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Can we...WILL we...Beat Wisconsin on the road?

BADGERVOL

By BADGERVOL
in General Basketball Discussion

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Zlinedavid

Zlinedavid

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17 minutes ago, milehiiu said:

Good answer. 

 And I do know that Bobby Knight did the same at TT.  For basically the same reason. Though he was not cheating on his wife. Chose to pass the baton to Pat.   Still. Aside from health concerns, I have a hard time with a coach who bails on his team, mid season. Kids come to a school and coach who recruited them. There is a reason, they chose a school and coach.  And  a coach and school, who they have spilled sweat, and at times blood to play for.  They deserve more than to be dumped on, mid season.

Well, they could have the head coach leave, but have an assistant that they're familiar with take over mid-season, or have an entirely new staff come in at season's end.  Neither one is ideal, but one offers a degree of continuity, one doesn't. 

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Zlinedavid

Zlinedavid

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7 minutes ago, milehiiu said:

Fans take to Twitter to weigh in on Badgers' loss to Wolfpack in Big Ten/ACC Challenge | Wisconsin Badgers Men's Basketball | madison.com

Love the tweet, titled....Help is on the way.   Hmmm, wonder where I have heard that before ?   LOL

From another slightly overmatched assistant who took over unexpectedly.

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IUPG

IUPG

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2 hours ago, Zlinedavid said:

Because if he resigned at the end of the year, Gard has no footing.  He had no prior record of being a head coach, so if the Bennett rumor is true, Alvarez would have had no qualms about firing the staff and letting Bennett come in clean.  Resigning mid-year, it allows Gard to establish a track record, and put Alvarez into a situation where making the move would be more difficult.

Thank you for doing a better job explaining the situation than I did.

And to Mile, again I wasn't clear enough. I was not addressing Bo's affair, I have no knowledge of that and it was never part of the conversation.  I was just trying to say that Barry Alvarez felt that Bo had screwed HIM.  😉

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Zlinedavid

Zlinedavid

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3 minutes ago, milehiiu said:

Almost makes me wish Davis never took us the the championship game.  Only spot on our final championship game record. 

No team with 3 or more national titles has a perfect record in championship games.  The only two with two national titles that have a perfect record in title games are NC State and San Francisco, and they are both 2-0.

Note: Louisville has never lost a championship game, but they have vacated one. 

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Drroogh

Drroogh

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1 hour ago, Zlinedavid said:

No team with 3 or more national titles has a perfect record in championship games.  The only two with two national titles that have a perfect record in title games are NC State and San Francisco, and they are both 2-0.

Note: Louisville has never lost a championship game, but they have vacated one. 

San Francisco will never again have a Bill Russell player either!

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Drroogh

Drroogh

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1 hour ago, rico said:

Don't forget...K.C. Jones was on those teams.

And fwiw, the last I knew Bill Cartwright was the all-time leading scorer in Don history.  

True, but Bill Russel was on a whole different level! Seen Cartwright play live and he was no Bill Russel!

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CincyHoosier

CincyHoosier

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The Florida St game was the launching point for the season and gave us a glimpse of this team's quality.  This may be a bigger test of this team's potential moving forward though.  Winning on the road is hard, especially in conference play.  If we are going to finish top 4-5 in conference these are the types of games we have to win.  These are the games that separate a 10-10 conference season from a 14-6 conference season.  It would be a bit of a letdown if we lost to Wisky but if the guys learn from it to snatch a few road games down the line we can still reach our destination.

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Hoosierhoopster

Hoosierhoopster

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1 hour ago, CincyHoosier said:

The Florida St game was the launching point for the season and gave us a glimpse of this team's quality.  This may be a bigger test of this team's potential moving forward though.  Winning on the road is hard, especially in conference play.  If we are going to finish top 4-5 in conference these are the types of games we have to win.  These are the games that separate a 10-10 conference season from a 14-6 conference season.  It would be a bit of a letdown if we lost to Wisky but if the guys learn from it to snatch a few road games down the line we can still reach our destination.

well said

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BGleas

BGleas

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1 hour ago, CincyHoosier said:

The Florida St game was the launching point for the season and gave us a glimpse of this team's quality.  This may be a bigger test of this team's potential moving forward though.  Winning on the road is hard, especially in conference play.  If we are going to finish top 4-5 in conference these are the types of games we have to win.  These are the games that separate a 10-10 conference season from a 14-6 conference season.  It would be a bit of a letdown if we lost to Wisky but if the guys learn from it to snatch a few road games down the line we can still reach our destination.

This so much!

Disclaimer: I'm not saying this game is a referendum on Archie whatsoever.

IMO, this is the type of game you made the switch to Archie for. Not to go Crean vs. Miller, but one of Crean's big issues was he'd win the big game but often lost the games like this (yes, there's a Wisconsin/Crean joke in there). While taletend, his teams often lacked the mental toughness to consistently win the road games against the teams they should beat. Part of the Archie hire, amongst other things, was to have tougher team, mentally tougher team, teams that could grind out these types of games even if the whistles or shooting isn't always going their way. 

That's a part (not the only part) of what the change in style was about. 

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Hoosierhoopster

Hoosierhoopster

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1 hour ago, BGleas said:

This so much!

Disclaimer: I'm not saying this game is a referendum on Archie whatsoever.

IMO, this is the type of game you made the switch to Archie for. Not to go Crean vs. Miller, but one of Crean's big issues was he'd win the big game but often lost the games like this (yes, there's a Wisconsin/Crean joke in there). While taletend, his teams often lacked the mental toughness to consistently win the road games against the teams they should beat. Part of the Archie hire, amongst other things, was to have tougher team, mentally tougher team, teams that could grind out these types of games even if the whistles or shooting isn't always going their way. 

That's a part (not the only part) of what the change in style was about. 

There's a lot to be said about the type of player a coach recruits and how it matches the coach's style. 

Pretty clear imo CAM has been and is recruiting tough kids, gym rats and generally kids who come in with this kind of mentally tough mindset. There's no bright line here, but looking at the guys CAM has brought in, and is bringing in, I see guys who are not just about putting up points, but who leave it all on the floor. 

In fairness to Crean, he definitely brought in some guys like that, I mean I'd take OG any day of the week on any team, or of course Vic, etc., but with those guys there were a number of players who don't fit into that kind of mindset. It may just be my way of looking at the guys CAM has brought in but I see a deep group of mentally tough kids.

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13th&Jackson

13th&Jackson

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3 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

There's a lot to be said about the type of player a coach recruits and how it matches the coach's style. 

Pretty clear imo CAM has been and is recruiting tough kids, gym rats and generally kids who come in with this kind of mentally tough mindset. There's no bright line here, but looking at the guys CAM has brought in, and is bringing in, I see guys who are not just about putting up points, but who leave it all on the floor. 

In fairness to Crean, he definitely brought in some guys like that, I mean I'd take OG any day of the week on any team, or of course Vic, etc., but with those guys there were a number of players who don't fit into that kind of mindset. It may just be my way of looking at the guys CAM has brought in but I see a deep group of mentally tough kids.

Agree with that, but I have to say, a surprise leader of this team is Justin Smith.

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BGleas

BGleas

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12 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

There's a lot to be said about the type of player a coach recruits and how it matches the coach's style. 

Pretty clear imo CAM has been and is recruiting tough kids, gym rats and generally kids who come in with this kind of mentally tough mindset. There's no bright line here, but looking at the guys CAM has brought in, and is bringing in, I see guys who are not just about putting up points, but who leave it all on the floor. 

In fairness to Crean, he definitely brought in some guys like that, I mean I'd take OG any day of the week on any team, or of course Vic, etc., but with those guys there were a number of players who don't fit into that kind of mindset. It may just be my way of looking at the guys CAM has brought in but I see a deep group of mentally tough kids.

Agree, though I'll add that as much as it's about the individual players brought in, it's also about the overall culture of the program and what things are being emphasized, and that's where there is a big difference IMO. Take Durham for example, he's Crean recruit technically, but he's coming up in a program that values defense, toughness, taking care of the ball, getting good shots, etc. The same player with Crean would be coming up in a program that values playing fast, scoring, getting up a lot of shots, etc. 

The first one is predicated on consistency regardless of the arena or opponent, the second one is IMO a win big, lose big scenario, much more susceptible to peaks and valleys. 

I'll tell you one thing, I would have loved to have seen CAM coaching in a team in his first season with a returning OG and Thomas Bryant. I don't blame them one second for leaving, but wow imagine where IU would have been with a starting lineup that included RoJo, OG, Morgan (PF more natural for him) and Bryant. Fill in the other guys, but that team in Archie's system has a much better first year. 

Not to get off course here, but that's why I get frustrated with the Holtman comparison. Holtman had Matt's team coming back, along with a couple guys that were studs coming back from injury. It's not a fair comparison. 

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13th&Jackson

13th&Jackson

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1 hour ago, BGleas said:

 

I'll tell you one thing, I would have loved to have seen CAM coaching in a team in his first season with a returning OG and Thomas Bryant. I don't blame them one second for leaving, but wow imagine where IU would have been with a starting lineup that included RoJo, OG, Morgan (PF more natural for him) and Bryant. Fill in the other guys, but that team in Archie's system has a much better first year. 

Look at the National Champ UVA after losing three players to the pros. IU had three who left an NIT team

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southsidehoosier

southsidehoosier

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52 minutes ago, IUrocker said:

https://badgerswire.usatoday.com/2019/12/06/8-0-indiana-4-4-wisconsin-have-different-records-same-doubts/amp/?__twitter_impression=true
 

Here is an article from Wisconsin’s side. Pretty much saying IU is in for a rude awakening because of the schedule we have had so far. Prove them wrong Hoosiers!! 

Please someone get that into the IU locker room 

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FKIM01

FKIM01

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29 minutes ago, IUrocker said:

https://badgerswire.usatoday.com/2019/12/06/8-0-indiana-4-4-wisconsin-have-different-records-same-doubts/amp/?__twitter_impression=true
 

Here is an article from Wisconsin’s side. Pretty much saying IU is in for a rude awakening because of the schedule we have had so far. Prove them wrong Hoosiers!! 

"IU has also beaten Louisiana Tech, which just won at Mississippi State, so that’s not quite a cupcake."

Well, they're at least a solid cupcake...😂😂😂

Not an unfair article although you can sense the cocky arrogance of a badger fan.  Let's make this the year that Wisconsin assumes their rightful place below IU in the conference...

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BADGERVOL

BADGERVOL

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Love how the guy said we have been fattening up on cupcakes then goes and points out several that aren’t really that much cupcakes. 🙄

but I agree with him that we have something to prove and that we haven’t won on the road yet. This is going to show us something we haven’t seen quiet yet that’s for certain.

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