Edward Smith at it again

[BGleas]

Just now, IUFLA said:

You don't think he'd transfer under those conditions? I do...

That's his decision, and he probably would. I was more posting it from the viewpoint of Archie and whether to keep him. But, you can't play him right now, he has no energy, passion, or confidence and is just really hurting the team when he's out there. 

[IU Scott]

6 minutes ago, BGleas said:

Justin Smith is a tough case. On one hand, he is absolutely killing this team right now. His Dad's tweets are irrelevant in terms of the product on the floor, Justin's play is killing this team on both ends. If I was the coach he would rarely see the floor the rest of the season.

With that said, Smith does have several attributes that if developed could be really beneficial to the team the next two years. So, do you cut bait and bring in another freshmen, which means removing a veteran and getting younger, or do you keep him and hope you can mold that clay and turn him into a highly productive upperclassmen, on a roster that needs upperclassmen and older players? It's really a tough decision. 

The easy decision though is that he should spend the rest of this season on the end of the bench, unless necessary. 

Wouldn't necessarily replace him with a freshman but could go the JC or grad transfer route.

[SIHoosier26]

4 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

You don't think he'd transfer under those conditions? I do...

Hopefully, he and his dad need to take it somewhere else.

[BGleas]

2 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

Wouldn't necessarily replace him with a freshman but could go the JC or grad transfer route.

True, though again you're bringing a new player in to replace a player you've invested two years in. I'm not advocating for it, as I think Smith is killing this team right now, but also saying it's not as simple of a decision as it may seem. 

[IUFLA]

7 minutes ago, BGleas said:

That's his decision, and he probably would. I was more posting it from the viewpoint of Archie and whether to keep him. But, you can't play him right now, he has no energy, passion, or confidence and is just really hurting the team when he's out there. 

I agree with that. You could see the fact that he was benched affected his psyche in a very negative way against Minny. If he would have come out with an "I'll show you" attitude, I might think differently.

[SIHoosier26]

On 2/16/2019 at 9:55 PM, dgambill said:

Did they are was it just easier to cover up because there was only newspapers to report upset parents and the writers could sit on stories to get access to teams etc. hardly worth writing up a whole article on a dad saying coach isn’t doing s good job..there is nothing else to it. Dad is upset we are losing and the team is getting worse and Archie hasn’t changed up the offense or anything to get anyone more involved. Everyone is looking for a scape goat and Justin’s dad is just the easy target..anyone but who is actually running the team or on it.

The best thing Archie could do to "change it up" is to bury Justin on the bench until he transfers.

[dgambill]

6 minutes ago, SIHoosier26 said:

The best thing Archie could do to "change it up" is to bury Justin on the bench until he transfers.

So not put kids in position to best utilize their talents..open up the offense and grow some confidence in some guys...just bench one of your best players is the answer.

[5fouls]

6 minutes ago, dgambill said:

So not put kids in position to best utilize their talents..open up the offense and grow some confidence in some guys...just bench one of your best players is the answer.

While Smith may have the potential, he is not currently one of IU's best players.  Not even close.  

Morgan

Davis

Langford

Durham

Phinisee

Green

Thompson

Forrester

Moore

all seem like they are more likely to produce something more positive that than Smith is right now.  And, as a bonus, their dads are not using twitter to stir things up.

[Danomatic]

I don’t think that putting him on the end of the bench will do much for him. In fact, I find that old school philosophy to be more detrimental than beneficial nowadays. I grew up playing in the era where benching and tough love would either make or break you. However, I coach now and the kids playing the game today aren’t made the same. You can’t get through to them in those ways today. Archie has a mess on his hands.

[IU Scott]

48 minutes ago, BGleas said:

True, though again you're bringing a new player in to replace a player you've invested two years in. I'm not advocating for it, as I think Smith is killing this team right now, but also saying it's not as simple of a decision as it may seem. 

To me after the year Archie needs to clean house and get rid of the players who are causing the problems no matter who they are.  I want palayers here who want to be here and play for INDIANA and not the name on the back of the jersey.

[dgambill]

1 minute ago, IU Scott said:

To me after the year Archie needs to clean house and get rid of the players who are causing the problems no matter who they are.  I want palayers here who want to be here and play for INDIANA and not the name on the back of the jersey.

There is no name on the back of the jerseys...oh I got it...they are playing for nothing...that sounds about right.

[IU Scott]

27 minutes ago, dgambill said:

So not put kids in position to best utilize their talents..open up the offense and grow some confidence in some guys...just bench one of your best players is the answer.

How is he one of the best players or do you think his 48 inch vertical means he is a great players.  I think some see athletic ability as the same as basketball ability and it is clear that Smith is not a good BASKETBALL player.

[jefftheref]

9 hours ago, IUFLA said:

FIPs?

In Michigan we call them FISH!

[IU Scott]

2 minutes ago, dgambill said:

There is no name on the back of the jerseys...oh I got it...they are playing for nothing...that sounds about right.

If you are calling playing for $50,000 a year nothing then I guess you are right LOL!.  this mentality that these kids are being exploded or taken advantage of his so ridiculous but some I guess believe that fairy tale.

[Fiveoutofsix]

16 hours ago, milehiiu said:

Sorry. I am in disagreement here.  There is much value to this kid.  Just not showing it . Really think his dad needs to bow out of it.  Kid, to me is getting torn in different directions. 

To demonstrate Justin's makeup lets use direct quotes and published facts. Sometimes it is the makeup of the kid, and Justin can grow.  Here are quotes from Lance Irvin after the Chicago State game.  He of course is being vague, but it is relevant.  This is why you go get Hulls, Victor and not the Jeremy H and Smiths of the world.  UNLESS you can wait until they mature and you use the bemch for that.

A player that you and your family know well is Justin Smith, just talk about what you saw
form him tonight and the strides you have seen him make as a player?
"One thing I said about Justin is that he is learning how to consistently play hard. When we got 
him his sophomore year, he was playing hard but not as hard as he had to play. But now what he is doing is making himself especially different. He is going to the offense glass every time. And he is able to guard too. I saw last game that he started to step out and make some jump shots. He made some threes. He used to be kind of streaky. So, if he can consistently step out and make the jump shot that will be good for him. I like the pace he is playing with and how he consistently playing hard."

[milehiiu]

2 minutes ago, Fiveoutofsix said:

To demonstrate Justin's makeup lets use direct quotes and published facts. Sometimes it is the makeup of the kid, and Justin can grow.  Here are quotes from Lance Irvin after the Chicago State game.  He of course is being vague, but it is relevant.  This is why you go get Hulls, Victor and not the Jeremy H and Smiths of the world.  UNLESS you can wait until they mature and you use the bemch for that.

A player that you and your family know well is Justin Smith, just talk about what you saw
form him tonight and the strides you have seen him make as a player?
"One thing I said about Justin is that he is learning how to consistently play hard. When we got 
him his sophomore year, he was playing hard but not as hard as he had to play. But now what he is doing is making himself especially different. He is going to the offense glass every time. And he is able to guard too. I saw last game that he started to step out and make some jump shots. He made some threes. He used to be kind of streaky. So, if he can consistently step out and make the jump shot that will be good for him. I like the pace he is playing with and how he consistently playing hard."

Thanks for that. What I got from that, is that Justin just needs to figure things out.  Which is what I have been saying all along.

[Fiveoutofsix]

1 minute ago, milehiiu said:

Thanks for that. What I got from that, is that Justin just needs to figure things out.  Which is what I have been saying all along.

Exactly; however the question is can he?  I sure hope so because I enjoy watching the kid and his potential.  

[Zlinedavid]

[BGleas]

52 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

To me after the year Archie needs to clean house and get rid of the players who are causing the problems no matter who they are.  I want palayers here who want to be here and play for INDIANA and not the name on the back of the jersey.

I'm just commenting on his play on the court. I have no idea what is going on behind the scenes and I typically don't like to speculate on those things since we basically have zero actual facts. If there are real locker room issues that are sabotaging the season, then yes players contributing to that should probably move on. 

In terms of his play, Smith has killed this team in Big Ten play, but a coach needs to decide if he thinks a veteran/upperclassmen Smith, with some improvements and work (if he's willing) can be better than bringing in a new player that needs to get acclimated, learn, etc. 

Archie is the one that said IU needs to get old and stay old fast, which is difficult to do if the program loses guys like Smith and Green. But again, those two have been really bad and inconsistent, so the coach also has to gauge if he thinks the necessary improvement is realistic for guys like that. 

I am by no means advocating for bringing everyone back, just saying the decisions aren't as simple as how they're playing at the moment. There are complexities to the decisions. 

[dgambill]

3 hours ago, IU Scott said:

How is he one of the best players or do you think his 48 inch vertical means he is a great players.  I think some see athletic ability as the same as basketball ability and it is clear that Smith is not a good BASKETBALL player.

No hardly I’ve been making fun of the IU athletic department for months for releasing those videos. No but early in the season he was perhaps our best defender and he was playing well cutting to the basket and getting feeds from Juwan...he has his strengths and abilities but instead we ask him to stand around the 3pt line where he is worthless...let’s make better use of him. 

[dgambill]

3 hours ago, IU Scott said:

If you are calling playing for $50,000 a year nothing then I guess you are right LOL!.  this mentality that these kids are being exploded or taken advantage of his so ridiculous but some I guess believe that fairy tale.

That was so left field I got nothjng for you. I just made a joke that these kids are playing like they don’t care (for nothjng) because there is nothjng on the back. They look like they have packed it in. Sulking and playing to just get the season over.

[IU Scott]

1 minute ago, dgambill said:

That was so left field I got nothjng for you. I just made a joke that these kids are playing like they don’t care (for nothjng) because there is nothjng on the back. They look like they have packed it in. Sulking and playing to just get the season over.

My bad because I thought you were referring about not getting anything to play for the name on the front of the jersey.

[dgambill]

9 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

My bad because I thought you were referring about not getting anything to play for the name on the front of the jersey.

No worries..many have definitely given up on the front...and hopefully they will get their act together or pack their bags..I hope they show up tomorrow night with some pride.

[milehiiu]

1 hour ago, dgambill said:

No hardly I’ve been making fun of the IU athletic department for months for releasing those videos. No but early in the season he was perhaps our best defender and he was playing well cutting to the basket and getting feeds from Juwan...he has his strengths and abilities but instead we ask him to stand around the 3pt line where he is worthless...let’s make better use of him. 

And Romeo as well.  With the exception of a few, kids are not playing with the passion I have always come to expect from IU.  As an example.  Crean's first two years. Had kids who had no business, for the most part, being on the floor, playing in the BIG.  However for two years, those kids played with 1,000 times the passion this team with so much more talent is displaying right now.  I know the current team can play with passion. I saw it against Butler, Louisville and Michigan State. But for some reason, lately they haven't been playing with the passion I expect out of an IU team. And I can't lay the blame on the coaches.  For me, this is totally on the players.

[Coach1K]

As mile has said current team players read what gets posted and we've had current and former players' parents post on here and know the things we don't know but that doesn't mean that they should post it anywhere but they do it anyway.