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dgambill

Guard Play...is it fixable?

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Just now, Hoosierhoopster said:

Hunter's and Demez's mechanics are fine.

I don't think DA mechanics are good at all.  Who ever told him not to square up to the basket should be shot because you shouldn't shoot with your fee tnot facing the basket.

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1 hour ago, rico said:

For the reason I gave above.  I am sure Dakich was a great shooter in HS!

DipSh?? Dan was the greatet shooter in Indiana history. Just ask him!

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Just now, IU Scott said:

I don't think DA mechanics are good at all.  Who ever told him not to square up to the basket should be shot because you shouldn't shoot with your fee tnot facing the basket.

I'll tell you what, take him out on the floor with you in your church league. He'll drop 50 on you in about 10 minutes. He hit all kinds of shots in high school. "shot mechanics" are frankly often player specific. Yes, squaring up is basic, of course, but how much of that is his timing? You know his mechanics? Tell me about Reggie's shot? Did he bring the ball all the way up from below his waist -- a major no no -- when shooting? Yep. Tell me some more things about his shot -- about as unorthodox in many respect as could be. He's one of the best all time shooters in NBA history.

There are pure shooters -- Steph Curry is I think the best example -- but most just aren't. That doesn't mean they can't shoot, and, again, Demez has a long track record of demonstrating his shooting ability. 

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7 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

I'll tell you what, take him out on the floor with you in your church league. He'll drop 50 on you in about 10 minutes. He hit all kinds of shots in high school. "shot mechanics" are frankly often player specific. Yes, squaring up is basic, of course, but how much of that is his timing? You know his mechanics? Tell me about Reggie's shot? Did he bring the ball all the way up from below his waist -- a major no no -- when shooting? Yep. Tell me some more things about his shot -- about as unorthodox in many respect as could be. He's one of the best all time shooters in NBA history.

There are pure shooters -- Steph Curry is I think the best example -- but most just aren't. That doesn't mean they can't shoot, and, again, Demez has a long track record of demonstrating his shooting ability. 

I don’t think he was saying it impossible to be successful with unorthodox or imperfect Mechanics ...you can come up with many examples of people with slight to significant form issues that are excellent or at least adequate shot makers ...that being said they are the exception more than the rule , MOST good shooters Share many of the same form traits and right now with the shooting as poor as it is you have to point to some reason and I think form is a fair critique ....I think it’s also fair to say it’s easier to get away with shooting flaws at the high school level if you’re a dominant athlete as you can create more open or high percentage shots with your ability where as the same separation doesn't occur at the D1 level 

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12 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

I'll tell you what, take him out on the floor with you in your church league. He'll drop 50 on you in about 10 minutes. He hit all kinds of shots in high school. "shot mechanics" are frankly often player specific. Yes, squaring up is basic, of course, but how much of that is his timing? You know his mechanics? Tell me about Reggie's shot? Did he bring the ball all the way up from below his waist -- a major no no -- when shooting? Yep. Tell me some more things about his shot -- about as unorthodox in many respect as could be. He's one of the best all time shooters in NBA history.

There are pure shooters -- Steph Curry is I think the best example -- but most just aren't. That doesn't mean they can't shoot, and, again, Demez has a long track record of demonstrating his shooting ability. 

I hope he would be able to kill me since I am 49 years old and have had knee surgery plus 30 pounds to much. Plus I am only 5'8

Edited by IU Scott
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16 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

I'll tell you what, take him out on the floor with you in your church league. He'll drop 50 on you in about 10 minutes. He hit all kinds of shots in high school. "shot mechanics" are frankly often player specific. Yes, squaring up is basic, of course, but how much of that is his timing? You know his mechanics? Tell me about Reggie's shot? Did he bring the ball all the way up from below his waist -- a major no no -- when shooting? Yep. Tell me some more things about his shot -- about as unorthodox in many respect as could be. He's one of the best all time shooters in NBA history.

There are pure shooters -- Steph Curry is I think the best example -- but most just aren't. That doesn't mean they can't shoot, and, again, Demez has a long track record of demonstrating his shooting ability. 

Priller was a shooter and scorer in high school.  He probably kill Scott at Church League too.  Sadly there is mounting evidence that at the high division one level Demezi is not that good of a shooter or scorer.  I hope he or hunter or both can get something going my goodness they are due.  Or Franklin he's got the best looking shot of all three of them.

Edited by NotIThatLives
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26 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said:

Priller was a shooter and scorer in high school.  He probably kill Scott at Church League too.  Sadly there is mounting evidence that at the high division one level Demezi is not that good of a shooter or scorer.  I hope he or hunter or both can get something going my goodness they are due.  Or Franklin he's got the best looking shot of all three of them.

Are you really comparing Priller and Demez? Hhahaha

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1 hour ago, rico said:

I haven't changed nothing...but you keep saying recruiting.  I am saying these guys can shoot.  They just ain't knocking them down.  You have some vision of a 5* guard is gonna change everything.  We had that last year.  Didn't go as planned.  You ought to see how the Bucknuts fans are talking about Carton.  I could give plenty of examples.  The bottom line is our shots ain't falling...but these guys know how to shoot.

Yes you switched to "wings hitting 3s" and we were talking about whether IU had highly touted guards.  Lol  But whatever.  Bottomline is our shooting sucks from the outside.  Archie can't shoot it for them but he better start doing something to get them to improve.  Thats his job.  That and recruit better at the guard spot.  Oh and I'd take Carton in heartbeat if he wants to transfer.  

Go Hoosiers!!!

 

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2 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

Are you really comparing Priller and Demez? Hhahaha

You left the door open.  

You are knowledgeable an your only explanation is that he was good in high school.  He also hit 4 of 5 against Joe Blow Southern New Hampshire in one game during the cake walk november schedule.  I'm not saying he won't have a role as a Jr or Sr but if you are placing the expectation on him that he's going to get it going and be this reliable scorer that gets 10 a game in the B1G, it's just not projecting that way.  Would love to eat crow.   

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37 minutes ago, IU/Butler/Notre Dame said:

I don’t think he was saying it impossible to be successful with unorthodox or imperfect Mechanics ...you can come up with many examples of people with slight to significant form issues that are excellent or at least adequate shot makers ...that being said they are the exception more than the rule , MOST good shooters Share many of the same form traits and right now with the shooting as poor as it is you have to point to some reason and I think form is a fair critique ....I think it’s also fair to say it’s easier to get away with shooting flaws at the high school level if you’re a dominant athlete as you can create more open or high percentage shots with your ability where as the same separation doesn't occur at the D1 level 

Hunter's form/mechanics are fine, from what I've seen the same is true of Demez. These guys can shoot. It's not as simple as saying we don't have guys who can shoot -- for that matter, Green is a very, very good shooter, but he also missed everything against Rutgers and his percentages are falling -- falling from a very high percentage. We don't have MANY good shooters, but we do have them. My issue is more with the way we're running our O, including have three bigs, none of whom can shoot from the outside, which kills spacing.

Spacing is key, having open lanes are key -- Look at how we started against OSU, with Rob hitting 3 threes in quick order, that then opened up the floor, and as a team we shot pretty well. Yes we need to add shooting, absolutely. No, we don't have an absence of shooters. No, we're not just not recruiting shooters. The black and white way of looking at things is not something I find very helpful.

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4 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said:

You left the door open.  

You are knowledgeable an your only explanation is that he was good in high school.  He also hit 4 of 5 against Joe Blow Southern New Hampshire in one game during the cake walk november schedule.  I'm not saying he won't have a role as a Jr or Sr but if you are placing the expectation on him that he's going to get it going and be this reliable scorer that gets 10 a game in the B1G, it's just not projecting that way.  Would love to eat crow.   

No, I'm saying he can shoot. He can. I do think eventually he'll improve his percentages, but it's also about our system, who is out there with him, etc. 

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2 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

No, I'm saying he can shoot. He can. I do think eventually he'll improve his percentages, but it's also about our system, who is out there with him, etc. 

So you don't think he gets good looks?

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12 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

Hunter's form/mechanics are fine, from what I've seen the same is true of Demez. These guys can shoot. It's not as simple as saying we don't have guys who can shoot -- for that matter, Green is a very, very good shooter, but he also missed everything against Rutgers and his percentages are falling -- falling from a very high percentage. We don't have MANY good shooters, but we do have them. My issue is more with the way we're running our O, including have three bigs, none of whom can shoot from the outside, which kills spacing.

Spacing is key, having open lanes are key -- Look at how we started against OSU, with Rob hitting 3 threes in quick order, that then opened up the floor, and as a team we shot pretty well. Yes we need to add shooting, absolutely. No, we don't have an absence of shooters. No, we're not just not recruiting shooters. The black and white way of looking at things is not something I find very helpful.

Well there is something we see eye to eye on especially on spacing ....green is an excellent shooter who kills himself by taking shots with a high degree of difficulty more often than he should 

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1 hour ago, NotIThatLives said:

So you don't think he gets good looks?

We lack spacing. We lack lanes. Does he miss some open shots? Yep. Are we getting great looks all over the place? Of course not. However, Rob getting back helped a ton, against OSU. Not so much against Rutgers, but then they're very good defensively, please don't say guys are just missing shots. Rutgers' D had an impact.

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The shooting .pct is pretty high when IU attempts to shoot themselves in the foot to put it nicely.  

I know Hunter is not a guard but you can almost feel he is about to break out.  Just make a couple and hopefully lookout.  Seems like after he missed a jump shot he gets tentative. Gotta be tough after sitting out a year from HS then playing in the B1G.  Surely his rhythm is way off.  With his length, I look forward to him shooting and making 3's over those packed in defenses. 

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3 hours ago, jefftheref said:

DipSh?? Dan was the greatet shooter in Indiana history. Just ask him!

Had an uncle who was "Dandy Dan's" Godfather.  Went to some of DD's games at Andrean.  Not impressed. Considering the talent at the time in Gary.

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I think the poor shooting by this team is in big part a psychological issue.  If they get hot, and believe that misses were more of an outliner, this team would be dangerous. I remember years back hearing about John Smoltz going to a sport psychologist to help him with his pitching.  The gist of the story was that Smoltz learned to blame anything and everything for a bad pitch. The weather, a fan, stadium lights, etc.  It helped him be a confident pitcher.  I think it worked out well for him.  IU has got to have good people in their School of Psychology and Brain Sciences that could work with these guys.  Two for freakin' nineteen is crazy.  Three more threes ties the game, and 8-19 means we win going away.  The confidence it takes to shoot better would likely have a compounding effect in all sorts of positive ways, including psychological damage done to the opponent.  I know I probably am seeing what I want to see, but it seemed to me that this team was playing harder, was more together and did not seem to crawl into a hole when Rutgers punched them in the mouth twice.  

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57 minutes ago, IUDan93 said:

I think the poor shooting by this team is in big part a psychological issue.  If they get hot, and believe that misses were more of an outliner, this team would be dangerous. I remember years back hearing about John Smoltz going to a sport psychologist to help him with his pitching.  The gist of the story was that Smoltz learned to blame anything and everything for a bad pitch. The weather, a fan, stadium lights, etc.  It helped him be a confident pitcher.  I think it worked out well for him.  IU has got to have good people in their School of Psychology and Brain Sciences that could work with these guys.  Two for freakin' nineteen is crazy.  Three more threes ties the game, and 8-19 means we win going away.  The confidence it takes to shoot better would likely have a compounding effect in all sorts of positive ways, including psychological damage done to the opponent.  I know I probably am seeing what I want to see, but it seemed to me that this team was playing harder, was more together and did not seem to crawl into a hole when Rutgers punched them in the mouth twice.  

I see what you’re saying and if it was then going from 50% shooters down to 20% for a prolonged stretch I would agree ...my take is instead of us having “good” shooters ( guys who do it consistently ) we have a back court full of streaky shooters ....when they are on they’ll make the difficult ones when they are off they won’t hit anything 

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4 hours ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

I'll tell you what, take him out on the floor with you in your church league. He'll drop 50 on you in about 10 minutes. He hit all kinds of shots in high school. "shot mechanics" are frankly often player specific. Yes, squaring up is basic, of course, but how much of that is his timing? You know his mechanics? Tell me about Reggie's shot? Did he bring the ball all the way up from below his waist -- a major no no -- when shooting? Yep. Tell me some more things about his shot -- about as unorthodox in many respect as could be. He's one of the best all time shooters in NBA history.

There are pure shooters -- Steph Curry is I think the best example -- but most just aren't. That doesn't mean they can't shoot, and, again, Demez has a long track record of demonstrating his shooting ability. 

In a year and half at IU I can count on one hand how many threes I’ve seen him hit. I might have missed a couple that he made but some guys game drops when on the big stage. Right now I consider Damezi to be one of those guys. 

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