rico Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 24 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: I'd love to package our pick and either Turner or Sabonis to GSW, then move Warreb to the 4, CL to the 3, Brogdon to 2, and draft Davion Mitchell. I think Mitchell will be there at #13.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 12 minutes ago, rico said: I think Mitchell will be there at #13.... He's projected to go 5-10, his stock is rising. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 37 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: I'd love to package our pick and either Turner or Sabonis to GSW, then move Warreb to the 4, CL to the 3, Brogdon to 2, and draft Davion Mitchell. I don’t think the Pacers are that far off if they make some smart moves. They have some really good pieces, they just need to clean up the Sabonis/Turner issue and find a true point guard. If I was Indy, I'd probably prefer to keep Sabonis, but he also probably has more trade value, and with the right pieces around Turner can be the main athletic big on a winning team. I'm just going off the top of my head, but what if you offer Sabonis to Cleveland for Colin Sexton? Not sure if Cleveland would do that, but if you can figure it out then in one move you solve the Sabonis/Turner issue and you get a young scoring point guard to go with Brogdon, Levert, Warren and Turner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 1 minute ago, BGleas said: I don’t think the Pacers are that far off if they make some smart moves. They have some really good pieces, they just need to clean up the Sabonis/Turner issue and find a true point guard. If I was Indy, I'd probably prefer to keep Sabonis, but he also probably has more trade value, and with the right pieces around Turner can be the main athletic big on a winning team. I'm just going off the top of my head, but what if you offer Sabonis to Cleveland for Colin Sexton? Not sure if Cleveland would do that, but if you can figure it out then in one move you solve the Sabonis/Turner issue and you get a young scoring point guard to go with Brogdon, Levert, Warren and Turner. I agree, I prefer to keep Sabonis but if you have to move him to get that piece then it's what you do. I would love to get Sexton! I think he is the type of guard that can come in have a Donovan Mitchell like impact in the playoffs, which the Pacers desperately need. Teams that make deep runs have that guy who can go get 40 in a big game, and to me that's the biggest thing the Pacers are missing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rico Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 1 minute ago, KoB2011 said: I agree, I prefer to keep Sabonis but if you have to move him to get that piece then it's what you do. I would love to get Sexton! I think he is the type of guard that can come in have a Donovan Mitchell like impact in the playoffs, which the Pacers desperately need. Teams that make deep runs have that guy who can go get 40 in a big game, and to me that's the biggest thing the Pacers are missing. The Pacers need a "Batman" for sure. Hell, I don't know if they even have a "Robin." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 4 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: I agree, I prefer to keep Sabonis but if you have to move him to get that piece then it's what you do. I would love to get Sexton! I think he is the type of guard that can come in have a Donovan Mitchell like impact in the playoffs, which the Pacers desperately need. Teams that make deep runs have that guy who can go get 40 in a big game, and to me that's the biggest thing the Pacers are missing. Completely agree, and next to Lavert then you have two legit scorers, with Turner a rim protecting/floor stretching big, Warren a 3 and D guy and Brogdon is a secondary playmaker. You're not beating a healthy Brooklyn with that lineup, but in a year like this year where injuries are impacting the playoffs, there's no reason with a few more tweaks that lineup couldn't be where Atlanta is. Edit: With how the NBA is going, Brooklyn might look completely different in 2 years. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 Looking at trade machine for what you through out @BGleas... You could do Pacers send Sabonis, Lamb and the 13th pick to Cleveland for Sexton and Love. With Love and Turner both having injury issues, I think you'd be playing them one at a time more than together. There would obviously be exceptions, but I wouldn't think they'd both be playing 30+ minutes per game very often. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 I think the Pacers have plenty of #2 and 3's on their team but we need a #1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 1 minute ago, BGleas said: Completely agree, and next to Lavert then you have two legit scorers, with Turner a rim protecting/floor stretching big, Warren a 3 and D guy and Brogdon is a secondary playmaker. You're not beating a healthy Brooklyn with that lineup, but in a year like this year where injuries are impacting the playoffs, there's no reason with a few more tweaks that lineup couldn't be where Atlanta is. I'm not sure anyone in the East beats a healthy Brooklyn. That's not just a Pacers problem, it's just hard to get a team with three guys like they have. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 Just now, KoB2011 said: Looking at trade machine for what you through out @BGleas... You could do Pacers send Sabonis, Lamb and the 13th pick to Cleveland for Sexton and Love. With Love and Turner both having injury issues, I think you'd be playing them one at a time more than together. There would obviously be exceptions, but I wouldn't think they'd both be playing 30+ minutes per game very often. I think that would be a homerun for the Pacers. That's why I wouldn't blow it up. The Pacers have a coach to win titles, and are realistically if they're smart and lucky, a move or two away from being right there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 Just now, KoB2011 said: I'm not sure anyone in the East beats a healthy Brooklyn. That's not just a Pacers problem, it's just hard to get a team with three guys like they have. Agree, and the goal for Indy, Boston, etc, is to be ready when Brooklyn blows it up. They're already talking about trading Kyrie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 2 minutes ago, IU Scott said: I think the Pacers have plenty of #2 and 3's on their team but we need a #1 Not talking about position but we need a batman and less Robin 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rico Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 3 minutes ago, IU Scott said: Not talking about position but we need a batman and less Robin I would settle for Superman and the Wonder Twins... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 2 minutes ago, IU Scott said: Not talking about position but we need a batman and less Robin Yeah, the Pacers current starting lineup has 4 guys that fall into the second to third option on a good team, plus Turner who is a good rim protector at the 5. We need that number 1 option badly. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 1 minute ago, KoB2011 said: Yeah, the Pacers current starting lineup has 4 guys that fall into the second to third option on a good team, plus Turner who is a good rim protector at the 5. We need that number 1 option badly. Yup, and that's why I wouldn't tear down and rebuild, because then the #1 option guy wouldn't want to come there. You need a good enough team that a #1 you trade for wants to be there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgambill Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 30 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: I'd love to package our pick and either Turner or Sabonis to GSW, then move Warreb to the 4, CL to the 3, Brogdon to 2, and draft Davion Mitchell. Mitchell's draft stock has been all over the place. He measured smaller at the draft combine then expected...but still don't think he makes it past Orlando's second pick at 8...but if he does he might slip down to us. I'd be fine sitting where we are and I think we will land Bouknight, Giddy, Mitchell, Kispert, or Waggoner. Outside about 4-5 guys (which I don't think we can move up to) the rest are solid but not sure a difference maker is there. I like Scottie Barnes if we were up there in the GS range. If we are making a move with GS I'd prefer to do a big trade with Sabonis....bring in a true center like Wiseman and add their pick. Then we can move on from Turner in another move and play Warren at the 4. Now that is something that I think can change our trajectory allowing us to make a playoff spot (7-8 seed) but set up for the future too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 (edited) 16 minutes ago, dgambill said: Mitchell's draft stock has been all over the place. He measured smaller at the draft combine then expected...but still don't think he makes it past Orlando's second pick at 8...but if he does he might slip down to us. I'd be fine sitting where we are and I think we will land Bouknight, Giddy, Mitchell, Kispert, or Waggoner. Outside about 4-5 guys (which I don't think we can move up to) the rest are solid but not sure a difference maker is there. I like Scottie Barnes if we were up there in the GS range. If we are making a move with GS I'd prefer to do a big trade with Sabonis....bring in a true center like Wiseman and add their pick. Then we can move on from Turner in another move and play Warren at the 4. Now that is something that I think can change our trajectory allowing us to make a playoff spot (7-8 seed) but set up for the future too. What are we moving to get last year's number two pick that looked good when healthy? Edited June 25, 2021 by KoB2011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 With no roster changes other than through the draft, what kind of impact does Carlisle have? Plus 5 games? More? Less? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgambill Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 27 minutes ago, BGleas said: Yup, and that's why I wouldn't tear down and rebuild, because then the #1 option guy wouldn't want to come there. You need a good enough team that a #1 you trade for wants to be there. The only way you land a number 1 though is with draft picks or young rising star talent. You don't land #1 option talent by moving solid rotational guys is my point. Like your Celtics...you aren't going to move Smart for Lillard or Beal etc. Now maybe if you are willing to move Jaylon Brown plus picks you can....we don't have that Jaylon Brown caliber on our team. You get that either in the draft or you take a chance by trading for young 1st or 2nd year players with huge upside by moving off your veteran ready to win now guys. That is what I am asking to do...and not even all of them....just move some of them and try find that future 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgambill Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 (edited) 6 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: What are we moving to get last year's number two pick that looked good when healthy? Sabonis...he is the closest thing to all star talent that a WIN now team might move off a top pick for. One whose window might be closing before that top pick is ready to contribute in a meaningful way. GS was an example because most teams at the top of the draft aren't ready to win now. Edited June 25, 2021 by dgambill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 3 minutes ago, dgambill said: Sabonis...he is the closest thing to all star talent that a WIN now team might move off a top pick for. One whose window might be closing before that top pick is ready to contribute in a meaningful way. GS was an example because most teams at the top of the draft aren't ready to win now. I think we get laughed out of the room if we try to move Sabonis for essentially two top picks. I think GSW would love to have him and he would potentially be a great fit at the 5 for them, but I can't see them overpaying for him. I'm also not of the mindset that we should move Sabonis for guys who are a few years away. We need a number one option... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 6 minutes ago, 5fouls said: With no roster changes other than through the draft, what kind of impact does Carlisle have? Plus 5 games? More? Less? Carlisle and health are worth more than 5 games. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 41 minutes ago, dgambill said: The only way you land a number 1 though is with draft picks or young rising star talent. You don't land #1 option talent by moving solid rotational guys is my point. Like your Celtics...you aren't going to move Smart for Lillard or Beal etc. Now maybe if you are willing to move Jaylon Brown plus picks you can....we don't have that Jaylon Brown caliber on our team. You get that either in the draft or you take a chance by trading for young 1st or 2nd year players with huge upside by moving off your veteran ready to win now guys. That is what I am asking to do...and not even all of them....just move some of them and try find that future 1. There's a difference between an elite superstar and a #1. As mentioned above, you could potentially move Sabonis for Colin Sextion. Sexton isn't an elite superstar, but he has the potential to be a #1 scorer on a contending playoff team that is similar to Utah, Atlanta, Phoenix, and teams like that. He has the potential to turn into a Trae Young, a Donovan Mitchell, a Jamal Murray, etc. You put him around Lavert, Brogdon, Warren, Turner, etc., and you have a nice core there with a lead scoring guard, a legit wing scorer in Lavert, a strong secondary ball handler in Brogdon, an elite 3 and D guy in Warren, and a rim protecting/floor spacing big in Turner. That is a lineup that can compete in the Eastern Conference playoffs if you fill the bench out the right way. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgambill Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 21 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: I think we get laughed out of the room if we try to move Sabonis for essentially two top picks. I think GSW would love to have him and he would potentially be a great fit at the 5 for them, but I can't see them overpaying for him. I'm also not of the mindset that we should move Sabonis for guys who are a few years away. We need a number one option... Actually I was looking at a deal something like Wiseman, #14 and Oubre (s/t) for Sabonis, Lamb or s/t McDormett and any filler they want. Having 13 & 14 you could package to move up maybe to Orlando 2nd lottery pick at 8 or you could even do a pick swap with GS giving them 13 and letting them keep 14 for the 7th pick. I'm not sure there is a true #1 out there that can be had by us...so taking more swings at young talent is my goal....maybe the next Paul George, Devin Booker is sitting out there for us. I mean what else are we going to do...trade Myles Turner for Kyle Kuzma? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 1 minute ago, dgambill said: Actually I was looking at a deal something like Wiseman, #14 and Oubre (s/t) for Sabonis, Lamb or s/t McDormett and any filler they want. Having 13 & 14 you could package to move up maybe to Orlando 2nd lottery pick at 8 or you could even do a pick swap with GS giving them 13 and letting them keep 14 for the 7th pick. I'm not sure there is a true #1 out there that can be had by us...so taking more swings at young talent is my goal....maybe the next Paul George, Devin Booker is sitting out there for us. I mean what else are we going to do...trade Myles Turner for Kyle Kuzma? I think you could potentially move Sabonis and our pick for Wiseman, but it's the inclusion of another lottery pick that really throws it off IMO. But at that point I don't think it's a good move for the Pacers. We need someone a little more ready to be the one now, even if the upside isn't the same as what Wiseman has. We aren't far enough off to completely punt on the next few years which is what we would be doing if we move Sabonis for Wiseman IMO. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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