Jump to content

Purdue does more with less than Indiana


Recommended Posts

24 minutes ago, BobSaccamanno said:

I mean we have guys with no heart or hustle in them, and we’ve got posters wanting to bring them back.  Or other posters who think you unconditionally support kids who jog up the court, throw lazy passes, don’t concentrate etc. and that you can’t call them out.  This isn’t Biddy Ball at the Y where every kid gets to play two quarters and participation trophies are engraved for everybody.  

This is big time basketball and the kids know what they are signing up for. 

If a kid tries hard both physically and mentally, he should be supported to the end.  

But a kid who doesn’t play hard, refuses to play intelligently, doesn’t express any care about winning, and/or disrupts chemistry, all bets are off IMO.  That’s just life.  

Great post 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 200
  • Created
  • Last Reply

What they are doing proves the "the coach looks like a genius, when the ball goes in" cliche.   They are shooting lights out on three, and when they don't they will lose. 

I am envious that they have a system of maturation.....we did NOT see that with Crean and Archie is playing the deck he was handed.  Everyone talks about Edwards (and his energy is fun to watch), but if you stop Cline...you slow them down.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, H00sier said:

Honestly , some people make this and any fan forum horrible. Purdue has done a fabulous job and had a ton of shots fall- but they’re still Purdue and this is an Indiana forum. 

 I swear some people love when things aren’t going well and take any and every chance to say something negative about this program and Coach. No wonder why we can’t get things going .

Regarding Purdue I'll say this. I spend about 7 hours per year thinking about Purdue, Painter or anything else. They've had a career year. Literally. Painter is the same guy who missed tourney completely in 13 and 14 and bounced in 1st round in 15 and 16. Nothing this run has done changed my mind on him. Seems like a good guy but far from above average. 

In terms of Purdue making Elite 8. Good deal. Maybe their fan base might actually understand A) how hard it is to get to a F4 and B) why we take great pride in all of our trips....that's the hardest part discussing our history with Purdue fans. They don't have an actual concept of what it takes to do it. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, BobSaccamanno said:

I mean we have guys with no heart or hustle in them, and we’ve got posters wanting to bring them back.  Or other posters who think you unconditionally support kids who jog up the court, throw lazy passes, don’t concentrate etc. and that you can’t call them out.  This isn’t Biddy Ball at the Y where every kid gets to play two quarters and participation trophies are engraved for everybody.  

This is big time basketball and the kids know what they are signing up for. 

If a kid tries hard both physically and mentally, he should be supported to the end.  

But a kid who doesn’t play hard, refuses to play intelligently, doesn’t express any care about winning, and/or disrupts chemistry, all bets are off IMO.  That’s just life.  

THank you. JS see ya later. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Let's be honest - it took Cline shooting 70% from three (7-10) and scoring 27 for them to squeak out a win in overtime after being bailed out by getting fouled on a three after being up 18 in the second half.

Last game they were shooting lights out as well.  It definitely makes Painter look good, and I can admit that he's a good coach, but I'm not going to anoint him as some savant because they squeaked by with a player shooting 70% from three.

If they continue to shoot like that, they are going to be hard to beat, but that's a big ask in my opinion.

On another note, I'm just sick and tired of all the negativity.  Here we are bellyaching that Purdue plays hard, they have a culture, etc. when Painter is essentially Keady 2.0 and he's been the coach for 10 years!  That's a lot of stability.  Give Archie a second people!  He plays an entirely different system than Crean; it ain't gonna change overnight.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, rogue3542 said:

Let's be honest - it took Cline shooting 70% from three (7-10) and scoring 27 for them to squeak out a win in overtime after being bailed out by getting fouled on a three after being up 18 in the second half.

Last game they were shooting lights out as well.  It definitely makes Painter look good, and I can admit that he's a good coach, but I'm not going to anoint him as some savant because they squeaked by with a player shooting 70% from three.

If they continue to shoot like that, they are going to be hard to beat, but that's a big ask in my opinion.

On another note, I'm just sick and tired of all the negativity.  Here we are bellyaching that Purdue plays hard, they have a culture, etc. when Painter is essentially Keady 2.0 and he's been the coach for 10 years!  That's a lot of stability.  Give Archie a second people!  He plays an entirely different system than Crean; it ain't gonna change overnight.

And being "Keady 2.0" isn't an insult. Keady was a hell of a coach (combover jokes aside). They may have been intense rivals on the court, but Keady and Knight had nothing but respect for each other.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, rogue3542 said:

Let's be honest - it took Cline shooting 70% from three (7-10) and scoring 27 for them to squeak out a win in overtime after being bailed out by getting fouled on a three after being up 18 in the second half.

Last game they were shooting lights out as well.  It definitely makes Painter look good, and I can admit that he's a good coach, but I'm not going to anoint him as some savant because they squeaked by with a player shooting 70% from three.

If they continue to shoot like that, they are going to be hard to beat, but that's a big ask in my opinion.

On another note, I'm just sick and tired of all the negativity.  Here we are bellyaching that Purdue plays hard, they have a culture, etc. when Painter is essentially Keady 2.0 and he's been the coach for 10 years!  That's a lot of stability.  Give Archie a second people!  He plays an entirely different system than Crean; it ain't gonna change overnight.

The forums have become a joke with all the "Archie better produce next year" crap.  Archie is the anti-Crean, he has to correct the roster's immaturity, TO's, and defense....i am longing for a mature backcourt of Franklin and Phinisee.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It’s not rocket science, it’s patience and culture. It’s knowing you have a good coach and being patient with him and allowing him to build the culture. The worst thing IU can do right now is act hastily and not give Archie time to build the culture of the program. 

Purdue easily could have let Painter go at various times in his tenure, or let him walk when Missouri offered him, but they knew they liked their guy, they stuck with him when there were down years and they let him build his program and it’s paid off, especially the last few years. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, Long Duk Dong said:

Is this coaching? Culture? Just a better program?

What's going on here?

It is culture and Purdue has had only two coaches since 1981.  they know what they want out of their program and recruit to that culture.  Last night proves you don't have to have a roster full of one and done players win in this tournament.  There were not many 5 star players on the teams that own last night.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just a newsflash to some. Purdue is on the cusp of making it's first Final 4 in 4 decades. Can we pump the brakes on better program, culture, toughness,etc....talk about Painter please? 4 decades since last Final 4. 4 decades since last Final 4. 4 decades since last Final 4. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

It is culture and Purdue has had only two coaches since 1981.  they know what they want out of their program and recruit to that culture.  Last night proves you don't have to have a roster full of one and done players win in this tournament.  There were not many 5 star players on the teams that own last night.

Exactly. Patience and culture. Recruit to your culture, build a program with a clear path and get old and stay old. It's how Michigan State does it, Michigan does it, Wisconsin does it, Virginia does it, etc., etc.

IU has had 4 coaches in 15 years. That's not how you build a program. Look at most, not all, but most of the successful programs or organizations in sports, they have consistency and culture. They're not firing coaches every time there's a down year.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Seeking6 said:

Regarding Purdue I'll say this. I spend about 7 hours per year thinking about Purdue, Painter or anything else. They've had a career year. Literally. Painter is the same guy who missed tourney completely in 13 and 14 and bounced in 1st round in 15 and 16. Nothing this run has done changed my mind on him. Seems like a good guy but far from above average. 

In terms of Purdue making Elite 8. Good deal. Maybe their fan base might actually understand A) how hard it is to get to a F4 and B) why we take great pride in all of our trips....that's the hardest part discussing our history with Purdue fans. They don't have an actual concept of what it takes to do it. 

Agreed. A lot of love for a team that blew an 18 point lead and was bailed out by lights out shooting from Kline (props to him for incredible performance/his shooting has no impact on whether Painter is a good/great/bad coach though), UT fouling Edwards at the end (huge mistake by UT/agree with the call), and some shoddy clock work at the end of regulation (don't think it would have mattered b/c another mistake by UT of trying to make 2 passes for some reason instead of 1 before the T/O).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

50 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

We've had 4 coaches in 17 years. They've basically had the same guy. 

Plus, there's been continuity. Painter played at Purdue from 1989-1993 under Keady. He was then hired as the replacement for Keady and they were both on the staff in 2004-2005. So there were no (or at least minimal) interruptions to philosophy and recruiting. IU has had the exact opposite.

 

9 minutes ago, hoosierhoosier said:

The forums have become a joke with all the "Archie better produce next year" crap.  Archie is the anti-Crean, he has to correct the roster's immaturity, TO's, and defense....i am longing for a mature backcourt of Franklin and Phinisee.

I agree with this 100%. I think the majority of HSN posters agree with the "get old and stay old", but you need to have good upperclassmen. 2017-2018, the only top notch upper class men were Robert Johnson and Juwan. 2018-2019, Juwan and March Devonte. With De'Ron's achilles injury, I don't think we could have expected any more from him this year than what he contributed. 2019-2020 (as of now), De'Ron, Devonte, Al, and Justin. 

If Devonte can play all year like he has this past month and De'Ron can get into shape, we should have a decent Senior class. I think Al will again take another big leap. His shooting really improved from his freshman year until he hurt his finger against MSU. Plus, Rob will have a whole offseason to improve, I think we'll be pleasantly surprised with Race, and we'll see about Jerome. Heck, maybe Romeo says he wants to experience March Madness and gives it another go around. Then, you have TJD (let's not forget he was the highest rated Indiana player - not the kid from FW) and Armaan, who by all reports, IU fans will be happy with. 

As far as Archie goes, I was (and still am) happy with the hire. I would have been happy with him, Mack, or Marshall. I don't think Donovan or Stevens were realistic. The thing i don't get with the "fire Archie now" crowd is what do you realistically think would happen? IU would not find an established coach that would even talk about the position. Who would want to take a job where if you don't succeed instantly, you'll get fired? Not to mention all the players that would transfer or decommit. It would be 2008-2009 all over again. 

By sticking with Archie, IU has a legitimate chance to become the program that it used to be. He is only 40 years old. Does anyone know how old Izzo was when he took the MSU job? 40. And I already know the responses to this: "BUT, BUT, BUT IZZO WON THE BIG TEN HIS 3RD YEAR!!!!" Izzo took over for Jud Heathcote. They finished 2nd in the B1G his last year. 

Archie is fighting an uphill battle and we need to give him time. 

TLDR; Purdue has continuity since the Keady days and we need to give Archie more time

Link to comment
Share on other sites

28 minutes ago, BGleas said:

Exactly. Patience and culture. Recruit to your culture, build a program with a clear path and get old and stay old. It's how Michigan State does it, Michigan does it, Wisconsin does it, Virginia does it, etc., etc.

IU has had 4 coaches in 15 years. That's not how you build a program. Look at most, not all, but most of the successful programs or organizations in sports, they have consistency and culture. They're not firing coaches every time there's a down year.  

Another thing is that Purdue's main goal going into every season is t win the big ten and nothing about the tournament.  They know if you build a program to win your conference it will alow you to get better seeds and that allows you a chance to do something in the tournament.  All our fans care about is the destination and that is the NCAA tournament and not the conference and to me that is not the best way of looking at your program.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

36 minutes ago, BGleas said:

Exactly. Patience and culture. Recruit to your culture, build a program with a clear path and get old and stay old. It's how Michigan State does it, Michigan does it, Wisconsin does it, Virginia does it, etc., etc.

IU has had 4 coaches in 15 years. That's not how you build a program. Look at most, not all, but most of the successful programs or organizations in sports, they have consistency and culture. They're not firing coaches every time there's a down year.  

I'll add to that list a program who DOESN'T have a program of sustained culture: UCLA

UCLA's situation is pretty similar to ours in that sense. It will be interesting to see who they bring in and how long it takes to turn around a team full of Alford's recruits with Alford's culture. Even the speculation surrounding their coaching search is similar to what ours was 2 years ago. Here's an article in their coaching search.  A lot of those names look familiar. An interesting quote from Harrick is in there. 

“The reason I like a guy like John Beilein, a guy like Rick Barnes, a guy like Tony Bennett, they’ve done it over a period of time with different basketball players and that proves to me that you can do it with different guys and different cultures,” Harrick said. “I’m not big on one-year wonders and a guy who’s gone two weeks in a [NCAA] tournament and done a good job to get hired. I like the longevity.”

 

  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, Long Duk Dong said:

I think they are FF bound and may just win it all.

It's nice to see a team play like they do.

If they beat Virginia, then UNC/Kentucky, then Duke/Gonzaga they will have certainly earned it.  The reality is that they are only halfway there and have only completed the easy part. If the refs would have stuck to the don't call ticky tacky fouls in the final seconds concept they would be out already.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.




×
×
  • Create New...