Indy1987 Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 21 minutes ago, IU Scott said: So if they are paid employees they will have to file taxes for their income. Also if they are employees will they just come for basketball and not have to go to school. No class = no play and no paycheck. I dunno the answer. I'd hope we stick to any athlete having to pass classes to play. But we already see that rule bent. 2nd semester players that are not going to class because they are going pro or my favorite... the UNC paper classes. But yes taxes will be taken out for any endorsement deals or as a paid employee. Go Hoosiers!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 8 minutes ago, Indy1987 said: But how is that any different than what the big programs are already doing now? At least with making endorsement deals legal other schools could compete for athletes. Go Hoosiers!!! Sure they will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 5 minutes ago, rico said: Dang Scott the Grad Transfer rule is already like free agency as is kids transferring at will. You don't see the best players usually being the ones transferring so if they can go to the highest bidder you will see more top players transferring. Today most of the kids transferring are guys who are impatient and not getting the playing time they think they deserve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steubenhoosier Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 1 hour ago, coachv said: who was the duke player? Marvin Bagley https://sports.yahoo.com/report-marvin-bagleys-family-reaped-significant-financial-gains-fostering-nike-ties-003436661.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JugRox Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 56 minutes ago, coachv said: why will the schools you mentioned have more money than iu? Are you serious? Do you really think IU has as much money for athletics as Iowa, Penn State, and Wisconsin? lol Ill just leave this here for you.... https://expo.cleveland.com/erry-2018/03/a9ad5f0d13/big_tens_16_billion_sports_emp.html Iowa made almost 20 million more than IU last year. Wisconsin? 30 million more than IU. Penn State? How about 35 million more than IU. And again, almost all of IU's money comes from B10 TV rights.....what happens when that goes away? You people that want to get into a bidding war with football schools simply don't understand how little college basketball is worth. It's not even a drop in the bucket for football schools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steubenhoosier Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 As has been bandied about previously, one way to keep some control over this situation would be to create an endowment for the player, so that the money he earns does not become accessible until he leaves. Make some conditions along with that....academic progress towards a degree being one of them. Maybe create a vesting schedule so that the longer the kid stays, the more he owns, or more he has access to the funds. This is a far cry from where college sports have been since their inception. I would hope that whoever develops this doesn't just give kids unfettered access to the money with no strings attached. Once they sign the LOI to attend a school, all $$ derived while attending and representing said school becomes lost if they start shopping themselves around to the highest bidder. Tie the revenue to the school attended, and that would solve some of the issues being brought up here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JugRox Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 49 minutes ago, FW_Hoosier said: Indiana absolutely wouldn’t become one of the “have-nots” in basketball, and the shoe companies are why. IU would get the largest share of Adidas’ recruiting budget behind Kansas and Louisville (like I’m sure we already are). As for the football program, we’re already just about the biggest “have-not” amongst the Power 5 anyway, so what’s the difference? Lol LOL.....for the love of god.... https://money.cnn.com/2015/08/18/news/indiana-university-adidas-deal/index.html Adidas pays IU $6.7 million a year. For comparison, Wisconsin makes $16 million........PER HOME FOOTBALL GAME.... lol https://madison.com/wsj/sports/college/wisconsin-badgers-athletics-million-annual-impact-for-state-is-down/article_add1a385-3180-5be8-b5e0-111edf9678c6.html And just think about those Wisconsin football boosters hosting a basketball recruit.... Jesus....you people obviously don't follow college football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachv Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 1 hour ago, Indy1987 said: Good point about the NBA and limits. I got the feeling the only way to make this work is if athletes become paid employees and there is a salary structure. I don't know how else the NCAA could regulate anything unless they do. Go Hoosiers!!! then won't you have to pay the field hockey player as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachv Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 58 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said: The money that would be going to players is not a donation to the University. These moneys are going to be highly regulated and taxed to death. These moneys would be expenditures for marketing, not tax deductible donations. i should have said business deductions. same effect. but back to your other point, WHO is going to regulate "these moneys"? i also don't see what taxes has to do with anything Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdhoosier Posted September 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 2 minutes ago, JugRox said: LOL.....for the love of god.... https://money.cnn.com/2015/08/18/news/indiana-university-adidas-deal/index.html Adidas pays IU $6.7 million a year. For comparison, Wisconsin makes $16 million........PER HOME FOOTBALL GAME.... lol https://madison.com/wsj/sports/college/wisconsin-badgers-athletics-million-annual-impact-for-state-is-down/article_add1a385-3180-5be8-b5e0-111edf9678c6.html Jesus....you people obviously don't follow college football. And Wisconsin’s athletic department still would not be able to pay recruits. It doesn’t matter what the schools make from football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachv Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 58 minutes ago, IU Scott said: No it won't because if they put some kind of regulation on what you can get or how much you can get there will be ways around getting more to the players. The best solution is to let anyone who does not want to play college basketball for to the NBA and leave the college game for real college student athletes. This changing the whole landscape for less than 1% of all players in college sports is ridiculous. who is "they"? and how can "they" regulate how much income you are allowed to earn? you earn what the market will bear. that's the entire point of this proposal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JugRox Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 8 minutes ago, tdhoosier said: And Wisconsin’s athletic department still would not be able to pay recruits. It doesn’t matter what the schools make from football. you don't get it.... Instead of those boosters donating money to Wisconsin, they will simply "pay for the likeness of a athlete". There isn't going to be some magic rule where boosters are just going to keep giving money to the school if this rule happens. Those boosters will simple point their money a different way. Probably with the direction of the school. Booster: "I want to buy football season tickets" Wisconsin: "well, if your business pays this kid from Indiana that can play basketball for his image, we will give you free football season tickets" Booster: "Ok, done. And same deal for all my buddies?" Wisconsin: "Yep, just keep writing checks and all the football fans get free tickets" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachv Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 17 minutes ago, JugRox said: Are you serious? Do you really think IU has as much money for athletics as Iowa, Penn State, and Wisconsin? lol Ill just leave this here for you.... https://expo.cleveland.com/erry-2018/03/a9ad5f0d13/big_tens_16_billion_sports_emp.html Iowa made almost 20 million more than IU last year. Wisconsin? 30 million more than IU. Penn State? How about 35 million more than IU. And again, almost all of IU's money comes from B10 TV rights.....what happens when that goes away? You people that want to get into a bidding war with football schools simply don't understand how little college basketball is worth. It's not even a drop in the bucket for football schools. i think you are missing on these two things: 1. the schools are not the ones who will be paying athletes for their "endorsements" so the amount of money a school has becomes irrelevant 2. all it takes is ONE wealthy donor. mark cuban has already proven he is a big fan of indiana basketball with his 5 million donation to build the whatchamacallit center. do the schools you mention have a multi-billionaire donor alumni? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JugRox Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 5 minutes ago, coachv said: i think you are missing on these two things: 1. the schools are not the ones who will be paying athletes for their "endorsements" so the amount of money a school has becomes irrelevant 2. all it takes is ONE wealthy donor. mark cuban has already proven he is a big fan of indiana basketball with his 5 million donation to build the whatchamacallit center. do the schools you mention have a multi-billionaire donor alumni? 1. the schools are not the ones who will be paying athletes for their "endorsements" so the amount of money a school has becomes irrelevant Booster: "I want to buy football season tickets" Wisconsin: "well, if your business pays this kid from Indiana that can play basketball for his image, we will give you free football season tickets" Booster: "Ok, done. And same deal for all my buddies?" Wisconsin: "Yep, just keep writing checks and all the football fans get free tickets. And the more kids you pay, the better seats we can give you to football games" Multiply that times how many people attend Wisconsin football games. 2. all it takes is ONE wealthy donor. mark cuban has already proven he is a big fan of indiana basketball with his 5 million donation to build the whatchamacallit center. do the schools you mention have a multi-billionaire donor alumni? So the future of IU sports depends on Mark Cuban..... ah..... LOLOLOLL Sounds like a solid plan!! LET'S DO IT!!!! lolololl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachv Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 22 minutes ago, Steubenhoosier said: As has been bandied about previously, one way to keep some control over this situation would be to create an endowment for the player, so that the money he earns does not become accessible until he leaves. Make some conditions along with that....academic progress towards a degree being one of them. Maybe create a vesting schedule so that the longer the kid stays, the more he owns, or more he has access to the funds. This is a far cry from where college sports have been since their inception. I would hope that whoever develops this doesn't just give kids unfettered access to the money with no strings attached. Once they sign the LOI to attend a school, all $$ derived while attending and representing said school becomes lost if they start shopping themselves around to the highest bidder. Tie the revenue to the school attended, and that would solve some of the issues being brought up here. there is no legal way to withhold money earned by an athlete due to poor academic performance. these "endorsements" are private business dealings that the university has nothing to do with. the money doesn't pass through the school before being paid to the athlete. how would any governing body get their hands on the athlete's money to withhold it? the whole point of this legislation is to allow athletes the right to earn whatever money they can OUTSIDE of the ncaa and university. if it passes coast to coast, it cannot be regulated. the genie will be out of the bottle. and a monstrous size genie it will be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachv Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 25 minutes ago, JugRox said: LOL.....for the love of god.... https://money.cnn.com/2015/08/18/news/indiana-university-adidas-deal/index.html Adidas pays IU $6.7 million a year. For comparison, Wisconsin makes $16 million........PER HOME FOOTBALL GAME.... lol https://madison.com/wsj/sports/college/wisconsin-badgers-athletics-million-annual-impact-for-state-is-down/article_add1a385-3180-5be8-b5e0-111edf9678c6.html And just think about those Wisconsin football boosters hosting a basketball recruit.... Jesus....you people obviously don't follow college football. i think you are not understanding the legislation or its purpose. how much money a school has or earns through sports is not relevant in any way, shape or form Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JugRox Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 Just now, coachv said: i think you are not understanding the legislation or its purpose. how much money a school has or earns through sports is not relevant in any way, shape or form Booster: "I want to buy football season tickets, basketball tickets, to travel with the football team, access to the Kohl Center, etc" Wisconsin: "well, if your business pays this kid from Indiana that can play basketball for his image, we will give you free football season tickets" Booster: "Ok, done. And same deal for all my buddies?" Wisconsin: "Yep, just keep writing checks and all the football fans get free tickets. And the more kids you pay, the better seats we can give you to football games" Multiply that times how many people attend Wisconsin football games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdhoosier Posted September 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 21 minutes ago, JugRox said: you don't get it.... Instead of those boosters donating money to Wisconsin, they will simply "pay for the likeness of a athlete". There isn't going to be some magic rule where boosters are just going to keep giving money to the school if this rule happens. Those boosters will simple point their money a different way. Probably with the direction of the school. Booster: "I want to buy football season tickets" Wisconsin: "well, if your business pays this kid from Indiana that can play basketball for his image, we will give you free football season tickets" Booster: "Ok, done. And same deal for all my buddies?" Wisconsin: "Yep, just keep writing checks and all the football fans get free tickets" You’re under the assumption that Wisconsin has more boosters than IU and I’m not sure that’s true. IU has a huge alumni base full of die hard basketball fans. Wisconsin earns more money from football, but that money doesn’t not all come from boosters - only a small portion of it does. Most of it, as you point out, come from ticket sales, merchandising and tv revenue. So when it comes to basketball, IU’s boosters will easily out spend Wisconsin because they have more boosters who care about basketball. Money the university earns from football has nothing to do with it. You’re conflating 2 things that aren’t the same and the scenario you painted up is far from reality. For starters, wiscy season tix aren’t nearly worth that much and if a booster can already spend that much he probably already has a private box. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachv Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 19 minutes ago, JugRox said: you don't get it.... Instead of those boosters donating money to Wisconsin, they will simply "pay for the likeness of a athlete". There isn't going to be some magic rule where boosters are just going to keep giving money to the school if this rule happens. Those boosters will simple point their money a different way. Probably with the direction of the school. Booster: "I want to buy football season tickets" Wisconsin: "well, if your business pays this kid from Indiana that can play basketball for his image, we will give you free football season tickets" Booster: "Ok, done. And same deal for all my buddies?" Wisconsin: "Yep, just keep writing checks and all the football fans get free tickets" you are confusing your arguments. first you quote the revenue of an athletic department as being the difference between the have and have nots. then you attempt to back up that statement with boosters paying for the endorsements. you are moving the goalpost my friend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachv Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 8 minutes ago, JugRox said: 1. the schools are not the ones who will be paying athletes for their "endorsements" so the amount of money a school has becomes irrelevant Booster: "I want to buy football season tickets" Wisconsin: "well, if your business pays this kid from Indiana that can play basketball for his image, we will give you free football season tickets" Booster: "Ok, done. And same deal for all my buddies?" Wisconsin: "Yep, just keep writing checks and all the football fans get free tickets. And the more kids you pay, the better seats we can give you to football games" Multiply that times how many people attend Wisconsin football games. 2. all it takes is ONE wealthy donor. mark cuban has already proven he is a big fan of indiana basketball with his 5 million donation to build the whatchamacallit center. do the schools you mention have a multi-billionaire donor alumni? So the future of IU sports depends on Mark Cuban..... ah..... LOLOLOLL Sounds like a solid plan!! LET'S DO IT!!!! lolololl #2. you said it, not me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JugRox Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 1 minute ago, tdhoosier said: You’re under the assumption that Wisconsin has more boosters than IU and I’m not sure that’s true. IU has a huge alumni base full of die hard basketball fans. Wisconsin earns more money from football, but that money doesn’t not all come from boosters - only a small portion of it does. Most of it, as you point out, come from ticket sales, merchandising and tv revenue. So when it comes to basketball, IU’s boosters will easily out spend Wisconsin because they have more boosters who care about basketball. Money the university earns from football has nothing to do with it. You’re conflating 2 things that aren’t the same and the scenario you painted up is far from reality. For starters, wiscy season tix aren’t nearly that much and if a booster can already spend that much he probably already has a private box. First, if IU has so many big spending boosters, why is IU 10th in contributions? Wisconsin earns more money from football, but that money doesn’t not all come from boosters - only a small portion of it does. Most of it, as you point out, come from ticket sales, merchandising and tv revenue. Again, if Wisconsin gives away football tickets, access to the football team, access to the football facilities, etc if football fans pay recruits.......what then? So when it comes to basketball, IU’s boosters will easily out spend Wisconsin because they have more boosters who care about basketball. Money the university earns from football has nothing to do with it. There will be NO LINE between sports in regard to boosters. If the AD gives someone free football private box tickets if he pays a recruit.....do you think the booster cares if its basketball or football? You’re conflating 2 things that aren’t the same and the scenario you painted up is far from reality. For starters, wiscy season tix aren’t nearly that much and if a booster can already spend that much he probably already has a private box. Ok...fine. Hey big business in Wisconsin....we will give you free private box tickets for the next 2 seasons if you pay that kid from Indiana.....happy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JugRox Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 2 minutes ago, coachv said: you are confusing your arguments. first you quote the revenue of an athletic department as being the difference between the have and have nots. then you attempt to back up that statement with boosters paying for the endorsements. you are moving the goalpost my friend ITS THE SAME DAMN MONEY!!!!! Ok.....one more time. The AD in charge of the money coming in from Wisconsin fans, simply gives out the services they are currently paying for (ex: Tickets, merchandise, fly on team private jet, etc) for free in exchange for paying recruits. If you don't think these schools are not going to find a way to pay recruits using this rule.......you are out of your mind. They are paying recruits now!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indy1987 Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 35 minutes ago, coachv said: then won't you have to pay the field hockey player as well? Yep. But I have the feeling if colleges are required to pay athletes and classify them as employees we will see small sports eliminated all together. And I'm not a fan of making players employees. I was just saying that may be the only way to keep college athletics fair if the endorsement thing happens. Go Hoosiers!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 48 minutes ago, JugRox said: Are you serious? Do you really think IU has as much money for athletics as Iowa, Penn State, and Wisconsin? lol Ill just leave this here for you.... https://expo.cleveland.com/erry-2018/03/a9ad5f0d13/big_tens_16_billion_sports_emp.html Iowa made almost 20 million more than IU last year. Wisconsin? 30 million more than IU. Penn State? How about 35 million more than IU. And again, almost all of IU's money comes from B10 TV rights.....what happens when that goes away? You people that want to get into a bidding war with football schools simply don't understand how little college basketball is worth. It's not even a drop in the bucket for football schools. If they approve this it won't be money from the University that would pay the players but from advertisements and selling their likeness. Most of this money would come from local or state companies who are probably IU alumni. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coachv Posted September 17, 2019 Report Share Posted September 17, 2019 6 minutes ago, tdhoosier said: You’re under the assumption that Wisconsin has more boosters than IU and I’m not sure that’s true. IU has a huge alumni base full of die hard basketball fans. Wisconsin earns more money from football, but that money doesn’t not all come from boosters - only a small portion of it does. Most of it, as you point out, come from ticket sales, merchandising and tv revenue. So when it comes to basketball, IU’s boosters will easily out spend Wisconsin because they have more boosters who care about basketball. Money the university earns from football has nothing to do with it. You’re conflating 2 things that aren’t the same and the scenario you painted up is far from reality. For starters, wiscy season tix aren’t nearly worth that much and if a booster can already spend that much he probably already has a private box. you know that old saying about leading a horse to water? i think this horse is dying from dehydration. to both of your points comparing booster or donor bases. that will happen, i'm sure, but a major player can make all the small donations irrelevant in an instant. allow me to play devil's advocate. jeff bezos makes $218 million per day. if he wants to make the university of maine the biggest basketball power in college hoops, he can. if he decides to pay 12 players $10 million per year to play ball there, then they will become the best team in the country. if he wants to build a 11 billion dollar basketball facility, he can do that too. that is even more dangerous than shoe or apparel companies as those companies have a vested interest in multiple institutions and have no reason to spend more on one than the other. if nike represents 40 schools, are they going to 'endorse" 10 players at those schools at $5-$10 million each? that's 40 players. if an individual or corporation wants to fund just one roster in this manner, the possibilities become endless. while jugrox derided my suggestion that cuban could become such a person for indiana, let me say this.cuban has enough interest in basketball that he has already purchased a team. he has also proven he is interested enough in the success of iu basketball by donating $5 million. in this scenario, he could in effect purchase and own the indiana hoosiers basketball team with a wink and a nod. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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