNC did with Williams but that was because of Williams being an UNC alum.  When most hires are made it is a crap shoot whether it will work out or not because you are hiring a guy from a lower level.

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48 minutes ago, 5 championships said:

Definitely can. My point is you can’t judge a book by its cover or a coach for that matter after only two years. My gosh he only has one class of recruits brought in by him that are freshmen. Lets not shoot something great down before it gets started because it’s not giving us what we want right now at this very moment. Hoosier nation needs to see the big picture a little better. Get back to me in year 4 or 5 and if this  is how we are playing then see ya Arch. 

My core point was IU and the university choose to take the path of another long rebuild.  I don’t blame Archie or have issues with him.  I hope he leads the team to the promised land.  I just think it’s time we held the ones that have made these choices accountable for them.  People need to realize the moment Archie was chosen the 5 year plan was the expectation.  My kids know nothing but Mike Davis and beyond as the head coach at IU, so sad.

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1 minute ago, Billingsley99 said:

Thats all part of big boy athletics. The media has been replacing Tom Brady for years. If a coach cant handle the message boards they need to find a profession no one outside the company takes passion it.  Not too many message boards for accountants. 

Turbo tax has a message board now,  oh wait that is a help desk I think.

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12 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

When most top teams have openings they don't hire guys away from other top teams.  When coach K leaves do you really think they will be able to hire another elite coach away from where they are right now.  Duke will probably go with a former player and assistant coach like Collins or Wojo or Capel.  There are very few that can hire an elite coach away line UNC did with Williams but that was because of Williams being an UNC alum.  When most hires are made it is a crap shoot whether it will work out or not because you are hiring a guy from a lower level.

Self to Kansas and Cal to UK. Have worked out pretty well.

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3 minutes ago, Billingsley99 said:

Thats all part of big boy athletics. The media has been replacing Tom Brady for years. If a coach cant handle the message boards they need to find a profession no one outside the company takes passion it.  Not too many message boards for accountants. 

When did I say he couldn't handle it but it makes our fan base look stupid for calling for a coaches head after 1.5 years.  If they would make a move and fire him after this year then there is no way any competent coach would want to come here and work for this fan base.

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6 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

When most top teams have openings they don't hire guys away from other top teams.  When coach K leaves do you really think they will be able to hire another elite coach away from where they are right now.  Duke will probably go with a former player and assistant coach like Collins or Wojo or Capel.  There are very few that can hire an elite coach away line UNC did with Williams but that was because of Williams being an UNC alum.  When most hires are made it is a crap shoot whether it will work out or not because you are hiring a guy from a lower level.

There are plenty of options that would be considered elite, you don’t have to poach him from another elite program.  Once again you are comparing apples to oranges.  IU is not in the same position as Duke or UNC.  IU has been mored in mediocre results for decades.  Best way to spark the fan base and get instant results is to bring in a known and successful name.  An established elite program can take its time and be strategic about who they bring in, which I am sure Duke will do.  IU is not in that place.

Edit:  additionally I would go so far to say no elite coach would come here at this time knowing culturally where the administration stands with things.

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1 minute ago, IU Scott said:

When did I say he couldn't handle it but it makes our fan base look stupid for calling for a coaches head after 1.5 years.  If they would make a move and fire him after this year then there is no way any competent coach would want to come here and work for this fan base.

We can only control what is on this board......evidently you want to cruise around to other venues and then bring it to this board.

Nobody has called for Archie's head here......only you saying that other people have on different outlets.

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12 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

When did I say he couldn't handle it but it makes our fan base look stupid for calling for a coaches head after 1.5 years.  If they would make a move and fire him after this year then there is no way any competent coach would want to come here and work for this fan base.

That is every coach at every level. Go sit in the stands on any Friday night and listen to the fans. There is a reason they are fans and not the coach. I heard people in Loogootee calling for Jack Butchers head.  It comes with the territory.  Not saying it's right or acceptable but its a fact of life.

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1 minute ago, iuthruandthru said:

There are plenty of options that would be considered elite, you don’t have to poach him from another elite program.  Once again you are comparing apples to oranges.  IU is not in the same position as Duke or UNC.  IU has been mored in mediocre results for decades.  Best way to spark the fan base and get instant results is to bring in a known and successful name.  An established elite program can take its time and be strategic about who they bring in, which I am sure Duke will do.  IU is not in that place.

What elite hire could you have made when we were looking for a coach the last time.  Don't give me Stevens or Donovan because that was never going to happen.  Why would coaches like Wright or Bennett leave there stable jobs where they can accomplish everything at their current jobs that they could at IU.

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When CAM was hired I read a lot of articles and boards that said he was a tough mined Defense coach who got a lot out of lower level talent at Dayton.  I like CAM but I am not seeing it yet.  I don't think our guys are any less from a basketball IQ than what he had at Dayton.  I just get frustrated with watching other teams players have break out nights against us and we still have the same weave offense that stands around until we have to take a bad shot.  I see very little emotion from the players during games.  Lots of standing around and once beat on D we just give up.  I don't see players rushing the boards or scrambling to recover. They just stand there and watch.   I know this is not all of them but it sure feels like most of them this year.

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43 minutes ago, Billingsley99 said:

I can't disagree with that but when you have more talent and you play hard good things happen. I do not feel that this team plays very hard, there is no extra effort. Body language speaks volumes. If this was my high school team they would run until they quit completely or got so pissed off that they did something about it. 

My father in law hates IU with a passion loves UL. He has watched everyone of our games and he keeps saying that in his opinion our guys look like that hate being out there. I know that its not all about having fun and I myself have said and my wife reminds me of it that winning is what makes you happy and cures a lot of things but our guys look down right miserable. Either our players don't have what it takes or the coaches cant get it out of them. Either way there is too much talent to go to NW and us as fans expecting a loss.  We are getting out hustled out worked and out coached its not a good combo

Well put, however, I just can not find myself to put blame on the coaching staff just yet. With several pending circumstances, this team is shy of a season ending disaster. I say that because it has to start with a much needed win and then coaches and players can start to feel a sense of worth and pride. I am not saying that the coaching staff is exempt from issues this team is currently having.

The players have to put in the work, perform under pressure, understand the directives and execute their assignments better than the other team. During Archie's press conference last night, two reports asked him two different questions and his responses really caught my attention. Click on the link below and then start watching at the 3:50 mark and stop at 4:43. See what you think....

 https://indiana.rivals.com/news/from-the-locker-room-northwestern-indiana

Archie is visibly frustrated and disappointed, but Archie is very driven, driven by success and results.... all done HIS way. At Dayton, Archie got the best out of the players he recruited. Some coaches buckle or sway from their objectives. He obviously plans to ride six or seven player all year long until someone on that bench steps up. He obviously has a plan and objectives, but they are not up to his standards. In the last part of the press conference, a reporter asked about Devonte and his situation. Archie became ICE COLD and visibly frustrated. He would not even extend any credit or information. It was almost as if "that ship has sailed!"

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11 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

What elite hire could you have made when we were looking for a coach the last time.  Don't give me Stevens or Donovan because that was never going to happen.  Why would coaches like Wright or Bennett leave there stable jobs where they can accomplish everything at their current jobs that they could at IU.

You are making the argument for us that we should not be complacent with the past 20 years. We want and expect more and we want to be at that top level. Once upon a time almost any coach would have jumped at the opportunity to be our coach. We have accepted middle of the pack and when we question it some fans say we are going after the coach.  

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4 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

What elite hire could you have made when we were looking for a coach the last time.  Don't give me Stevens or Donovan because that was never going to happen.  Why would coaches like Wright or Bennett leave there stable jobs where they can accomplish everything at their current jobs that they could at IU.

Money and a willingness to actually hire an elite coach.  My point is IU never tried to make that hire in any real meaningful way.

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2 minutes ago, Billingsley99 said:

You are making the argument for us that we should not be complacent with the past 20 years. We want and expect more and we want to be at that top level. Once upon a time almost any coach would have jumped at the opportunity to be our coach. We have accepted middle of the pack and when we question it some fans say we are going after the coach.  

Exactly, thank you!

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