NotIThatLives Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 Just now, IU Scott said: We pay in the top 10 so it is not like we are shopping at Dollar General But we grab hopeful mid major guys and don't even sniff at proven winners that will command 6 mil plus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 14 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said: But we grab hopeful mid major guys and don't even sniff at proven winners that will command 6 mil plus. That is because the top coaches is not going to leave their current jobs to come here. Even coaches like Bennett, Wright, Few are not leaving their current jobs and I doubt if Bears would either even if we offered them top 5 money. Where do you think most of the top coaches start from? they come up the ranks and start out as a mid major coach. RMK- Army to IU Coach K- Army to Duke Boeheim- Syracuse Assistant to HC Izzo- MSU assistant to HC Roy Williams- UNC assistant to KU HC Calhoun- Northeastern to UCONN Mark Few- Gonzaga assistant to HC Jay Wright- Hofstra to Villanova. You have some like Self and Calapari who went from a good job to a great job but it is not like they went from one great job to another. The only reason Roy Williams left KU is because of his loyalty to Dean smith and he is a UNC alumni. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdhoosier Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 Why would NCAA limit potential earning to $5,000 off of NLI? Capping any amount will ultimately be a non-starter because WE LIVE IN AMERICA. The NBA or NFL doesn't limit how much any of their players can get paid in endorsements. They can cap salaries in their own league, but have no say in how much one can make outside of their league. Somewhere along the lines we forget that this is America and people can make as much off their likeness as companies are willing to pay for it. It should be no different for college athletics because it's simply unfair to legislate this and goes against a person's freedom. Some will argue that it hurts the institution, but i'll never put institutions above individual freedom....ever. This vary argument is why I believe congress got involved in the first place. NCAA does not own student athletes. Sorry, this topic gets me riled up time and time again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbmhoosier Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 27 minutes ago, IU Scott said: We pay in the top 10 so it is not like we are shopping at Dollar General Louis Vuitton pay with Dollar Tree expectations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 31 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said: Yeah I don't believe in covering for abusers gives me moral high ground. Sorry for such a quick response, no offense. I get it. We never cheated and I don't want us to cheat. My personal belief is that certain people have cheapened important words like "abuse" and "racism" by by employing them at every opportunity to fit their narrative... Was RMK's hand to the neck of Neil Reed inappropriate? Certainly... "Abuse"? I save that term for monsters like Jerry Sandusky and Larry Nassar... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 12 minutes ago, tdhoosier said: Why would NCAA limit potential earning to $5,000 off of NLI? Capping any amount will ultimately be a non-starter because WE LIVE IN AMERICA. The NBA or NFL doesn't limit how much any of their players can get paid in endorsements. They can cap salaries in their own league, but have no say in how much one can make outside of their league. Somewhere along the lines we forget that this is America and people can make as much off their likeness as companies are willing to pay for it. It should be no different for college athletics because it's simply unfair to legislate this and goes against a person's freedom. Some will argue that it hurts the institution, but i'll never put institutions above individual freedom....ever. This vary argument is why I believe congress got involved in the first place. NCAA does not own student athletes. Sorry, this topic gets me riled up time and time again. I will really rile you up because I don't think college players should get anymore than just their scholarship Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 3 minutes ago, IUFLA said: My personal belief is that certain people have cheapened important words like "abuse" and "racism" by by employing them at every opportunity to fit their narrative... Was RMK's hand to the neck of Neil Reed inappropriate? Certainly... "Abuse"? I save that term for monsters like Jerry Sandusky and Larry Nassar... The thing is that in the 70 and 80's his behavior for coaches was the norm. There were plenty of junior high and high school coaches coached by fear and yelled at you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotIThatLives Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 13 minutes ago, IU Scott said: That is because the top coaches is not going to leave their current jobs to come here. Even coaches like Bennett, Wright, Few are not leaving their current jobs and I doubt if Bears would either even if we offered them top 5 money. Where do you think most of the top coaches start from? they come up the ranks and start out as a mid major coach. RMK- Army to IU Coach K- Army to Duke Boeheim- Syracuse Assistant to HC Izzo- MSU assistant to HC Roy Williams- UNC assistant to KU HC Calhoun- Northeastern to UCONN Mark Few- Gonzaga assistant to HC Jay Wright- Hofstra to Villanova. You have some like Self and Calapari who went from a good job to a great job but it is not like they went from one great job to another. The only reason Roy Williams left KU is because of his loyalty to Dean smith and he is a UNC alumni. Since we are considered an all time top 6 blue blood let's look at recent blue blood hires. Duke was not a blue blood when hiring K. Kansas has went and got the best guy available. Brown from the NBA and poaching Williams from Dean Smith's bench. Then Self who built a program and why would he leave after building a program and winning there???? UNC- hired off the bench once rightfully so, he had been there forever. Then tried Doherty won played under Smith and won a championship and was doing pretty well for himself at Notre Dame. They quickly figured out he was in over his head and went and got one of the best options availabe, a guy who had been to 14 straight tournaments and 4 final fours. Why would he leave a program he is so successful at??? Kentucky- had a winner in Pitino. Took the best available from their own conference in Tubby. Won a championship. Lost momentum and went and got the best available coach that was hot and coming off a very successful season at a non basketball school(sounds like Beard even though I like Beard a lot). Canned him when he lost his way and lost control of the program. What did they do? They went and got the best coach available. UCLA- tried some guys, even had Larry Brown before he went off to the NBA before his Kansas stint. Finally got it right through mid majors getting Harrick, win a championship and he retires. They hire the hottest young name available in Lavin. Fires Lavin after 5 tournament appearances in 7 years with one conference title. What do they do? Go get a proven winner in Howland. Howland just couldn't hold it all together, even after 3 final four appearances. What do they do? Get a very well known, experienced guy we all know and paid huge money (probably over paid). Even Mick Cronin is not a mid major. Guy can coach but is probably in over his head with LA and the type of recruits they will get. So good try but no. Blue bloods don't poach mid majors successfully very often. Actually, when they go get a proven guy tremendous success follows. UNC 3 championships. UK- 4 final fours and 1 championship. UCLA- 3 final fours. Kansas 3 final fours and a championship. Thanks for bringing it up so we can research it and bring out the facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotIThatLives Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 19 minutes ago, IUFLA said: My personal belief is that certain people have cheapened important words like "abuse" and "racism" by by employing them at every opportunity to fit their narrative... Was RMK's hand to the neck of Neil Reed inappropriate? Certainly... "Abuse"? I save that term for monsters like Jerry Sandusky and Larry Nassar... To a degree for sure. Head bunted and choking people... in public. I wonder what went on in private. Bob Knight made men out of boys but he was not a role model. All time great coach, maybe the greatest tactician ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotIThatLives Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 17 minutes ago, IU Scott said: The thing is that in the 70 and 80's his behavior for coaches was the norm. There were plenty of junior high and high school coaches coached by fear and yelled at you. And yet IU wouldn't touch Bob Huggins with a 10 foot pole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybergates Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, NotIThatLives said: I don't consider calipari clean nor a top 5 coach. I've already eliminated self, k, Izzo. We could pay Jay Wright top 3 money but we won't. So we wouldn't ever know because we wouldn't ever make a real offer. Paying Jay Wright won't work, ask UCLA https://www.nbcsports.com/philadelphia/ncaa/ucla-reportedly-offered-jay-wright-ridiculous-amount-he-turned-down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgambill Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 17 hours ago, dbmhoosier said: Auburn up 16-0 on Bama right now. Why we won’t throw the vault at Pearl after this season is beyond belief. Besides all the baggage the guy has....and it's a lot! What makes you think he wants to come to IU?? Just because he coached at USI doesn't mean he wants to live in Indiana again. Doesn't have any links to the state that I'm aware or does he? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgambill Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 4 hours ago, IU Scott said: As a basketball coach he would be great here but it is all the off the court stuff that will prevent him from coaching here. I would not want him here at IU and I would think a lot of the long time Hoosiers wouldn't either. It is the win at any cost crowd that is wanting pear here because they don't care about integrity. If I'm stooping to that level why not hire Rick Pitino?? Much better coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotIThatLives Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 4 minutes ago, cybergates said: Paying Jay Wright won't work, ask UCLA https://www.nbcsports.com/philadelphia/ncaa/ucla-reportedly-offered-jay-wright-ridiculous-amount-he-turned-down That's interesting. I wonder how true. They offered Calipari $1,200,000 less than his Kentucky salary to go to California where he would be taxed at 13.3% on the state level vs 5 % in Kentucky. I wonder if that isn't trying to save face after they embarrassed themselves trying to low ball Cal? https://www.bruinsnation.com/ucla_basketball_coaching_search/2019/4/1/18291100/report-ucla-offered-john-calipari-8-million-per-year-but-calipari-will-stay-at-kentucky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgambill Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 2 hours ago, rico said: I compare Bruce Pearl to Larry Brown. I think that is a fair comp at the college level although Larry's accomplishments are much more. They both win wherever they go...but they always have a dark cloud over them and one on the horizon. But I got to admit this is Bruce's 5th school where as Larry only did it at 3. Neither learn from their mistakes or misdeeds. They seem to think they will do it better the next time and not get caught. Never giving any thought that they are under a microscope. Signed, Bill Self Can't laugh and like both....dang!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotIThatLives Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 4 minutes ago, dgambill said: If I'm stooping to that level why not hire Rick Pitino?? Much better coach. Pitino? Haha. Lay out the improprieties next to each other. Gee wiz. Can we stop talking about the mass murderer rapist Pearl since he's such an evil person. Sometimes you guys are way over the top. And to answer your other question. Because most people outside of Hoosier Nation still consider IU and all time blue blood, top 5 or so job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, IU Scott said: You have some like Self and Calapari who went from a good job to a great job but it is not like they went from one great job to another. But Self (Tulsa) and Calipari (UMass) started out at mid-majors too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 24 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said: And yet IU wouldn't touch Bob Huggins with a 10 foot pole. I don't know...the only reason I wouldn't consider him for IU is that he's a little long in the tooth (67) and on the downside of his career... I'd much rather have him than Pearl, Sampson, or some of the other names bandied about here...the guy can coach... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotIThatLives Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 6 minutes ago, IUFLA said: But Self (Tulsa) and Calipari (UMass) started out at mid-majors too... Both of these guys had tremendous success at the previous stop before landing at a top 5 blue blood. Illinois to Kansas Memphis to UK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 19 minutes ago, IUFLA said: But Self (Tulsa) and Calipari (UMass) started out at mid-majors too... I know they did and Self actually started at Oral Roberts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 12 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said: Both of these guys had tremendous success at the previous stop before landing at a top 5 blue blood. Illinois to Kansas Memphis to UK 2 minutes ago, IU Scott said: I know they did and Self actually started at Oral Roberts Oh, I know...just that the point was successful mid-major coaches can and have wound up coaching "blue bloods" their stops at "slightly above mid-majors" (kidding...love getting my U of I friends riled up) not withstanding... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 29 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said: Pitino? Haha. Lay out the improprieties next to each other. Gee wiz. Can we stop talking about the mass murderer rapist Pearl since he's such an evil person. Sometimes you guys are way over the top. And to answer your other question. Because most people outside of Hoosier Nation still consider IU and all time blue blood, top 5 or so job. Those outside Hoosier nation also think our fan base are a bunch of nut jobs with unrealistic expectations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotIThatLives Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 4 minutes ago, IU Scott said: I know they did and Self actually started at Oral Roberts I love how you point that out but skip over the fact they they were both extremely successful before the blue bloods came calling. They built programs and won big. And left for blue bloods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotIThatLives Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 Just now, IU Scott said: Those outside Hoosier nation also think our fan base are a bunch of nut jobs with unrealistic expectations. Pretty sad that you laugh at the fact that IU is considered a blue blood by the nation but then crucify it's fans and expectations. Maybe your lowered expectations are the problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rico Posted February 13, 2020 Report Share Posted February 13, 2020 2 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said: I love how you point that out but skip over the fact they they were both extremely successful before the blue bloods came calling. They built programs and won big. And left for blue bloods. I would like to point out that growing up in the 70's I never heard the term "blue blood". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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