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rico

Maryland post game

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I'm not sure I buy into the whole "it's a top-down/administration thing." This seems like too convenient of an excuse for losing. McRobbie and the BOT don't sign off on a contract that makes CAM the highest paid public employee in the state without considering things like winning and maintaining a lucrative brand. Sure, there might be an argument to be made that Archie's hands were somewhat tied when he took over (although from my perspective, this is just hearsay), but at some point, he has to own it. It's not like Pat Shoulders is some wizard pulling levers behind the curtain during games (though he looks like he could play the part). 

I'm not sure if this is still true, but IUMBB had the largest recruiting budget in the B1G (maybe tops in the NCAA?) when Crean was still here. IU has invested heavily in facilities and has a large, passionate fan base. All the ingredients are there. Maybe Archie just isn't a very good coach and it's that simple. 

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2 minutes ago, CTrojan88 said:

Well, the longer you go with the current product, the further into irrelevance you fall.  I want someone who holds players accountable by using the bench.  Making them earn their time, not just running the same lineup out there game in and game out.  Someone who can make in game adjustments to stop runs and someone who knows how to build on a lead versus subbing your way out of one.  There are good ones out there that could take IU basketball back to at least consistent top 5 finishes in the Big 10.  Based on what I’ve seen if Archie, he isn’t that guy.  

We can still get a good coach if they actually research guys who have won at higher levels and not go with the flavor of the month. Making one elite 8 does not make you an elite coach. Remember crean made a final 4.

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I just don’t see how this ends well if this team can’t hit threes.  This team just is what it is.  I think Archie is a good coach, but unless something drastic happens and this thing turns around.....this will probably turn ugly quick.

Edited by ThePaulieWalnuts
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6 minutes ago, Indy1987 said:

A flashy coach with an NBA pedigree would be a great option.  Just look at the kids flocking to play for Penny and Howard(even Ewing).  

I don't even see it as taking a step back at this point(firing Archie).  People keep saying 4 years... but what does our ceiling look like next season???   Maybe we squeak in the dance at best.  Shouldn't we be competing for the B1G championship next year and making it past the 1st weekend in March?   I just don't see it. 

Go Hoosiers!!!

I don't agree because it did not work with Clyde Drexler, IT and it appears that Ewing is not going to work either.

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3 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

 Never, ever want this kind of coach at IU

I agree. Some didn't learn much from the Sampson debacle...

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1 minute ago, FW_Hoosier said:

What did he prove at Dayton?  He had one fluke run to the Elite 8 in this third year, and two regular season titles in a mid-major conference.  Outside of that, he had early exits in the conference tournament and NCAA tournament pretty much every year.  Had mediocre offensive and defensive efficiency numbers and never landed an elite recruit there.  Plenty of midmajor coaches have had similar success and failed to cut it in a power conference.  

Especially when the philosophy is fundamentally flawed... Completely neglecting three-point shooting will never work at the highest levels.

I’m not saying he’s Bob Knight Basketball IQ but he’s not dumb. And he accomplished enough to respect that. No one believe when he signed at IU that he was garbage and no one would believe we’d be at this spot. 
 

I get your points, but I don’t see it as “he proved NOTHING ergo he was certainly going to fail.” I think there was enough hard facts to justify the hire.

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Just now, Bedford1432 said:

We can still get a good coach if they actually research guys who have won at higher levels and not go with the flavor of the month. Making one elite 8 does not make you an elite coach. Remember crean made a final 4.

I totally agree.  Getting an upper tier, competent coach to Bloomington shouldn’t be an issue.  I do think that it will become harder the further into mediocrity this program falls

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Here’s why I love my fellow IU fans.  We’re smart enough to know 11-3 isn’t the problem, it’s that the 3 losses could have been wins with the right coach. 

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6 minutes ago, BDB said:

I hope Scott isn’t reading this while driving home or he will get in a wreck.  

I got home to watch the last 8 minutes of the game

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3 minutes ago, BEKA said:

I'm not sure I buy into the whole "it's a top-down/administration thing." This seems like too convenient of an excuse for losing. McRobbie and the BOT don't sign off on a contract that makes CAM the highest paid public employee in the state without considering things like winning and maintaining a lucrative brand. Sure, there might be an argument to be made that Archie's hands were somewhat tied when he took over (although from my perspective, this is just hearsay), but at some point, he has to own it. It's not like Pat Shoulders is some wizard pulling levers behind the curtain during games (though he looks like he could play the part). 

I'm not sure if this is still true, but IUMBB had the largest recruiting budget in the B1G (maybe tops in the NCAA?) when Crean was still here. IU has invested heavily in facilities and has a large, passionate fan base. All the ingredients are there. Maybe Archie just isn't a very good coach and it's that simple. 

It’s funny how Crean got bombed on for talking about alignment issues or something like that when he was let go, and now some are pointing to the admin. Our admin may not be great, but not having shooters and giving up points like we do isn’t on them. 

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3 minutes ago, BEKA said:

I'm not sure I buy into the whole "it's a top-down/administration thing." This seems like too convenient of an excuse for losing. McRobbie and the BOT don't sign off on a contract that makes CAM the highest paid public employee in the state without considering things like winning and maintaining a lucrative brand. Sure, there might be an argument to be made that Archie's hands were somewhat tied when he took over (although from my perspective, this is just hearsay), but at some point, he has to own it. It's not like Pat Shoulders is some wizard pulling levers behind the curtain during games (though he looks like he could play the part). 

I'm not sure if this is still true, but IUMBB had the largest recruiting budget in the B1G (maybe tops in the NCAA?) when Crean was still here. IU has invested heavily in facilities and has a large, passionate fan base. All the ingredients are there. Maybe Archie just isn't a very good coach and it's that simple. 

Idk but I remember a few more knowledgeable fans saying that with all our upgrades it put our facilities from rock bottom of the Big to middle of the pack. That although they improved A TON, it didn’t put us at the top or anything.

maybe someone can speak to this idk. And I’m NOT saying “oh if only we had better facilities we’d be better on the court.” That’s ridiculous. Just asking and pointing that out

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21 minutes ago, Indykev said:

Who are you and how did you hack this account?

You know when IU Scott starts questioning the coach that it’s all over.  The firing is inevitable.  It’s a when not if now.

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1 minute ago, Fundamentals said:

Here’s why I love my fellow IU fans.  We’re smart enough to know 11-3 isn’t the problem, it’s that the 3 losses could have been wins with the right coach. 

Couldn’t agree more. And sorry but that is a part of what makes our base AWESOME

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Just now, rico said:

Does anybody want to discuss the f*&king game?  Geez.

Idk what else we can discuss. It appears to be all the same issues with no fix in sight.

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Archie's not going anywhere for at least 2 years

I think next year we'll see addition by subtraction

I'm not giving up on this year. I still think we'll make the NCAA tourney

I haven't watched the game yet (DVRed it), but looking at the boxscore and these threads, seems like the same egg we laid in Madison.

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1 hour ago, IU Scott said:

Probably a good thing that I missed most of this game going to my great nephews first birthday party.  When I got into the car I think were down 8 at 46-38 and when  started watching ti was when Maryland started their run.  I have been hopeful that this season was going to be a lot better and thought the players would have gotten better from last year.  I am coming to the conclusion that this is just not a good team and they need to make drastic changes to the lineup.

Until Archi starts getting better shooters and players with higher basketball IQ this is what we will keep seeing.  It is time for Archie to have a come to Jesus meeting with these players and see who actually wants to play basketball for IU.  These players just don't seem to fit as a team and you can tell they don't have great chemistry on the court.  I know there is nothing we can do about the roster right now but after the season this roster needs an overhaul.

You are dead on buddy.  This is not a team.  Last year was not a team.  Wisconsin has become a team. The pressure to win now at IU is so strong that CAM basically has his hands tied as he clearly should have cut bait with some of these guys that have zero heart and zero iq.  Guard depth and shooting.  Woof.  Recruiting has to make a miracle turn this class, as in transfers or a golden nugget or 2 falling from the sky in some late developers or next year is another loss and we all know what that means.  Strike out on 21 and another start over.  

At this point it's time to try something else.  The one thing I haven't seen is 3 guards.  Like you say, they can play 35 mins a game.  Smith can not and should not ever play as a ball handling wing.  

Time to divide the four guards up over 120 minutes then TJD and Brunk get heavy minutes, then sprinkle in some Smith, Demezi, and maybe a Deron sighting 2-3 minutes a half.  

Edited by NotIThatLives
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6 minutes ago, BEKA said:

I'm not sure I buy into the whole "it's a top-down/administration thing." This seems like too convenient of an excuse for losing. McRobbie and the BOT don't sign off on a contract that makes CAM the highest paid public employee in the state without considering things like winning and maintaining a lucrative brand. Sure, there might be an argument to be made that Archie's hands were somewhat tied when he took over (although from my perspective, this is just hearsay), but at some point, he has to own it. It's not like Pat Shoulders is some wizard pulling levers behind the curtain during games (though he looks like he could play the part). 

I'm not sure if this is still true, but IUMBB had the largest recruiting budget in the B1G (maybe tops in the NCAA?) when Crean was still here. IU has invested heavily in facilities and has a large, passionate fan base. All the ingredients are there. Maybe Archie just isn't a very good coach and it's that simple. 

Pat doesn’t want any coach bigger than the program.  He has made that very clear which of course any coach that wins big here would be.  He wants a yes man that wins 20 games and has us in the NCAA tournament most years but nothing more.  Trust me.

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7 minutes ago, Bedford1432 said:

We can still get a good coach if they actually research guys who have won at higher levels and not go with the flavor of the month. Making one elite 8 does not make you an elite coach. Remember crean made a final 4.

Not any of those guys are going to be willing to leave those jobs to come here.

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Just now, BADGERVOL said:

I’m not saying he’s Bob Knight Basketball IQ but he’s not dumb. And he accomplished enough to respect that. No one believe when he signed at IU that he was garbage and no one would believe we’d be at this spot. 
 

I get your points, but I don’t see it as “he proved NOTHING ergo he was certainly going to fail.” I think there was enough hard facts to justify the hire.

Serious question....Was Archie’s resume a bit inflated because of his brother’s success at Arizona?  Now that we know his brother is a scumbag cheater, it could be totally possible that what we are seeing in Archie is as good as it is going to get.  I agree with the comment above that he had one team at Dayton that caught fire at the right time and rode that momentum to the elite 8.  Based on that alone, Archie should have never been the top choice at IU

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1 minute ago, NotIThatLives said:

You are dead on buddy.  This is not a team.  Last year was not a team.  Wisconsin has become a team. The pressure to win now at IU is so strong that CAM basically has his hands tied as he clearly should have cut bait with some of these guys that have zero heart and zero iq.  Guard depth and shooting.  Woof.  Recruiting has to make a miracle turn this class, as in transfers or a golden nugget or 2 falling fro. The sky in some late developers or next year is another loss and we all know what that means.  Strike out on 21 and another start over.  

At this point it's time to try something else.  The one thing I haven't seen is 3 guards.  Like you say, they can play 35 mins a game.  Smith can not and should not ever play as a ball handling wing.  

Time to divide the four guards up over 120 minutes then TJD and Brunk get heavy minutes, then sprinkle in some Smith, Demezi, and maybe a Deron sighting 2-3 minutes a half.  

Honestly if that is the problem and he does something as drastic and a huge exodus from the roster I honestly think that might even buy him another year with the fans. Because it would communicate to everyone “these players are a part of the problem” and “I’m doing something about it.” If he doesn’t idk if he can make it with the slow fix.

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19 minutes ago, JugRox said:

Would love Beard but got a feeling he is waiting on Texas or Kansas.

Marshall isn’t going anywhere.

 

That is the mentality that gets you nowhere. If that’s the mentality of the administration then IU is destined to suck.if you are a historic blue blood making over $100 million in revenue a year as athletic department, you go get your guy. You offer Beard $5 million and go win the day.  

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