iuthruandthru Posted October 29, 2017 Report Share Posted October 29, 2017 Maybe we shoulda went after Leach when we had the chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rico Posted October 29, 2017 Report Share Posted October 29, 2017 18 hours ago, TheWatShot said: This might be harsh, but I'm honestly getting tired of this football program. Tired of being the worst program in the Big Ten. Tired of going decades without beating teams. Tired of having unbalanced teams. Tired of seeing mistakes that aren't corrected. Tired of...everything. Rant over. Completely understood But I bet there are many on here that have suffered longer than you have. There are times when I long for the next Bill Mallory to walk through the door. Man, those were great years for IU football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Payday Posted October 30, 2017 Author Report Share Posted October 30, 2017 On 10/29/2017 at 2:15 PM, iuthruandthru said: Maybe we shoulda went after Leach when we had the chance. Four things are gospel about Leach: He is always going to be the smartest coach in the room, he is always going to be the most entertaining coach in the room, he is always going to win, and he will always wear on some people and likely flame out.And he would have been a hell of a catch for three or four years to build the program. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leathernecks Posted October 30, 2017 Report Share Posted October 30, 2017 I agree that Leach is a good coach, but even he was 12-25 his first 3 seasons at Washington State. It takes time to build a team to suit your style. I don't see why there is so much negativity regarding Allen around here. He hasn't even coached a full season yet. Also with Leach, he was fired from Texas Tech for mistreating players. No way we hire him right after firing a coach for the same thing. I don't think he would have wanted to come here anyways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iuthruandthru Posted November 1, 2017 Report Share Posted November 1, 2017 Oh I agree we need more time for Allen. I’m not throwing him under the bus just yet. Though I am concerned about where the offense is headed. But we need more time before we can make any real analysis. My Leech comment was more just wondering what if. But nothing is certain in life and especially IU football 🏈 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milehiiu Posted November 1, 2017 Report Share Posted November 1, 2017 On 10/29/2017 at 2:55 PM, rico said: Completely understood But I bet there are many on here that have suffered longer than you have. There are times when I long for the next Bill Mallory to walk through the door. Man, those were great years for IU football. There are those that say firing Knight was IU's greatest mistake. I put the firing of Bill Mallory above the firing of Knight. One simple thing.... even after being fired by IU... Bill Mallory had no issues with stepping back foot on campus. Yep.... worst mistake IU made in terms of head coaches, IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rico Posted November 1, 2017 Report Share Posted November 1, 2017 7 hours ago, milehiiu said: There are those that say firing Knight was IU's greatest mistake. I put the firing of Bill Mallory above the firing of Knight. One simple thing.... even after being fired by IU... Bill Mallory had no issues with stepping back foot on campus. Yep.... worst mistake IU made in terms of head coaches, IMHO. I concur. It was a huge blunder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jblaz13 Posted November 1, 2017 Report Share Posted November 1, 2017 Some believe IU should have searched longer when making the decision to replace Wilson .That may have been true but after seeing how Allen does with a healthy team, calling for Allen's job so soon is just outright impulsive, given he has anything BUT a healthy team to work with in his first season as HC.I recall prior to IU going to a bowl under Wilson some called for his job for that last 5-7 finish in 2014.THAT was too soon even after Wilson had been here for several seasons, but we all recall how Wilson's teams showed a fight that made them endearing. Allen Hoosiers fight for 60 minutes, and they also compete every week.Are they executing for 60 minutes yet? No, but without a formidable O-line to go every play in the trenches, who could expect that unless you run the triple option? Speaking of , I wonder if Cam Cameron would ever be interested in the OC job here ? lol Jokes aside, something tells me that wouldn't work out so bad pairing his offense with Allen's defense, as some have mentioned. Getting record level production out of mobile QBs, with good skill position players, and OLs that can't pass block are his forte. it's a good thing i'm not the AD, right ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 1, 2017 Report Share Posted November 1, 2017 So, we're talking about what has historically been the worst program in the history of the conference. We're talking about a team that probably plays in the toughest division of any of the Big 5 conferences. We're talking about a team who has lost to 4 teams who were ranked in the top 20 when we played them, and we played all of them relatively close. We're talking about a head coach that has one recruiting class he can call his own. We're talking about a program that still needs to build depth. Not sure how there can be any justified or rational discussion on replacing Allen. I do think that DeBord either needs to make major improvements in the last third of the schedule this year, or he should be replaced. Looking in the rearview mirror and wishing about woulda, coulda, shoulda, is the perfect recipe for continued mediocrity. Glass needs to give Allen some time to fully establish himself, including a full recruiting cycle, before even thinking about being concerned. Product on the field has been improved. Attendance is up. We have played on two nationally televised games this year. There really is nothing to talk about here at present. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seeking6 Posted November 1, 2017 Report Share Posted November 1, 2017 11 hours ago, milehiiu said: There are those that say firing Knight was IU's greatest mistake. I put the firing of Bill Mallory above the firing of Knight. One simple thing.... even after being fired by IU... Bill Mallory had no issues with stepping back foot on campus. Yep.... worst mistake IU made in terms of head coaches, IMHO. Wanted to comment on this. Mallory was great. Consistent bowl games and considering that we spent about $100 per year on football during his tenure his results were great! With that said...I was a student during his last years. His offense (off tackle right, off tackle right, off tackle right and punt) was so boring/predictable I think the entire program needed a new perspective. Obviously results didn't follow but Mallory's time was up. And to his credit (and no surprise) he handled everything with absolute class. I used to wait on players/recruits/coaches on Sunday morning during football season. Coach Mallory was 100% class and respectful to us. Plenty of coaches could learn from him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rico Posted November 1, 2017 Report Share Posted November 1, 2017 IMHO......Mallory had built the program up so far, everybody wanted more. And he wasn't delivering in the end so to speak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Payday Posted November 1, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 1, 2017 4 hours ago, Jerry Lundergaard said: So, we're talking about what has historically been the worst program in the history of the conference. We're talking about a team that probably plays in the toughest division of any of the Big 5 conferences. We're talking about a team who has lost to 4 teams who were ranked in the top 20 when we played them, and we played all of them relatively close. We're talking about a head coach that has one recruiting class he can call his own. We're talking about a program that still needs to build depth. Not sure how there can be any justified or rational discussion on replacing Allen. I do think that DeBord either needs to make major improvements in the last third of the schedule this year, or he should be replaced. Looking in the rearview mirror and wishing about woulda, coulda, shoulda, is the perfect recipe for continued mediocrity. Glass needs to give Allen some time to fully establish himself, including a full recruiting cycle, before even thinking about being concerned. Product on the field has been improved. Attendance is up. We have played on two nationally televised games this year. There really is nothing to talk about here at present. There might be room for concern because we played Maryland and MSU last year and won. We played a much tougher non conference last year, and we played Ohio, the Michigan’s, and Penn/Nebraska and were overall closer except for Michigan and I don’t think anyone would expect them to give up over a 160 yards and still win in d1. The defense looks exhausted and against the teams with a real offense Penn, Ohio, and I guess Maryland, they look exposed. You would hope that if there was a hiring where nobody else is interviewed that it is of such a caliber that the team does not regress the next year. It is clear now that we have taken a step back. The surprise to the season, I think, is how poorly the defense is playing against decent teams and it is hard to consider Maryland a decent offensive team but maybe they are with their third team qb. I think they will pull it together this week, Wisconsin hasn’t really played anyone, but going to Purdue is a very dangerous game. One slip and we are done. We win this weekend and we are in good shape for a bowl even though it is a lesser accumulation of wins against good teams than last year. The Charleston high school game really drags down the bowl weighting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CauseThatsMyDJ Posted November 1, 2017 Report Share Posted November 1, 2017 Charleston Southern game will only matter if we are 5-7. If we get to 6, we are bowling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leathernecks Posted November 1, 2017 Report Share Posted November 1, 2017 Lynch went 5-7 his last year, and Wilson went 1-11 his first year. Does that mean we should have fired Wilson? Of course not. We've lost one game that we were favored to win, played with the #2 team in the country for 3 quarters, and were really close to pulling off upsets against two top 25 teams. We still have our three "easiest" games ahead of us. Even if we don't get to 6 wins, we'll be fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmax Posted November 1, 2017 Report Share Posted November 1, 2017 3 hours ago, Leathernecks said: Lynch went 5-7 his last year, and Wilson went 1-11 his first year. Does that mean we should have fired Wilson? Of course not. We've lost one game that we were favored to win, played with the #2 team in the country for 3 quarters, and were really close to pulling off upsets against two top 25 teams. We still have our three "easiest" games ahead of us. Even if we don't get to 6 wins, we'll be fine. Yep, I'm right here with you. I think being as close as we have in so many games against some big time programs has made the expectations somewhat unrealistic. Got to give Allen time to recruit and build the program. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogue3542 Posted November 2, 2017 Report Share Posted November 2, 2017 IU is currently ranked 30th in total defense. 30th! Last year they finished at 45, and the defense in 15-16 before Tom Allen....120. SIX of IU's opponents this year are ranked ahead of IU in this category, which should tell you the quality and difficulty of IU's schedule, which is much harder than last year's, and may just be the most difficult schedule they've ever had. Sure, the defense could be better, but it is absolutely not the reason IU hasn't won more games. That lies mostly with the offensive line and lack of a running game (which go hand-in-hand) coupled with having to compromise arm strength for accuracy/mobility at the qb position. Look at the offense in 15-16: ranked 14, then it drops to 56 last year, and this year it's currently ranked 84. In 15-16 IU had Sudfeld and Howard as well as a much more experienced and stout offensive line. Without those two last year, the offense takes a huge step back, and now this year, the line is nowhere close to what it was two years ago. Most of IU's problems this year are a direct result of Wilson's inadequate recruiting on the offensive side of the ball (except maybe the receivers). Wilson wouldn't be doing any better with what there is to work with on the offensive side of the ball right now, and if not for Coach Allen, this would be an absolutely dismal season. It's not like I think Allen walks on water or something, but I do believe that long-term he is going to be one of the best football coaches IU has ever had, if not the best, and any talk of firing is categorically preposterous in his first year. Also, the only step back that IU has taken this year is clearly on the offensive side of the ball, which will obviously be Allen's biggest challenge moving forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rico Posted November 2, 2017 Report Share Posted November 2, 2017 How many years in a row did we have a stud RB? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kodos Posted November 2, 2017 Report Share Posted November 2, 2017 At least Coleman, Coleman, Howard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogue3542 Posted November 2, 2017 Report Share Posted November 2, 2017 4 hours ago, Kodos said: At least Coleman, Coleman, Howard. Even Redding was pretty good last year, but the o-line issues didn't help. It looks like Ellison will be pretty good in the future, but he's going to need more blocking than we have right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CauseThatsMyDJ Posted November 3, 2017 Report Share Posted November 3, 2017 Can’t leave out Stephen Houston. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Payday Posted November 3, 2017 Author Report Share Posted November 3, 2017 On 11/1/2017 at 8:13 PM, rogue3542 said: IU is currently ranked 30th in total defense. 30th! Last year they finished at 45, and the defense in 15-16 before Tom Allen....120. SIX of IU's opponents this year are ranked ahead of IU in this category, which should tell you the quality and difficulty of IU's schedule, which is much harder than last year's, and may just be the most difficult schedule they've ever had. Sure, the defense could be better, but it is absolutely not the reason IU hasn't won more games. That lies mostly with the offensive line and lack of a running game (which go hand-in-hand) coupled with having to compromise arm strength for accuracy/mobility at the qb position. Look at the offense in 15-16: ranked 14, then it drops to 56 last year, and this year it's currently ranked 84. In 15-16 IU had Sudfeld and Howard as well as a much more experienced and stout offensive line. Without those two last year, the offense takes a huge step back, and now this year, the line is nowhere close to what it was two years ago. Most of IU's problems this year are a direct result of Wilson's inadequate recruiting on the offensive side of the ball (except maybe the receivers). Wilson wouldn't be doing any better with what there is to work with on the offensive side of the ball right now, and if not for Coach Allen, this would be an absolutely dismal season. It's not like I think Allen walks on water or something, but I do believe that long-term he is going to be one of the best football coaches IU has ever had, if not the best, and any talk of firing is categorically preposterous in his first year. Also, the only step back that IU has taken this year is clearly on the offensive side of the ball, which will obviously be Allen's biggest challenge moving forward. " 2 hours ago, rogue3542 said: Even Redding was pretty good last year, but the o-line issues didn't help. It looks like Ellison will be pretty good in the future, but he's going to need more blocking than we have right now. 12 hours ago, rico said: How many years in a row did we have a stud RB? Is there anyone on in football, at any level, who would have advised Redding to leave? One day I hope I get to hear the back story on that. A guy with his strength running behind an inexperienced line would have really helped. Every team has injuries his time of year, Allen making a deal out of that was a rookie move, but when you have young players with this development time you are certainly prone to more injuries and we have them. But we need to remember we lost a RB and at least two linemen that we thought were going to be here and instead took their shot at the NFL. We gave up a blindside hit fumble against Ohio inside the ten and I promise you that if Redding had been here we would never have dropped back at that point. We miss Redding and the linemen, especially at this time of the season. But, Wisconsin has injuries also and they are coming to town. They have not been tested, we have a good shot I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milehiiu Posted November 3, 2017 Report Share Posted November 3, 2017 I am with Payday. Nothing would serve me more than to take Wisconsin down. Actually, if we have any thoughts of making a bowl appearance... it is a must. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kodos Posted November 3, 2017 Report Share Posted November 3, 2017 Would love to beat Wisconsin, but they've been so dominant over us that it is hard to believe we can beat them. Different coaches, different players... let's hope for a different result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobSaccamanno Posted November 3, 2017 Report Share Posted November 3, 2017 Good posts, Rogue. The offensive line has been...well...offensive. Brandon Knight is a really good athlete but durability has been a challenge there. Cronk played like a 5 star his freshman year, but has taken a step back this year as he's growing into his body. I'd argue that Stepaniak and Littlejohn are not good foot athletes. The good news is that this group is really young and can be a more cohesive unit in the next couple of years. There were some good reports on Caleb Jones in practice. I believe he's redshirting and should be a very good tackle in time. Cronk will have two more years and the chance to be a four year starter. Wes Martin has one more year, I believe, as does Brandon Knight. Crider is a freshman and shows promise. Nworah has been playing due to injuries to other guys and getting some experience. One of our top recruits is an offensive lineman, Aidan Rafferty. A couple of years down the road, he could be a contributor, but he won't need to be rushed in unless there are injury problems. Our top recruit overall is a RB and with Ellison, I think we will have a nice running tandem and a more experienced offensive line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leathernecks Posted November 3, 2017 Report Share Posted November 3, 2017 Does anybody know anything about our offensive line coach Darren Hiller? It says he is offensive line coach/running game coordinator. I haven't been impressed with either of those things, but I know we are young in both places. Looking at his bio on the IU website, it looks pretty decent leading up to coming here, so I'm hopeful he's able to whip them into shape at some point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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