NBA Thread

[BGleas]

4 hours ago, ATX_sig said:

Yeh but he became an all star last year and was even more efficient on the Warriors.   I could see where Wiggins would be a better fit as a 2 way player as opposed to Russell alongside  Klay and Steph.  Russell isn't very good defensively and this would certainly impact Curry.  I don't think it was a secret that while Russell is outstanding offensively that Warriors made the trade for him to have a big time asset they wanted to keep him or trade for assets.  If Wiigins finds efficiency along the trio of Superstars, the Warriors will look all genius here also landing the  future 1st round pick.  The fact that Wiggins has underachieved and all the noise that KAT has made about playing with Russell and being unhappy in Minny probably gave GS some leverage. 

My takeaway is that Jimmy Butler was exactly right in everything he said about Minny and KAT. KAT needs to grow up and do it quick. He’s so bad defensively that Minnesota hasn’t won a game that he’s played in since November. KAT has lost over 16 games in a row. 

[Hoosierhoopster]

49 minutes ago, BGleas said:

My takeaway is that Jimmy Butler was exactly right in everything he said about Minny and KAT. KAT needs to grow up and do it quick. He’s so bad defensively that Minnesota hasn’t won a game that he’s played in since November. KAT has lost over 16 games in a row. 

I think you’re right. 
Was thinking that maybe Butler has gotten a bad rap unfairly. Look at the teams he was on, including Minn, look at the locker room issues Philly is having now, and then look at how well he’s doing now in the well run organization and culture that Miami has. He’s thriving, and that team has really gelled. 
I was one who used to call him a locker room cancer. I may have been way off. Glad to see him doing well and hope his shoulder is ok 

[Seeking6]

1 hour ago, BGleas said:

My takeaway is that Jimmy Butler was exactly right in everything he said about Minny and KAT. KAT needs to grow up and do it quick. He’s so bad defensively that Minnesota hasn’t won a game that he’s played in since November. KAT has lost over 16 games in a row. 

Just my two cents. Wouldn't use Jimmy as the bastion of common sense or winning ways since he has accomplished either.

[BGleas]

7 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

Just my two cents. Wouldn't use Jimmy as the bastion of common sense or winning ways since he has accomplished either.

I don’t know, Minnesota has been to the playoffs once in 14 years. It was the one year they had Jimmy Butler. Everywhere he’s gone has gotten better with him and worse when he left. I’m not huge Jimmy Butler fan, but KAT is absolutely the problem there. 

[Hoosierhoopster]

10 hours ago, Seeking6 said:

Just my two cents. Wouldn't use Jimmy as the bastion of common sense or winning ways since he has accomplished either.

I was right there with you before, then I watched what he's done with Miami this year and started thinking back. 

As I said in my post above, I think I may have been way off base. He is definitely outspoken, and he does look out for himself money wise (but, really, who doesn't?), but, well, Butler seems to be be proving that he had a point in his comments in Chicago, Minn and Philli. Just look at those teams now, and look at what he's doing with Miami -- where he is getting praised both on and off the court.

[BGleas]

The dude is claiming he should be an all-star, yet hasn't been on the floor for a win since before the Thanksgiving. I know his team isn't great, but they're considerably worse defensively, and it's not even close, with him than without. 

[Seeking6]

9 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

I was right there with you before, then I watched what he's done with Miami this year and started thinking back. 

As I said in my post above, I think I may have been way off base. He is definitely outspoken, and he does look out for himself money wise (but, really, who doesn't?), but, well, Butler seems to be be proving that he had a point in his comments in Chicago, Minn and Philli. Just look at those teams now, and look at what he's doing with Miami -- where he is getting praised both on and off the court.

It's weird with Jimmy. Not a Bulls fan but I really liked him there....I think DWade said it best about being the right type of crazy that works for Jimmy/Miami. We'll see.He's like one of those guys that you think everything has finally fallen into place and boom he goes scorpion/tortoise fable.

[BGleas]

1 minute ago, Seeking6 said:

It's weird with Jimmy. Not a Bulls fan but I really liked him there....I think DWade said it best about being the right type of crazy that works for Jimmy/Miami. We'll see.He's like one of those guys that you think everything has finally fallen into place and boom he goes scorpion/tortoise fable.

Agree. He has a little bit of 'diva wide receiver' in him, where when you first acquire him the honeymoon is great. For the first year your team and fans love him. But, once that honeymoon ends it can get ugly fast. We'll see how he holds up in Miami. 

[Hoosierhoopster]

Agree with both of you, Seeking and Gleas, maybe I'm being premature here -- but then again, maybe we're seeing the difference of team culture, top to bottom, in Miami and how that works for him. Time will tell. Haven't been a Butler fan, but find myself kind of rooting for him to prove himself.

[Seeking6]

1 minute ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

Agree with both of you, Seeking and Gleas, maybe I'm being premature here -- but then again, maybe we're seeing the difference of team culture, top to bottom, in Miami and how that works for him. Time will tell. Haven't been a Butler fan, but find myself kind of rooting for him to prove himself.

I'm a DWade and Riley fan so I find myself in strange waters with Jimmy. Want it to work but time will tell. Real surprise of team is former Illini Kendrick Nunn. Great story so far because he finally decided to grow up. The downside to his success though might hurt college hoops. People (Khalil Whitney) might point to him and say see....I don't need to play in college or play great in college. Just go the G league route and set the league on fire.

[cybergates]

10 hours ago, BGleas said:

I don’t know, Minnesota has been to the playoffs once in 14 years. It was the one year they had Jimmy Butler. Everywhere he’s gone has gotten better with him and worse when he left. I’m not huge Jimmy Butler fan, but KAT is absolutely the problem there. 

KAT wants to/thinks he will be the greatest of all time. Laughable. He's overrated b/c he's a stat stuffer, but you're right he's the problem/not a winning player. Minnesota didn't get better/may have gotten worse with this trade, which says a lot b/c Wiggins isn't living up to his hype (other than for a short time at the beginning of this year). DR and KAT's pick and roll will be tough to stop, but neither of them have had any issues with scoring prior to this, so it's not an improvement. 

[IU Scott]

6 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

I'm a DWade and Riley fan so I find myself in strange waters with Jimmy. Want it to work but time will tell. Real surprise of team is former Illini Kendrick Nunn. Great story so far because he finally decided to grow up. The downside to his success though might hurt college hoops. People (Khalil Whitney) might point to him and say see....I don't need to play in college or play great in college. Just go the G league route and set the league on fire.

Nunn did play 4 years of college and went to Oakland after he left UI

[Seeking6]

1 minute ago, IU Scott said:

Nunn did play 4 years of college and went to Oakland after he left UI

Yep...and his time in college was filled with suspensions, dismissals, legal problems,etc....my point (again) is that players will point to his problems and say it still worked out well for him so why not me? You could have players on a team who have zero business entering the league but individually think they might be next Nunn.

All it takes is 1 guy to have success in an unconventional path....and the people in the kids camp will say that's you. 

[BGleas]

41 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

Yep...and his time in college was filled with suspensions, dismissals, legal problems,etc....my point (again) is that players will point to his problems and say it still worked out well for him so why not me? You could have players on a team who have zero business entering the league but individually think they might be next Nunn.

All it takes is 1 guy to have success in an unconventional path....and the people in the kids camp will say that's you. 

I don't understand what is unconventional about his path? He's not the first guy to go to a Power 5 school, transfer to a mid-major to finish his college career and then make the NBA?

[Seeking6]

1 minute ago, BGleas said:

I don't understand what is unconventional about his path? He's not the first guy to go to a Power 5 school, transfer to a mid-major to finish his college career and then make the NBA?

Unconventional in the sense that some will say why even bother with the headaches at said P5 school....just get career started. Knowing a few from Simeon where Nunn is from I can tell you the sentiment there is nothing Nunn did in college got him ready for NBA. 

[BGleas]

2 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

Unconventional in the sense that some will say why even bother with the headaches at said P5 school....just get career started. Knowing a few from Simeon where Nunn is from I can tell you the sentiment there is nothing Nunn did in college got him ready for NBA. 

I don't know, that seems like a stretch given that Nunn was in college for 4 years. I could buy this position if we were talking about Darius Bazley who skipped college to workout and then went into the draft, but we're talking about a guy that was in college for 4 years, right?

[Hoosierhoopster]

BGleas -- Any input on Romeo's recent start and 28 minutes of play, from the Celtics' perspective? 

[BGleas]

21 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

BGleas -- Any input on Romeo's recent start and 28 minutes of play, from the Celtics' perspective? 

It was good to see. He was really active defensively. Offensively, his role was basically to stand in the corner while Tatum, Brown and Hayward did their thing. Not fun, but can you really blame the Celtics? Those guys are playing at such a high level. 

But, in general Celtics fans seem pretty optimistic on Langford. He's played hard and really good defense when he's gotten in. Similar to IU, he's finishing well in traffic. Fans love his defensive intensity and there is a feeling that getting Langford comfortable and in the flow could actually be the Celtics big pickup for the second half, as opposed to having made a trade. 

[Seeking6]

Haha. Romeo might be good again. 

[IU Scott]

Pacers loses their 4th in a row with a 10 point loss at home to Toronto.  It appears to me that McMillian is sacrificing wins just to get VO time late in the game.  They had cut the lead too 2 with  a little over 6 minutes ad bring VO back in the game and then Toronto finished the game on a 14-6 run.  The ball just moves a lot better when VO is not in the game and it is just hard to watch.  To me Brogdon's game has been effected since VO return and has not looked the same.

Also in the off season the pacers have to trade Myles Turner because it is not working with him and Sabonis together.  the Pacers need more of a 6'10 athletic 4 who can rebound and play defense.  Turner can block shots but he is not a good defensive player on his own man.

[Hoosierhoopster]

Yeah - Romeo 5-11 for 16 points and 5 boards in 29 min, in a W. 
 

Romeo making the most of real playing time 

[Billingsley99]

9 hours ago, IU Scott said:

Pacers loses their 4th in a row with a 10 point loss at home to Toronto.  It appears to me that McMillian is sacrificing wins just to get VO time late in the game.  They had cut the lead too 2 with  a little over 6 minutes ad bring VO back in the game and then Toronto finished the game on a 14-6 run.  The ball just moves a lot better when VO is not in the game and it is just hard to watch.  To me Brogdon's game has been effected since VO return and has not looked the same.

Also in the off season the pacers have to trade Myles Turner because it is not working with him and Sabonis together.  the Pacers need more of a 6'10 athletic 4 who can rebound and play defense.  Turner can block shots but he is not a good defensive player on his own man.

I will take sacrificing some February wins if it helps us win a first round series.  I know that home court helps to win that first round but right now it's all about chemistry.  Without Vic we wont get past 1st round but with that group working together I could see a conference finals appearance 

[D-BONE]

9 hours ago, IU Scott said:

Pacers loses their 4th in a row with a 10 point loss at home to Toronto.  It appears to me that McMillian is sacrificing wins just to get VO time late in the game.  They had cut the lead too 2 with  a little over 6 minutes ad bring VO back in the game and then Toronto finished the game on a 14-6 run.  The ball just moves a lot better when VO is not in the game and it is just hard to watch.  To me Brogdon's game has been effected since VO return and has not looked the same.

Also in the off season the pacers have to trade Myles Turner because it is not working with him and Sabonis together.  the Pacers need more of a 6'10 athletic 4 who can rebound and play defense.  Turner can block shots but he is not a good defensive player on his own man.

Too many turnovers. Note: Sabonis with a whopping 6. Too porous perimeter D. Brogdon is turning to public enemy #1 when it comes to being unable to keep his man out of the lane. Raps are an excellent team. Ibaka is playing out of his mind. VO's play is not helping, but realistically you have to expect that it may take him the rest of the season to get anywhere near consistent, solid play coming off so much time out. Still hoping they can resolve some of the challenges sooner rather than later.

[D-BONE]

9 hours ago, IU Scott said:

Pacers loses their 4th in a row with a 10 point loss at home to Toronto.  It appears to me that McMillian is sacrificing wins just to get VO time late in the game.  They had cut the lead too 2 with  a little over 6 minutes ad bring VO back in the game and then Toronto finished the game on a 14-6 run.  The ball just moves a lot better when VO is not in the game and it is just hard to watch.  To me Brogdon's game has been effected since VO return and has not looked the same.

Also in the off season the pacers have to trade Myles Turner because it is not working with him and Sabonis together.  the Pacers need more of a 6'10 athletic 4 who can rebound and play defense.  Turner can block shots but he is not a good defensive player on his own man.

As to trading Turner, pending how the rest of the season plays out, it may be the right idea. Seems the Pacers want him to have a similar role to what Brooke Lopez does with Bucks - provide some 3s and be an elite shot blocker. Neither guy is a big rebounder for a C. I think Turner has done reasonably if that's what they're asking him to do. Overall, while the shot blocking has been there, I've always felt he's never quite developed the consistency and confidence from 3 to really elevate him to impact status on the offensive end. He's not bad, but he's just not a difference maker offensively.

Of course, back to the Lopez comparison, it would also help immensely if he could play off a Giannis, not to mention the remainder of the Bucks supporting cast, which - much like Toronto as a team - has a lot of length and athleticism. That's still a struggle for us. We have very few top shelf athletes by NBA standards. That's where you see backcourts and wings with excellent quickness penetrating at will on us resulting in good looks in the paint or from 3. 

[Artesian_86]

1 hour ago, Billingsley99 said:

I will take sacrificing some February wins if it helps us win a first round series.  I know that home court helps to win that first round but right now it's all about chemistry.  Without Vic we wont get past 1st round but with that group working together I could see a conference finals appearance 

Same.....Even after his injury, Vic is still too valuable and too talented for Pacers  Brass to make rash decisions......and they won’t. It’s the building chatter from fans that are frustrating me. Team chemistry, dynamics and individual player abilities are all on the coaching staff now.