IUFLA Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 59 minutes ago, NCHoosier32 said: This x100. Ridiculous. Green was ridiculous. I really haven't criticized Arch at all, but this was totally on him. Really bad loss. Just no excuse. How is it on him? He has 4 scholarship guards. One of them got tossed for a stupid move. One has participated in 1/5th of our practices this year. One is a freshman and is, as freshmen tend to be, inconsistent. Who was he supposed to play? Walk-ons? Green played a lot of minutes through neccessity. If Archie had other options, he would have used them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCHoosier32 Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 13 hours ago, IU Scott said: We did not lose to an inferior team today because they were ranked pretty much the same as we were. Also I think it would be best for our fan base to realize we are not the program that were until around 1994 and we might not get backed to that as well maybe true, but we need to have expectations of beating unranked teams at home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCHoosier32 Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 3 minutes ago, IUFLA said: How is it on him? He has 4 scholarship guards. One of them got tossed for a stupid move. One has participated in 1/5th of our practices this year. One is a freshman and is, as freshmen tend to be, inconsistent. Who was he supposed to play? Walk-ons? Green played a lot of minutes through neccessity. If Archie had other options, he would have used them. i mean at the very minimum get a timeout... chew him out... tell him if he can't take care of the ball, take good shots, and feed the post that you will put a walk on in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUfan93 Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 34 minutes ago, IUDan93 said: I enjoy this forum, and remain very interested in the comings and goings of IU basketball. We are a bubble program at this point and just are not going to win at a level that we think we should. Our guard play will keep a lid on our success and we have nobody lined up coming in to fix this. Basketball has become a "positionless" game, but a team still needs a primary ball handler with great IQ and skills. Until we have the player(s) we will continue to be what we have been. Ironically, I figured CAM would be a huge recruiter of point guards. I don't see how we will be better measurably better next year.... year four!!! I like our recruits, but nobody coming in will have the impact that TJD has had, and there is no Romeo walking through the door(who I think was not just limited by injury, but also by lack of quality guard play). I don't think it should go unnoticed that our only recent program "success" with 2 Big Ten conference championships were lead by Yogi at point. Without him, we have really done nothing. Agreed on our recruits. They are solid guys, but we have no shooters and no way to spread the floor. Our only point guard at this point has been bitten by injury bug and is just not capable right nowof giving this team what it needs. I like Archie but I just don’t see this team getting better than what it is. People keep saying give it more time...how much time? OSU and Louisville made a coaching change the same year their programs aren’t struggling to make the tournament. Without a point guard and shooters coming in, this team continues on with the same rinse and repeat style. Get old and stay old is a great concept when you have a complete team that’s balanced in its scoring. Once we went away from TJD and Brunk, we couldn’t buy a basket. Getting to the free throw line more than your opponent sounds great but when you shoot 50% from the line that strategy isn’t going to get you many wins either. It’s all just frustrating. Personally it’s not even about the loss it’s about the shitty brand of basketball that just isn’t getting any better. It’s not seeing any improvement from the coaching staff on in game adjustments, and the players that continue to play reckless with no basketball smarts. It’s the mediocrity that has set in on a once proud blue blood program. I don’t have the answers. I don’t even think a coaching change would help the state of affairs at this point because honestly we’d be starting over taking another chance on an unproven up and comer that may just keep us in the same spot. I just hope at some point in time that we can get back to consistent winning and post season play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 7 minutes ago, NCHoosier32 said: i mean at the very minimum get a timeout... chew him out... tell him if he can't take care of the ball, take good shots, and feed the post that you will put a walk on in. You don't think he's probably said all those things in practice, in huddles, and during game play innumerable times? Watch his post game presser...He's as frustrated with it as we are. He's not going to single out and publicly embarrass a player, but you can read between the lines what he's saying about our guard play and leadership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brass Cannon Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 21 minutes ago, IUFLA said: How is it on him? He has 4 scholarship guards. One of them got tossed for a stupid move. One has participated in 1/5th of our practices this year. One is a freshman and is, as freshmen tend to be, inconsistent. Who was he supposed to play? Walk-ons? Green played a lot of minutes through neccessity. If Archie had other options, he would have used them. Almost like he’s responsible for our roster construction or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 10 hours ago, IowaHoosierFan said: Big difference from 12 to 1. It’s what I am saying. We paid 3.2 and Ohio State paid 7.2. Not saying he is the better coach but they are willing to pay to get what they want. Not what they can get for the price they want to pay Holtmann's contract at OSU is $26mil over 8 years, around 3.2 a year. The reported 7.2 included things like the payment to Butler for his buyout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 2 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said: Almost like he’s responsible for our roster construction or something. So, should Archie have rescinded the scholarships for Green, Durham, Smith, and Davis and tried to recruit his players immediately? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrimsonV Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 28 minutes ago, IUFLA said: How is it on him? He has 4 scholarship guards. One of them got tossed for a stupid move. One has participated in 1/5th of our practices this year. One is a freshman and is, as freshmen tend to be, inconsistent. Who was he supposed to play? Walk-ons? Green played a lot of minutes through neccessity. If Archie had other options, he would have used them. I’m looking at those two open scholarships this year and shaking my head. A veteran halfway decent grad transfer point guard would be a big help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCHoosier32 Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 13 hours ago, Steubenhoosier said: Chip Kelly was on the hot seat for a couple years there. Bet ND is glad that they didn’t overreact on that. Brian Kelly, and actually I wish they would make a move. He is all right, but can't win big games. Teams consistently don't seem prepared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JEFFVETTE Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 All I'm going to say about this loss, and I'm as frustrated as anyone. I remember a time in my life following IUBB that I would be VERY excited to see IU go to the FREE throw line. Not so much anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brass Cannon Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 5 minutes ago, IUFLA said: So, should Archie have rescinded the scholarships for Green, Durham, Smith, and Davis and tried to recruit his players immediately? Or used our two open scholarships to bring in some people who could help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCHoosier32 Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 I am definitely not sold on getting rid of Arch yet. He deserves 1 more year, but... why would we be optimistic that we'll be a tourney team next year? TJD will be gone. Green will be gone (good or bad? not sure). We have some nice recruits coming in, but not immediate game changers. no top 75 guys. How often do freshmen come in ranked around 100 and immediately have huge impacts? Another year after this one of not making the tourney and then what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 6 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said: Or used our two open scholarships to bring in some people who could help Didn't we have scholarship offers out to Quinones and Carton? They would have helped, undoubtedly. We were in the race for both, and lost out. It happens... Not sure who else you would suggest, unless you're going the Crean route and the only condition is their breath can fog a mirror... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5fouls Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 Everything is going to be all right. I got up at 3 o'clock this morning, sacrificed an opossum and created a burial shrine on the hood of my neighbor's Mercedes (he's in St. Thomas for the holidays and a UK fan). All bad juju has been exorcised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrimsonV Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 3 minutes ago, IUFLA said: Didn't we have scholarship offers out to Quinones and Carton? They would have helped, undoubtedly. We were in the race for both, and lost out. It happens... Not sure who else you would suggest, unless you're going the Crean route and the only condition is their breath can fog a mirror... g-r-a-d t-r-a-n-s-f-er .... lots of success stories out there from last year esp Mooney for Texas Tech Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 16 minutes ago, JEFFVETTE said: All I'm going to say about this loss, and I'm as frustrated as anyone. I remember a time in my life following IUBB that I would be VERY excited to see IU go to the FREE throw line. Not so much anymore. Yeah, one of the things that showed me Rob might not be up to snuff is when he missed the 2 FTs (both short, which indicates tiredness to me) on the technical foul on Jones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 Just now, CrimsonV said: g-r-a-d t-r-a-n-s-f-er .... lots of success stories out there from last year esp Mooney for Texas Tech Ok...names...you can't just say "grad transfer" and justify that as an answer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheWatShot Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 8 minutes ago, NCHoosier32 said: I am definitely not sold on getting rid of Arch yet. He deserves 1 more year, but... why would we be optimistic that we'll be a tourney team next year? TJD will be gone. Green will be gone (good or bad? not sure). We have some nice recruits coming in, but not immediate game changers. no top 75 guys. How often do freshmen come in ranked around 100 and immediately have huge impacts? Another year after this one of not making the tourney and then what? If we miss the tourney this year, he should absolutely be gone. The more I see, the more I'm convinced he's just in over his head. I know he didn't inherit a very good roster, but it was hardly bad enough to still be blaming Crean's players two years later. I don't think he's capable of recruiting well enough to get us where we want to be, our defense is leaky and prone to getting torched, and I still haven't figured out what our offense is supposed to look like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrimsonV Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 3 minutes ago, IUFLA said: Ok...names...you can't just say "grad transfer" and justify that as an answer... Everyone knows grad transfers are big business now. It’s written all over college basketball. Well...almost everyone. Little brother even got one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 3 minutes ago, CrimsonV said: Everyone knows grad transfers are big business now. It’s written all over college basketball. Well...almost everyone. Little brother even got one Ok, then it shouldn't be a problem for you to come up with a name or 2 that Archie realistically could have gotten for IU... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FW_Hoosier Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 We need to give Archie exactly as long it takes for the Thunder to fire Donovan, whether that’s this year, next year, the year after, etc., then back up the Brinks truck and throw $10M per year at him. That would be my first question for any potential new AD — hopefully the women’s soccer team brings this up in the interviews. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCHoosier32 Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 7 minutes ago, TheWatShot said: If we miss the tourney this year, he should absolutely be gone. The more I see, the more I'm convinced he's just in over his head. I know he didn't inherit a very good roster, but it was hardly bad enough to still be blaming Crean's players two years later. I don't think he's capable of recruiting well enough to get us where we want to be, our defense is leaky and prone to getting torched, and I still haven't figured out what our offense is supposed to look like. i'll be shocked if we make it this year. out of conference we have 1 good win. we're gonna get thumped in conference. i'd still give him 1 more year after this, but i can't imagine us maing it next year without TJD and adding some nice role player pieces. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AxnJxn Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 Question for the board - every game, we seem to have at least one opponent who starts throwing in threes like they were layups. Is this a product of the pack line, or a failure in that scheme? It's getting way too common to just be a coincidence. As for Archie, one of his big points was getting older, but that's not much use if those older players don't play like upperclassmen, and we're not getting much production from ours. Green was pretty much awful, Al ... seriously, wtf?, DD seems to accumulate fouls just by walking on the court, and Justin is ... well, Justin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indy1987 Posted December 30, 2019 Report Share Posted December 30, 2019 58 minutes ago, IUFLA said: How is it on him? He has 4 scholarship guards. One of them got tossed for a stupid move. One has participated in 1/5th of our practices this year. One is a freshman and is, as freshmen tend to be, inconsistent. Who was he supposed to play? Walk-ons? Green played a lot of minutes through neccessity. If Archie had other options, he would have used them. Roster management is 100% on the coach. Did we all not know we needed guards and shooters last year? And yet we added only one guard. And left an OPEN scholarship on the table to boot. Hell Archie didn't1 even have to "Crean" any of Crean's players to add a shooter. And Archie was a guard for goodness sake. He should have known better. Go Hoosiers!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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