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Penn State Postgame Thread


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4 minutes ago, IU/Butler/Notre Dame said:

I think that’s why losing this one in  non-competitive fashion is MORE frustrating ...sets back the progress of the last four games 

Sets back the progress for who? Us fans? I guess. For the team? I don’t know. We are talking about 18-22 year old kids. Did Kentucky’s progress take a huge step back when they lost to Evansville? Did Duke take take a step back when they lost to Farleigh Dickinson or whoever they lost too? We lost to a top 25 team on the road in the toughest conference in the nation. Did we play ugly? Yes. But can we look at other things? Hunter and race didn’t play. Our bigs got in foul trouble in what I consider a terrible officiating game. Brunk had his worst game this year. Bad DG decided to show up again. I’m not excusing this teams terrible play at times but if you can’t see the improvement in this team since the NW game I don’t know what to say. But do we really need to come in here every time we lose and bash Archie and talk about how many years until he’s let go.  

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10 minutes ago, IU/Butler/Notre Dame said:

Psu shot VERY poorly 

True, but also why they are a better team. Their defense was relentless, they played hard and they wanted it more. They beat us despite their bad offense.

I mentioned in the game thread that when PSU sensed IUs confidence was staring to wane, they stepped on our throat and took no prisoners. This is  what IU needs to learn how to do. They can’t let their focus lapse and need to develop that killer instinct. 

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50 minutes ago, Hoosier83 said:

Is there any chance we might be over reacting to 1 loss? I understand the continuing frustration and play, but we just beat a final four contender in Michigan State and lost by one to a top 20 team who shot light out by 1. I’m just throwing it out there 

Possibly. I sit back and look at our overall record and we are in a way better place than last season right now. 5 wins away from 20 with 5 home games remaining. But the conference is about as competitive top to bottom as it has been in years and every win that slips away reduces the margin for error. Also the team has some fundamental flaws that are not going to magically go away (poor perimeter shooting, inconsistent guard/wing play).

I am still cautiously optimistic we get 20 wins and a NCAA bid. 

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Substitute Bloomington for Mudville and Hoosiers for Casey and here we sum up this thread...

Oh, somewhere in this favored land the sun is shining bright;
the band is playing somewhere, and somewhere hearts are light,
and somewhere men are laughing, and somewhere children shout;
but there is no joy in Mudville — mighty Casey has struck out.

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5 minutes ago, Hoosier83 said:

Sets back the progress for who? Us fans? I guess. For the team? I don’t know. We are talking about 18-22 year old kids. Did Kentucky’s progress take a huge step back when they lost to Evansville? Did Duke take take a step back when they lost to Farleigh Dickinson or whoever they lost too? We lost to a top 25 team on the road in the toughest conference in the nation. Did we play ugly? Yes. But can we look at other things? Hunter and race didn’t play. Our bigs got in foul trouble in what I consider a terrible officiating game. Brunk had his worst game this year. Bad DG decided to show up again. I’m not excusing this teams terrible play at times but if you can’t see the improvement in this team since the NW game I don’t know what to say. But do we really need to come in here every time we lose and bash Archie and talk about how many years until he’s let go.  

1. I respect your opinion and your optimism 

 

2. I’ve not criticized arch mainly just the back court id like him to have five full seasons before I pass any judgement 

 

3.  No set back for the whole program ...id completely agree with you if A). we had the same record as the two teams you mentioned and just happened to blow a game to an off the radar team But otherwise played to our abilities the rest of the time making that game a fluke or b) if our team this year had the same record we do now only with a single home  loss and competitive loses in our road games 

 

our team as currently comprised has to shoot at least moderately well outside and be able to play inside out which means smart controlled drives , crisp and regular ball movement, and valuing the ball/possession/avoiding turnovers.   Our games up to northwestern as you pointed out have a very common theme ...go back and look even against our non conference lay ups we regularly 1. Shot a low percentage from outside or the line 2. Had a low assist total 3. had a high turnover number 4. Had poor guard play / scoring droughts / inconsistent effort

from northwestern for five games ( witj the  exception of the opening five minutes at Rutgers ) we fixed the majority of those problems and looked as though we had turned a corner ...losing at home to Maryland I was fine with and you can go look at that thread I didn’t complain I was impressed because we did every numbered item I listed exceptionally well we just made a couple mistakes down the stretch and missed a good shot to win the game.  Those types of games you can learn from and have positives.  The psu game we were none competitive  when they had literally one of their WORST shooting games of the year.  
 

that’s not being over reactionary what that means is the psu game is evidence that how we played against psu is the norm and our good 4-5 game stretch was the exception ....that’s a set back for the program after a brief stint of the type of play we want / need 

 

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14 minutes ago, Hoosier83 said:

Sets back the progress for who? Us fans? I guess. For the team? I don’t know. We are talking about 18-22 year old kids. Did Kentucky’s progress take a huge step back when they lost to Evansville? Did Duke take take a step back when they lost to Farleigh Dickinson or whoever they lost too? We lost to a top 25 team on the road in the toughest conference in the nation. Did we play ugly? Yes. But can we look at other things? Hunter and race didn’t play. Our bigs got in foul trouble in what I consider a terrible officiating game. Brunk had his worst game this year. Bad DG decided to show up again. I’m not excusing this teams terrible play at times but if you can’t see the improvement in this team since the NW game I don’t know what to say. But do we really need to come in here every time we lose and bash Archie and talk about how many years until he’s let go.  

Voice of reason. 
But will be lost in the madhouse lol.

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12 minutes ago, tdhoosier said:

True, but also why they are a better team. Their defense was relentless, they played hard and they wanted it more. They beat us despite their bad offense.

I mentioned in the game thread that when PSU sensed IUs confidence was staring to wane, they stepped on our throat and took no prisoners. This is  what IU needs to learn how to do. They can’t let their focus lapse and need to develop that killer instinct. 

Agree ...psu and Rutgers wanted it more and you could see it 

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14 minutes ago, Hoosier83 said:

Sets back the progress for who? Us fans? I guess. For the team? I don’t know. We are talking about 18-22 year old kids. Did Kentucky’s progress take a huge step back when they lost to Evansville? Did Duke take take a step back when they lost to Farleigh Dickinson or whoever they lost too? We lost to a top 25 team on the road in the toughest conference in the nation. Did we play ugly? Yes. But can we look at other things? Hunter and race didn’t play. Our bigs got in foul trouble in what I consider a terrible officiating game. Brunk had his worst game this year. Bad DG decided to show up again. I’m not excusing this teams terrible play at times but if you can’t see the improvement in this team since the NW game I don’t know what to say. But do we really need to come in here every time we lose and bash Archie and talk about how many years until he’s let go.  

It's a message board man. When it's good it's good.  When it's bad it's bad.  Currently we're bad

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1 minute ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

Voice of reason. 
But will be lost in the madhouse lol.

I think his take is the correct one after the Maryland game ...psu is cause for concern ...not because they aren’t a good team but we had a string of solid play and came off a home loss that should have had a bad taste in our mouth and we didn’t just lose we got dismantled and were non-competitive....honestly with what you’ve seen so far could you see us winning three consecutive neutral site games against solid competition and making an elite 8 ?  Or even 2 to make a sweet 16 ?

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19 minutes ago, Hoosier83 said:

Sets back the progress for who? Us fans? I guess. For the team? I don’t know. We are talking about 18-22 year old kids. Did Kentucky’s progress take a huge step back when they lost to Evansville? Did Duke take take a step back when they lost to Farleigh Dickinson or whoever they lost too? We lost to a top 25 team on the road in the toughest conference in the nation. Did we play ugly? Yes. But can we look at other things? Hunter and race didn’t play. Our bigs got in foul trouble in what I consider a terrible officiating game. Brunk had his worst game this year. Bad DG decided to show up again. I’m not excusing this teams terrible play at times but if you can’t see the improvement in this team since the NW game I don’t know what to say. But do we really need to come in here every time we lose and bash Archie and talk about how many years until he’s let go.  

Your list of excuses is no different than everyone else's.  Yours just happens to be from someone with a positive point of view.

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8 minutes ago, Rogermci said:

The current star player is 21 years old and fell into Grant's lap.  I live in Dayton and you don't know what you're talking about.  

So Archie recruited him?  Because all I said was Archie isn’t responsible?  
 

Pretty bad of Archie to still be recruiting for Dayton 

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Color me an optimist but right now IU is 15-6 (5-5) with a minimum of 11 games left to play.  5 at home 5 away and 1 BTT tournament game. Finish 20-11 plus whatever happened in BTT.  Still think this is a tourney team. 

But I am going to be patient and take it 1 game at a time and definitely NOT speculate on next year already.  WTF?

  I could die tomorrow and next year dont matter.

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11 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

So Archie recruited him?  Because all I said was Archie isn’t responsible?  
 

Pretty bad of Archie to still be recruiting for Dayton 

My friend  Archie is not recruiting for Dayton.  The core of Dayton's team is seniors Trey Landers from Wayne HS in Huber Heights,  a suburb of Dayton and Ryan Mikesell from St Henry HS about 40 miles  north of Dayton.  Neither was a top 150 recruit but both recruited by Archie.  Both turned out to be brilliant picks and can flat out play.  Archie is still saddled with Crean recruits whom Archie would not have touched with a 10 ft pole.

Archie's 2020 recruits coming in are not that highly ranked but I guarantee you they can play.  So give it a rest and quit bashing him.

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17 minutes ago, Rogermci said:

My friend  Archie is not recruiting for Dayton.  The core of Dayton's team is seniors Trey Landers from Wayne HS in Huber Heights,  a suburb of Dayton and Ryan Mikesell from St Henry HS about 40 miles  north of Dayton.  Neither was a top 150 recruit but both recruited by Archie.  Both turned out to be brilliant picks and can flat out play.  Archie is still saddled with Crean recruits whom Archie would not have touched with a 10 ft pole.

Archie's 2020 recruits coming in are not that highly ranked but I guarantee you they can play.  So give it a rest and quit bashing him.

Very biased take. While 2 returning players  are important to the team the top 3 scorers were all recruited after Archie left. 
 

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21 hours ago, BornHoosier said:

I get your opinion but at what point will this team show some sort of pulse on the road.  Riddle me this, How has a Head coach shown mental instability while not making the tournament in first 2 yrs and continue to show no heart whatsoever on the road in the 3rd yr?  I’d be unglued with the Wisconsin game so I guess we don’t see eye to eye on what’s expected.  I guess I got 30+ yrs frustration built up is all.

I'm not even sure what the team showing a pulse has to do with Archie coming unglued with one minute to go in a game is decided - it's just making an ass of himself for the sake of making an ass of himself. 

I'm not even sure what your question is asking; it's a pretty broken sentence and I don't want to assume what you are asking so please clarify.

I have no idea if you and I see eye to eye on expectations; I can guarantee you and I don't see eye to eye on how ton conduct ourselves and how to motivate players.

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38 minutes ago, mrflynn03 said:

Color me an optimist but right now IU is 15-6 (5-5) with a minimum of 11 games left to play.  5 at home 5 away and 1 BTT tournament game. Finish 20-11 plus whatever happened in BTT.  Still think this is a tourney team. 

But I am going to be patient and take it 1 game at a time and definitely NOT speculate on next year already.  WTF?

  I could die tomorrow and next year dont matter.

I agree with you we will make the tourney ...Im just losing faith in us stringing good games together once we get there 

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3 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

Very biased take. While 2 returning players  are important to the team the top 3 scorers were all recruited after Archie left. 
 

Once again, you have no idea what you're talking about.  Jalen Crutcher a junior was an Archie target from Memphis and would have never committed to Dayton had Archie not started the process in 2016.  He is officially a Grant recruit , but his recruitment started with Miller.  Obi is a once in a lifetime gift.  He had no D1 offers and was a pure fall into a lap recruit that will end up a lottery pick for Grant who I have a lot of respect for.

 

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10 minutes ago, Rogermci said:

Once again, you have no idea what you're talking about.  Jalen Crutcher a junior was an Archie target from Memphis and would have never committed to Dayton had Archie not started the process in 2016.  He is officially a Grant recruit , but his recruitment started with Miller.  Obi is a once in a lifetime gift.  He had no D1 offers and was a pure fall into a lap recruit that will end up a lottery pick for Grant who I have a lot of respect for.

 

Grant gets credit he sealed the deal. He recognized the talent and in a short time frame got the recruitment.  
 

I suppose by that logic because Crean started recruiting Romeo he gets credit for that. Lol

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3 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

Grant gets credit he sealed the deal. He recognized the talent and in a short time frame got the recruitment.  
 

I suppose by that logic because Crean started recruited Romeo he gets credit for that. Lol

Romeo didn't work out.  So blame Archie and blame him for for Hunter's injury last year and for Green's brain dead play this year and Race's injury and Rob's inconsistent play.  I will guarantee you one other thing.  I saw Hunter play in Ohio a half dozen times 2 years ago.  He's a stud.

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1 minute ago, Rogermci said:

Romeo didn't work out.  So blame Archie and blame him for for Hunter's injury last year and for Green's brain dead play this year and Race's injury and Rob's inconsistent play.  I will guarantee you one other thing.  I saw Hunter play in Ohio a half dozen times 2 years ago.  He's a stud.

Well that’s all well and good that he’s a stud but Archie needs to start getting some of these stud guards and wings he’s got to start playing like it  

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15-6 is the result of a extremely weak preseason. It’s misleading to anyone that hasn’t been paying attention. No leverage or accolade there.

JH was unfortunately sick and while I believe he will play a key role otherwise, his absence is no excuse for the lack of presence from others.

I’m big on CAM. I’m sure he will do great things at IU going forward (couple years from now) but that loss was about accountability. Again, my sole issue with this staff. With the exception of the underclass men, not that they are immune to criticism, but I can’t for the life of me understand why a few of these guys are allowed to show up with their head in the sand and continue to get extensive minutes. Exhibit A: Rob has ball on dribble near sideline well behind the arc and Justin runs from the corner, not only toward him but runs right into him? Wth was he thinking? I mean, it was clearly run over Rob, his defender or run out of bounds. Amazing.

IU cashed in an easily winnable game on the road due to carelessness. The refs were bad but they don’t shoot the ball for either team. Mistakes were made by all is the only consistent variable of that game.

Penn State is bad. I don’t care what the current rankings say. They will finish in the bottom half of the big per usual. Unless IU turns it up several notches, they can establish a spot directly above or below Penn state when all is said and done.

The big being the best conference right now probably has a lot to do with college ball over all being down this season. That’s my opinion based on what I’ve seen in comparison to previous seasons. 

IU, should they get selected to the NCAA tourney, will likely get bounced in game 1-2 depending on seeding and which face shows up. That’s reality IMO. 

 

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1 hour ago, Brass Cannon said:

Grant gets credit he sealed the deal. He recognized the talent and in a short time frame got the recruitment.  
 

I suppose by that logic because Crean started recruiting Romeo he gets credit for that. Lol

What in the world leads you to believe Crean started the Romeo recruitment and Archie just picked it up? 

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48 minutes ago, Inequality said:

15-6 is the result of a extremely weak preseason. It’s misleading to anyone that hasn’t been paying attention. No leverage or accolade there.

JH was unfortunately sick and while I believe he will play a key role otherwise, his absence is no excuse for the lack of presence from others.

I’m big on CAM. I’m sure he will do great things at IU going forward (couple years from now) but that loss was about accountability. Again, my sole issue with this staff. With the exception of the underclass men, not that they are immune to criticism, but I can’t for the life of me understand why a few of these guys are allowed to show up with their head in the sand and continue to get extensive minutes. Exhibit A: Rob has ball on dribble near sideline well behind the arc and Justin runs from the corner, not only toward him but runs right into him? Wth was he thinking? I mean, it was clearly run over Rob, his defender or run out of bounds. Amazing.

IU cashed in an easily winnable game on the road due to carelessness. The refs were bad but they don’t shoot the ball for either team. Mistakes were made by all is the only consistent variable of that game.

Penn State is bad. I don’t care what the current rankings say. They will finish in the bottom half of the big per usual. Unless IU turns it up several notches, they can establish a spot directly above or below Penn state when all is said and done.

The big being the best conference right now probably has a lot to do with college ball over all being down this season. That’s my opinion based on what I’ve seen in comparison to previous seasons. 

IU, should they get selected to the NCAA tourney, will likely get bounced in game 1-2 depending on seeding and which face shows up. That’s reality IMO. 

 

I think you’re right about everything but I think penn state is worthy of top 20

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