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What's up with our crowd?


AxnJxn

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2 hours ago, IUwins0708 said:

Fred Glass seat is HOT.  As far as Trustees go Allen better make a bowl next year and Archie better make the tourney at a minimum or there could be a huge turnover.  Lot of turmoil in the IU athletic department currently and it’s not just the basketball team issues.

Curious if you can share anything else? Is it purely winning or lack thereof? Or are certain trustees just finally waking up?

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3 of the trustees are sick and tired of the excuses.  On the football field they aren’t wanting more than a bowl every season and maybe a lightning in a bottle season where they win 8-9 games.  Basketball is a different animal.  I was told (not sure of the validity of it) that around half of the trustees didn’t like/want the Archie hire.  Also Archie isn’t the easiest person to talk to either.  Similar to Crean he doesn’t think the trustees understand what it takes for a winning program. (He May be correct too) I think both coaches have a very short leash so to speak.  One of our favorite sports announcers is very close to 3-4 of the trustees.....🤦‍♂️

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1 minute ago, IUwins0708 said:

3 of the trustees are sick and tired of the excuses.  On the football field they aren’t wanting more than a bowl every season and maybe a lightning in a bottle season where they win 8-9 games.  Basketball is a different animal.  I was told (not sure of the validity of it) that around half of the trustees didn’t like/want the Archie hire.  Also Archie isn’t the easiest person to talk to either.  Similar to Crean he doesn’t think the trustees understand what it takes for a winning program. (He May be correct too) I think both coaches have a very short leash so to speak.  One of our favorite sports announcers is very close to 3-4 of the trustees.....🤦‍♂️

Thanks. Happy to hear there is at least some rumblings. The scenario you said is all I want. Bowl each year. One special season every full recruiting class. I don't care if Archie is easy to speak with and I'm not real worried about what some of the trustees think....but we're all IU fans and they eye test says business better pick up some steam next year for both football and basketball. Unless our goal is to be Illinois. 

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1 hour ago, CauseThatsMyDJ said:

 

Sorry, but fans like you are going to have to get over the 18 years before Archie. He has nothing to do with it.

No, I really do not have to get over anything.  I can take the past 16 to 17 years of ineptness and hold that against Fred Glass and those above him.  I can learn from that prior mistake of thinking, "things are suddenly going to change in the face of all of this current evidence if only X, Y, and Z happen" and decide that I am not in for another 5 year rebuild that is bolstered by excuse after excuse from the admin, coach, and some fans.  Feel free to do you, but I am done with that.

We can all make our decisions on how much time Archie has before we consider him worth more time or a lost cause.  My breaking point is next year and I won't be alone.

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3 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

No, I really do not have to get over anything.  I can take the past 16 to 17 years of ineptness and hold that against Fred Glass and those above him.  I can learn from that prior mistake of thinking, "things are suddenly going to change in the face of all of this current evidence if only X, Y, and Z happen" and decide that I am not in for another 5 year rebuild that is bolstered by excuse after excuse from the admin, coach, and some fans.  Feel free to do you, but I am done with that.

We can all make our decisions on how much time Archie has before we consider him worth more time or a lost cause.  My breaking point is next year and I won't be alone.

Holding Glass accountable for the 6-7 years before he was hired is also a bold strategy.

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10 minutes ago, IUwins0708 said:

3 of the trustees are sick and tired of the excuses.  On the football field they aren’t wanting more than a bowl every season and maybe a lightning in a bottle season where they win 8-9 games.  Basketball is a different animal.  I was told (not sure of the validity of it) that around half of the trustees didn’t like/want the Archie hire.  Also Archie isn’t the easiest person to talk to either.  Similar to Crean he doesn’t think the trustees understand what it takes for a winning program. (He May be correct too) I think both coaches have a very short leash so to speak.  One of our favorite sports announcers is very close to 3-4 of the trustees.....🤦‍♂️

Sincere question since I’m not in meetings, at practices, etc.  Are the trustees part of the problem?  Are they micromanaging?  Are they being patient enough? If they don’t like the hire, are they working against the hire?  I guess I’m thinking that just because the BOT isn’t happy doesn’t mean the problems are elsewhere.  Daniel Snyder of the Redskins comes to mind if that analogy makes sense.

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2 minutes ago, thirdgenhoosier said:

Sincere question since I’m not in meetings, at practices, etc.  Are the trustees part of the problem?  Are they micromanaging?  Are they being patient enough? If they don’t like the hire, are they working against the hire?  I guess I’m thinking that just because the BOT isn’t happy doesn’t mean the problems are elsewhere.  Daniel Snyder of the Redskins comes to mind if that analogy makes sense.

Valid point and question.  I’m getting this info from a BOT that isn’t one of the 3-4 I talked about above.  

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8 hours ago, AxnJxn said:

I realize this team has struggled, and it can sometimes be difficult to get excited for games, it was a late start, blah, blah, blah. But, the crowd last night was quiet from the tip, and even when we cut it to 3 late, they were pretty much non existent. This is the same fan base that packed the place when we were fielding a team of walkons early in the Crean regime, so I'm not sure I get it. We were coming off a huge win, and were looking at a chance to turn the season around, and last night was a complete dud in a number of ways, including crowd support. What gives?

Have you been to a game lately. Over half of season ticket holders are in their 70's and 80's. Most were a sleep, past their bedtime, in their seats before tip off.

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Just now, CauseThatsMyDJ said:

Luckily Quinn Buckner IS a trustee and has already been proven, Dakich holds no sway.

I believe he and Dakich have some sort of beef as he isn’t one of the ones mentioned and I was surprised by that. Quinn keeps to himself more than most of the trustees and you are correct, the rest of them look to him when it comes to both Football and basketball 

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5 minutes ago, CauseThatsMyDJ said:

Holding Glass accountable for the 6-7 years before he was hired is also a bold strategy.

That is the way the world tends to work.  If I am hired to clean up after the guy before me and I fail to clean up his mess and add more of my own mess to it, I get blamed for both.  You don't get to tell your employer, "yeah, that guy before me messed that up so you cannot hold it against me..."  I absolutely can if you were hired to fix it.

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2 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

That is the way the world tends to work.  If I am hired to clean up after the guy before me and I fail to clean up his mess and add more of my own mess to it, I get blamed for both.  You don't get to tell your employer, "yeah, that guy before me messed that up so you cannot hold it against me..."  I absolutely can if you were hired to fix it.

Maybe the world you live in. Definitely not the norm.

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3 hours ago, TheWatShot said:

2004: "Davis just needs time. Be patient. He'll turn things around!"

2007: "Sampson just needs time to clean up the mess Davis left behind."

2011: "Crean just needs time to clean up the mess Sampson left behind. Be patient. He'll turn things around!"

2019: "Archie just needs time to clean up the mess Crean left behind. Be patient. He'll turn things around!"

 

This pattern spans four different coaches and nearly two decades. No matter how optimistic you are, at some point, you have to begin to acknowledge that maybe this never gets fixed, right? I think our crowds reflect this.

Are you speaking from the AD's POV or the "patient" fans that aren't calling for a coach's firing 1.5 seasons in?

2004: No one I knew thought Davis was the answer and the FF run was either a fluke or in spite of Davis not b/c of him. We all felt he wasn't the answer from the start and that he got the job b/c of the player's threat to not play for anyone else. The FF run bought him unfortunate extra years that set back the program that started to decline in CBK's final years.

2007: Sampson wasn't around long enough to require patience. He came in and brought in players and won while he was here. Then the bomb went off and blew up IUBB for years.

2011: Crean most definitely needed time to clean up the mess that Sampson left behind given he returned next to nothing to work with.

2019: Archie needs time to implement his system and get his players on the team. Every coach in recent history replacing fired coaches typically does. Replacing coaches that left for a better job isn't the same (like Self replacing Roy at KU).

 

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5 minutes ago, CauseThatsMyDJ said:

Maybe the world you live in. Definitely not the norm.

That is absolutely the norm DJ.  That is the norm at every employer I have ever worked for.  The last guy is not getting the job done and they hire IUCrazy to take over.  When I come into the job, I am told that there is this mess that needs cleaned up, get to it.  At that point, it is no longer the other guy's mess, it is mine.  If it is not cleaned up, I get the blame.

The fact it happened on the other guy's watch is immaterial after he is out the door.  I either clean it up or I get the blame for not having it cleaned up.  The other guy is gone, nobody gives a crap about him anymore.  It is only compounded if I not only do not clean the mess up, but I also add to the problem.  That is where Glass currently finds himself.  If Archie does not get it done and if Allen does not uptick back to where Wilson was at when Fred fired him, then he gets to own everything.  He failed to clean up the mess and he failed to get the ship righted.  And his replacement will inherit everything before until such point where we actually get things humming again.

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8 minutes ago, jefftheref said:

I am in my 60's and you just described me. Ouch!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

4 minutes ago, Indykev said:

😂

I'm in my 60's too!  I fell asleep during the last 10min of the first half on my couch at home. However, I did sell my tickets to someone younger.  Does that make me more acceptable?  LOL

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Morgan is a really good player. DeRon is slow but at times is effectively . Devonte is so up and down unfortunately he is down more then up. The team played hard got themselves back in the game  only 3 down late had the ball . Two poor shots and two turnovers, three of these were committed by the same player. We are down ten again, in a matter of two minutes. Archie problem is he doesn’t have anyone he can but in to replace this player. His starters need a rest. That’s our bench! These or upperclassmen for god sake. Let’s give Archie time he will deliver. 

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2 hours ago, Bowhunter said:

Fans are tired of losing!

You're right, they are.....and I can only imagine how the people that are investing all the hours, sweat, blood, and probably tears, feel.

I get the angst. But after all, we're just a bunch of fans. We spend a couple of hours once or twice a week watching a game, maybe a few more pounding away on a keyboard posting on sites like these. We pontificate, critique, take pot shots, laugh and show anger....and then we walk away. A game ends and we either puff our chests out (MSU) or are despondent ( too often this season). We go back to our lives. Our families friends and loved ones. Our jobs. Nothing has really changed for us in a meaningful way. We haven't had every second of our job performance dissected and put under a microscope. 

I just think that it's time for us (collectively) to step back and take a breath. If the games are becoming that unenjoyable, find something else to do. 

I don't ever want to see this board, or this fan base devolve into those folks just south of us. 

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54 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

That is absolutely the norm DJ.  That is the norm at every employer I have ever worked for.  The last guy is not getting the job done and they hire IUCrazy to take over.  When I come into the job, I am told that there is this mess that needs cleaned up, get to it.  At that point, it is no longer the other guy's mess, it is mine.  If it is not cleaned up, I get the blame.

The fact it happened on the other guy's watch is immaterial after he is out the door.  I either clean it up or I get the blame for not having it cleaned up.  The other guy is gone, nobody gives a crap about him anymore.  It is only compounded if I not only do not clean the mess up, but I also add to the problem.  That is where Glass currently finds himself.  If Archie does not get it done and if Allen does not uptick back to where Wilson was at when Fred fired him, then he gets to own everything.  He failed to clean up the mess and he failed to get the ship righted.  And his replacement will inherit everything before until such point where we actually get things humming again.

Sorry, it's just not true. Chris Ballard is not being held responsible for the giant dump Ryan Grigson took on the Colts organization. Andrew Luck isn't responsible for the Curtis Painter season, that's not part of his record. Likewise, Glass is not responsible for his predecessor, nor is Archie.

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29 minutes ago, Steubenhoosier said:

You're right, they are.....and I can only imagine how the people that are investing all the hours, sweat, blood, and probably tears, feel.

I get the angst. But after all, we're just a bunch of fans. We spend a couple of hours once or twice a week watching a game, maybe a few more pounding away on a keyboard posting on sites like these. We pontificate, critique, take pot shots, laugh and show anger....and then we walk away. A game ends and we either puff our chests out (MSU) or are despondent ( too often this season). We go back to our lives. Our families friends and loved ones. Our jobs. Nothing has really changed for us in a meaningful way. We haven't had every second of our job performance dissected and put under a microscope. 

I just think that it's time for us (collectively) to step back and take a breath. If the games are becoming that unenjoyable, find something else to do. 

I don't ever want to see this board, or this fan base devolve into those folks just south of us. 

It's classic I/R theory. Some people are unable to separate their identity from their role as an IU fan.

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12 minutes ago, CauseThatsMyDJ said:

Sorry, it's just not true. Chris Ballard is not being held responsible for the giant dump Ryan Grigson took on the Colts organization. Andrew Luck isn't responsible for the Curtis Painter season, that's not part of his record. Likewise, Glass is not responsible for his predecessor, nor is Archie.

Wrong.  If Chris Ballard had continued losing like Grigson, he absolutely would start to take the blame for it.  You are bringing up instances where guys were hired to do a clean up job and they are succeeding in that job.  If Luck had sucked as bad as Painter he would have been lumped in as, "another crappy Colts quarterback who could not take over after Manning left...."  

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13 minutes ago, CauseThatsMyDJ said:

It's classic I/R theory. Some people are unable to separate their identity from their role as an IU fan.

Nonsense, this is a small part of life.  It is a diversion.  And I have been taking the advice to walk away more often than not lately...as has a growing segment of our fanbase.  Then we get people telling us we are not "true fans"....

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45 minutes ago, Steubenhoosier said:

You're right, they are.....and I can only imagine how the people that are investing all the hours, sweat, blood, and probably tears, feel.

I get the angst. But after all, we're just a bunch of fans. We spend a couple of hours once or twice a week watching a game, maybe a few more pounding away on a keyboard posting on sites like these. We pontificate, critique, take pot shots, laugh and show anger....and then we walk away. A game ends and we either puff our chests out (MSU) or are despondent ( too often this season). We go back to our lives. Our families friends and loved ones. Our jobs. Nothing has really changed for us in a meaningful way. We haven't had every second of our job performance dissected and put under a microscope. 

I just think that it's time for us (collectively) to step back and take a breath. If the games are becoming that unenjoyable, find something else to do. 

I don't ever want to see this board, or this fan base devolve into those folks just south of us. 

We are those folks just south of us and we always have been.  They accepted cheating and we accepted a jerk, because winning.

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No one is expecting miracles but you have to keep trending up in the right direction.  We were .500 in conference last season and probably should've finished even better.  We have a much better roster this season so we'd better finish .500 in conference at least or someone's seat will be on fire.

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