KoB2011 Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 33 minutes ago, BGleas said: They’re going to be a 5 seed making the Final Four with the best possible opponent they’ve played being potentially a 7seed. The media is going slobber all over themselves talking about how Cal did a masterful job getting these young players to peak at the right time. They're also looking at a very winnable Final Four game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 2 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: They're also looking at a very winnable Final Four game. Yup. We need to pray Villanova keep firing on all cylinders and either Duke or Kansas keeps rolling. Need one of those 3 in the title game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cbp4IU Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 45 minutes ago, BGleas said: He probably will, but I have to admit that I find the overreactions to these coaches abilities based on one win or loss in the tournament hilarious. I’m not a big fan of someone who wins one big game either but he’s either gonna get a huge raise at UMBC or will make 1.5 - 2 mil more a year somewhere else. He would be smart to leave and go to another top tier mid major and wait out for a Maryland like job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 Just now, Cbp4IU said: I’m not a big fan of someone who wins one big game either but he’s either gonna get a huge raise at UMBC or will make 1.5 - 2 mil more a year somewhere else. He would be smart to leave and go to another top tier mid major and wait out for a Maryland like job. I don’t think he’s even remotely earned to Maryland job. I get it was a historic win, but it was one game. He’d have to turn UMBC into a consistent winner for 3-5 years to earn a job like Maryland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cbp4IU Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 3 minutes ago, BGleas said: I don’t think he’s even remotely earned to Maryland job. I get it was a historic win, but it was one game. He’d have to turn UMBC into a consistent winner for 3-5 years to earn a job like Maryland. That’s why I’m saying he goes to another top tier mid major and try to prove he’s consistent and then if he has success why not go to Maryland. If he has success to next 2 years and Turegeon does his usually seasons why not. I know he isn’t ready as I said I’m not a big fan of the 1 win theory too. Also though he did get blown out by like 60 a month ago. But at the same time he’s going to get his money 💰 now then risk not getting a chance ever again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snozzwangers_und_covfefe Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 I hate UK as much as the next guy or gal, but can't fault them for who they are having to play. They've played whichever team is in front of them to this point and won. It's not their fault the other top seeds keep dropping to "lesser" competition. I do think it's been a good job by Cal to get these guys playing the way they are now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seeking6 Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 I'm sure it's been discuss earlier in thread. Just can't remember not only the number of losses but how some of these teams lost. Carolina up 7 lose by 20. Florida St ends game on 31-14 run to end Xavier year. Cincy...(and after Cronin's Feb rant he's had it coming) down 22 and blow that to a Nevada team that was down 14 to Texas on Friday and came back. I know Auburn had injuries but 40 point losses? Sparty couldn't make a shot and it's obvious our own head coach isn't the only one to have trouble with finding good shots vs their zone. Purdue did what they were supposed to do. No big deal either way. Their path was easy so to me (even with Haas injury) no surprises here. I've had them getting beat by Nova in most brackets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 29 minutes ago, Snozzwangers_und_covfefe said: I hate UK as much as the next guy or gal, but can't fault them for who they are having to play. They've played whichever team is in front of them to this point and won. It's not their fault the other top seeds keep dropping to "lesser" competition. I do think it's been a good job by Cal to get these guys playing the way they are now. Not faulting UK/Cal at all. You’re right, they can’t control who they’re matched up against. I just meant that I also don’t think slobbering all over Cal is really justified either, as they’ll most likely make the Final Four with the highest seed they’ve played being a 7. It’s not like they’re knocking off even top 25 teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seeking6 Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 Just a general comment. First time in a long time where in group texts/chats,etc...with friends or people at bars/gatherings for games I'm starting to hear more and more people saying tourney is so crazy it's not fair to judge a coach on an upset. Maybe this will shift people to remember how important it is to win a regular season conference title? Or maybe it's just the emotion of multiple upsets and people trying to justify their coach/team,etc... Either way. I always thought Crean deserved a little more for his 2 conf titles....but on other hand he and his team obviously underachieved in a couple tourneys. Where's the balance lie? And how long do you give a guy to get to a F4 when paying $3+M per year? Plenty of fans this weekend asking themselves what do we do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slojoe Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 Purdue the only higher seed to advance yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Seeking6 said: Just a general comment. First time in a long time where in group texts/chats,etc...with friends or people at bars/gatherings for games I'm starting to hear more and more people saying tourney is so crazy it's not fair to judge a coach on an upset. Maybe this will shift people to remember how important it is to win a regular season conference title? Or maybe it's just the emotion of multiple upsets and people trying to justify their coach/team,etc... Either way. I always thought Crean deserved a little more for his 2 conf titles....but on other hand he and his team obviously underachieved in a couple tourneys. Where's the balance lie? And how long do you give a guy to get to a F4 when paying $3+M per year? Plenty of fans this weekend asking themselves what do we do? While the criticisms of Crean and his team's underperformances in the tournament was part of the issue, there was so much more that kept him from getting more accolades that you feel he deserved. Turnovers, poor defense, teams performing worse as the season wore on, recruiting strategies, roster and in-game management. Just too many negatives that far outweighed the positives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosierhoopster Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 1 hour ago, Seeking6 said: Just a general comment. First time in a long time where in group texts/chats,etc...with friends or people at bars/gatherings for games I'm starting to hear more and more people saying tourney is so crazy it's not fair to judge a coach on an upset. Maybe this will shift people to remember how important it is to win a regular season conference title? Or maybe it's just the emotion of multiple upsets and people trying to justify their coach/team,etc... Either way. I always thought Crean deserved a little more for his 2 conf titles....but on other hand he and his team obviously underachieved in a couple tourneys. Where's the balance lie? And how long do you give a guy to get to a F4 when paying $3+M per year? Plenty of fans this weekend asking themselves what do we do? This is a question that's a good one, but is just going to remain a matter of dispute. My thinking on the balance has been that if your team / coach is consistently competing towards the top in conference, then the tourney resume should be taken care of, as 1) that level of winning in a strong conference should reflect good coaching/recruiting that should translate to the tourney, and 2) the higher seeds you get in tourney play, as a result of strong conference play, should eventually turn into deep runs in the tourney. That's not absolute or fool proof (Bennett has had 1 SW16 and 1 EE while at UVA, despite very strong conference play), but usually it pans out. While I think Crean is unfairly maligned on here and not given the credit that his 2 conference titles, 3 SW16's and 4 tourney appearances reflect, I see his inability to achieve consistency at IU -- regularly competing for conference titles, and not 1-2 year complete fall offs, which in turn I think was a result of his inability to build strong class depth -- as the reason he wasn't (and probably shouldn't) have been given more time for more tourney runs. He likely would've gotten IU back to at least the SW16, and I think a deeper run was likely, but it also likely would've come with multiple years of disappointing conference and tourney results. So I think how long you give a guy depends on how well the guy is competing, regularly, in conference play, in recruiting, and in getting to the tourney. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seeking6 Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 7 minutes ago, Jerry Lundergaard said: While the criticisms of Crean and his team's underperformances in the tournament was part of the issue, there was so much more that kept him from getting more accolades that you feel he deserved. Turnovers, poor defense, teams performing worse as the season wore on, recruiting strategies, roster and in-game management. Just too many negatives that far outweighed the positives. Just so folks know. I thought Crean deserved to be let go because of most of the reasons you shared (minus "some" recruiting strategies)...but during his 2 titles in 4 years I felt many IU fans discounted those conf championships because of tourney results. Just interesting subject to discuss before next weeks carnage starts up again. Boeheim came out this morning speaking so highly of TB. It wasn't a question posed to him...he offered it up at the end of the his appearance on Golic/Wingo. I mean we all know/knew how great Bo Ryan was but he didn't get his national acclaim until his F4's. List goes on and on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 11 hours ago, Cbp4IU said: I’m not a big fan of someone who wins one big game either but he’s either gonna get a huge raise at UMBC or will make 1.5 - 2 mil more a year somewhere else. He would be smart to leave and go to another top tier mid major and wait out for a Maryland like job. remember this is the same coach and team that lost to Albany by 50 points a couple of months ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 2 hours ago, BGleas said: Not faulting UK/Cal at all. You’re right, they can’t control who they’re matched up against. I just meant that I also don’t think slobbering all over Cal is really justified either, as they’ll most likely make the Final Four with the highest seed they’ve played being a 7. It’s not like they’re knocking off even top 25 teams. Just like we did in 2002 where we beat a 12, 13 and a 11 just to get to the final four but we did have to beat a #1 Duke to get there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StLHoosier Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 2 hours ago, Seeking6 said: Just a general comment. First time in a long time where in group texts/chats,etc...with friends or people at bars/gatherings for games I'm starting to hear more and more people saying tourney is so crazy it's not fair to judge a coach on an upset. Maybe this will shift people to remember how important it is to win a regular season conference title? Or maybe it's just the emotion of multiple upsets and people trying to justify their coach/team,etc... Either way. I always thought Crean deserved a little more for his 2 conf titles....but on other hand he and his team obviously underachieved in a couple tourneys. Where's the balance lie? And how long do you give a guy to get to a F4 when paying $3+M per year? Plenty of fans this weekend asking themselves what do we do? I think the reason Crean didn't get much credit, is due to the results of the seasons following a conference title. You can't go from winning the conference title to not making the NCAA tourney every other year. His downfall was his lack of consistency in results and recruiting. Plus when he did make the tourney, the results weren't that great either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 59 minutes ago, StLHoosier said: I think the reason Crean didn't get much credit, is due to the results of the seasons following a conference title. You can't go from winning the conference title to not making the NCAA tourney every other year. His downfall was his lack of consistency in results and recruiting. Plus when he did make the tourney, the results weren't that great either. This. Crean's biggest fault was absolutely not tournament short comings it was his inability to consistently put a good team on the floor. Two missed tournaments and another team that easily could've in his last four seasons is the reason he was fired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 1 hour ago, StLHoosier said: I think the reason Crean didn't get much credit, is due to the results of the seasons following a conference title. You can't go from winning the conference title to not making the NCAA tourney every other year. His downfall was his lack of consistency in results and recruiting. Plus when he did make the tourney, the results weren't that great either. 50 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: This. Crean's biggest fault was absolutely not tournament short comings it was his inability to consistently put a good team on the floor. Two missed tournaments and another team that easily could've in his last four seasons is the reason he was fired. Agree with you both, and HH on this. People keep posting that Crean was fired for going the 3 Sweet Sixteens in 5 years. That's not why he was fired. The 2013 Tourney was disappointing, no doubt, but even that could have been overlooked if it wasn't for the 2 and half years of horrible play following the Zeller/Oliadipo group and the season following Yogi's half season (because that's what it really was) of carrying the program. From 2013-14 through 2017 Crean basically had half a good season and 3 and half years of average to way below average results. That is why he was fired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stlboiler23 Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 3 hours ago, slojoe said: Purdue the only higher seed to advance yesterday. That’s unbelievable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosierhoopster Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 39 minutes ago, Stlboiler23 said: That’s unbelievable. On this, I’ll agree with you.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CauseThatsMyDJ Posted March 19, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 4 hours ago, slojoe said: Purdue the only higher seed to advance yesterday. Kansas State over UMBC West Virginia over Marshall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seeking6 Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 1 hour ago, BGleas said: Agree with you both, and HH on this. People keep posting that Crean was fired for going the 3 Sweet Sixteens in 5 years. That's not why he was fired. The 2013 Tourney was disappointing, no doubt, but even that could have been overlooked if it wasn't for the 2 and half years of horrible play following the Zeller/Oliadipo group and the season following Yogi's half season (because that's what it really was) of carrying the program. From 2013-14 through 2017 Crean basically had half a good season and 3 and half years of average to way below average results. That is why he was fired. Agree with all the above. Just was hearing so many after this weekend talk about maybe we shouldn't be so quick to dismiss a coach. I agree on why Crean was fired. Edit-Sorry was posting from another terminal and it wasn't showing it went through. Feel free to delete others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 21 minutes ago, Seeking6 said: Agree with all the above. Just was hearing so many after this weekend talk about maybe we shouldn't be so quick to dismiss a coach. I agree on why Crean was fired. Edit-Sorry was posting from another terminal and it wasn't showing it went through. Feel free to delete others. Agree, I've been having a good laugh at some of the reactionary takes (not just here, other boards, the media, etc.) on coaches after one loss or one win in the tournament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seeking6 Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 8 minutes ago, BGleas said: Agree, I've been having a good laugh at some of the reactionary takes (not just here, other boards, the media, etc.) on coaches after one loss or one win in the tournament. Full transparency. I hated the reaction Crean got with early tourney losses that I've been quick to point out many other coaches failures. Pretty silly I know but I guess that's what message boards are about. Just seems like for the first time in years I'm hearing many national folks come to the rescue of coaches with early exits. I don't remember that when Crean or others bowed out 5 years ago. I will say this. I'm still Izzo isn't in Sweet 16 for 3rd straight year. That one is tough to fathom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billingsley99 Posted March 19, 2018 Report Share Posted March 19, 2018 Thinking about something interesting. I hate that i have to root for teams to lose because our team didnt make it but nothing would bring me more joy than to see a former Knight assistant knock out Purdue and a former Keady assistant knock out UK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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