IU Scott Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 3 minutes ago, Billingsley99 said: Part of that I can agree with but Indiana is no worse than any other fan base mired in mediocrity or worse. If we had never had success we might be happy to be 11th in the confrontation and 16-9 overall but we want and deserve better I don't think any one is happy with where we are at and what I am talking about is making it personal towards them. It is not being upset that we are playing bad and critiquing the play but when fans call out players and coaches with personal attacks is where there is a problem. Like I said it is not bad on this board but this board only represents a small portion of the fan base. Also starting numerous threads about coaching replacements does not help the program at all so why do something that is bad for the program we all say we love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billingsley99 Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 27 minutes ago, IU Scott said: Let me run a scenario by you guys to see if you would be content with this 10 year outcome from a coach. What I am wanting to find out is if a coach has a great success but does not win a championship would you still want a new coach. 10 NCAA tournaments 6 Sweet 16's 2 Elite 8's 1 Final Four losing in the semi finals 2 Big Ten Championships 1 BTT Championship Never finishing in the bottom half of the conference I for 1 would take that in a heartbeat. You have to get in it to win it. As long as you get there every year I am fine with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 3 minutes ago, Billingsley99 said: I for 1 would take that in a heartbeat. You have to get in it to win it. As long as you get there every year I am fine with it. Just checking to see where people's expectations are. It is not exactly what UW did under Ryan but it was the kind of seasons that UW had. I remember some say that what UW while good was not good enough if he was at IU Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billingsley99 Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 29 minutes ago, IU Scott said: I don't think any one is happy with where we are at and what I am talking about is making it personal towards them. It is not being upset that we are playing bad and critiquing the play but when fans call out players and coaches with personal attacks is where there is a problem. Like I said it is not bad on this board but this board only represents a small portion of the fan base. Also starting numerous threads about coaching replacements does not help the program at all so why do something that is bad for the program we all say we love. I learned a long time ago if you dont want people to talk about you then don't put yourself in that position in the first place. As a coach you just cant get all the praise and glory and not expect to get the bad also.very few athletes or coaches have escaped the negative criticism. Every coach knows what they are getting into many are driven and have giant egos. I am not going to cry over someone criticizing CAM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billingsley99 Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 24 minutes ago, IU Scott said: Just checking to see where people's expectations are. It is not exactly what UW did under Ryan but it was the kind of seasons that UW had. I remember some say that what UW while good was not good enough if he was at IU We dont even the tournament Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JugRox Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 1 hour ago, CrimsonV said: He could choose to not seek employment in the industry. He just wouldn’t be paid a dime. He would be owed north of 7 million over 2 years. if he did what crean did (ESPN analyst), that wouldn’t offset anything. Let’s be generous and say Miller is paid 500k a year by ESPN. IU would still owe him 6 Million over 2 years. And then you have a buyout and salary of the new coach. This is the same administration that didn’t upgrade the men’s locker room from 1987 until a couple years ago. lol Bring up “offset” all you want. IU is not going to pay that buyout. Miller is here for 2 more years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billingsley99 Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 31 minutes ago, IU Scott said: Just checking to see where people's expectations are. It is not exactly what UW did under Ryan but it was the kind of seasons that UW had. I remember some say that what UW while good was not good enough if he was at IU You want to know where my expectations are. I expect the team to play hard to go to class to stay out of trouble and a coach that demands those things. O have enjoyed the first 3 years of Crean much much more that these last 3. Back then we were not competing for titles of any kind, right now we are just not competing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milehiiu Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 6 minutes ago, Billingsley99 said: You want to know where my expectations are. I expect the team to play hard to go to class to stay out of trouble and a coach that demands those things. O have enjoyed the first 3 years of Crean much much more that these last 3. Back then we were not competing for titles of any kind, right now we are just not competing Just a side bar regarding going to class. Coach Miller's contract provides for an annual bonus of $125,000 should the BB team meet or exceed an APR of 950. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgambill Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 9 minutes ago, milehiiu said: Just a side bar regarding going to class. Coach Miller's contract provides for an annual bonus of $125,000 should the BB team meet or exceed an APR of 950. See...now people can understand why Archie loves Justin Smith so much lol. Just kidding! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdhoosier Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 32 minutes ago, IU Scott said: Let me run a scenario by you guys to see if you would be content with this 10 year outcome from a coach. What I am wanting to find out is if a coach has a great success but does not win a championship would you still want a new coach. 10 NCAA tournaments 6 Sweet 16's 2 Elite 8's 1 Final Four losing in the semi finals 2 Big Ten Championships 1 BTT Championship Never finishing in the bottom half of the conference No brainer. The tournament is so unpredictable. The 'best' team going in is rarely the team who wins it all. That has only happened 2 times in the past 10 years. So, IMO, I'd like a team who has a legitimate chance of winning it all every 3 or so years. If there's a proven coach out there that could do that (if we determine CAM isn't our guy) then I'd say sign him up. The problem is, that coach is typically not available and I'm beginning to think it's a pipe dream. Why? We've settled for MUCH less in every coaching search conducted since RMK. Beilein is out there now and meets the criteria. But timing is horrible and the dude is getting old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Indy1987 Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 1 hour ago, IU Scott said: I love that he did that because it shows how stupid fans can be. Like I said I know all schools have their idiots but I just think ours goes beyond most programs. That is your perception living in Indiana. And if I still lived there maybe I'd think that as well. But like I said moving from Indiana 23 years ago I've seen 1st hand how crazy other fan bases are as well. Sure not all have message board forums but pretty much all will bash their teams on facebook and Twitter these days. And it's not just power 5 big schools. Small schools have crazies as well. Go Hoosiers!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 7 minutes ago, tdhoosier said: No brainer. The tournament is so unpredictable. The 'best' team going in is rarely the team who wins it all. That has only happened 2 times in the past 10 years. So, IMO, I'd like a team who has a legitimate chance of winning it all every 3 or so years. If there's a proven coach out there that could do that (if we determine CAM isn't our guy) then I'd say sign him up. The problem is, that coach is typically not available and I'm beginning to think it's a pipe dream. Why? We've settled for MUCH less in every coaching search conducted since RMK. Beilein is out there now and meets the criteria. But timing is horrible and the dude is getting old. How I feel as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billingsley99 Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 47 minutes ago, milehiiu said: Just a side bar regarding going to class. Coach Miller's contract provides for an annual bonus of $125,000 should the BB team meet or exceed an APR of 950. So you get a bonus for making kids do what they are supposed to do. Makes perfect sense. Is there a bonus if no players get arrested and a double bonus if guys graduate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUCrazy2 Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 1 hour ago, IU Scott said: Let me run a scenario by you guys to see if you would be content with this 10 year outcome from a coach. What I am wanting to find out is if a coach has a great success but does not win a championship would you still want a new coach. 10 NCAA tournaments 6 Sweet 16's 2 Elite 8's 1 Final Four losing in the semi finals 2 Big Ten Championships 1 BTT Championship Never finishing in the bottom half of the conference I would take that because a guy putting out those results has shown that he has the potential to win a Championship. The NCAA tournament can be a crap shoot, those results show that the coach is putting you in a good position to take advantage of that crapshoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackson Kellogs Posted February 18, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 14 hours ago, IUFLA said: It's all about you? I'd imagine there are 16 young men and a coaching staff that have waaaaay more invested in this whole deal than any of us, you included. I'm sure losing on the road doesn't bother them a bit...it's all just fun and games...I'm sure they enjoy anonymous people on the internet interpreting their feelings, and criticizing every thing the do...I'm sure our coach enjoys it too...I mean, it's only his job and his coaching resume at stake... Some people just make me wonder... Oh because those players sure look real pissed off when they’re getting their ass kicked don’t they? They show no emotion every time it happens so that’s why I’ve formulated my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrimsonV Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 1 hour ago, JugRox said: He would be owed north of 7 million over 2 years. if he did what crean did (ESPN analyst), that wouldn’t offset anything. Let’s be generous and say Miller is paid 500k a year by ESPN. IU would still owe him 6 Million over 2 years. And then you have a buyout and salary of the new coach. This is the same administration that didn’t upgrade the men’s locker room from 1987 until a couple years ago. lol Bring up “offset” all you want. IU is not going to pay that buyout. Miller is here for 2 more years. He would be owed north of $13M over 4 years. The contract runs through March 2024 (See Section G). I couldn't see him doing the analyst gig. However, I believe he would be scooped up very quickly. The things that initially made him attractive to IU would still be in play for him: youth, pedigree, passion, results. Crean even got a pay increase of $100K going to Georgia. We all know IU is a meat grinder and it takes a special coach to make it tick. I was excited about the hire and really thought we had the guy with the fortitude to make it happen. I'm surprised we're at this point with nothing really solid to hold onto as an identity. This administration certainly had no issue navigating Crean's $4M deal. This one is larger but it would file in just as smoothly. I really hope Coach can figure this thing out. So many want it so bad. I attached sections G and H of the contract. Also ... I'm not saying he is or isn't here for 2 more years. I'm just giving you the details and letting you know buyouts can be navigated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 8 minutes ago, Jackson Kellogs said: Oh because those players sure look real pissed off when they’re getting their ass kicked don’t they? They show no emotion every time it happens so that’s why I’ve formulated my opinion. So the main object of your derision, Coach Miller, demonstrates volumes of emotion every game... So now he's absolved? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 2 minutes ago, IUFLA said: So the main object of your derision, Coach Miller, demonstrates volumes of emotion every game... So now he's absolved? To me in the post game after the UM game Al and Deron did not look like they were happy and was upset with their play. I guess they needed to be throwing things and going through a tirade to show that they care. I am sure these players aren't happy with how they are playing and they sure put a lot more work into the program that we never see. I know we as fans sometimes feel like we care more but we don't put the time, blood and sweat into the program that these players put in every day. These players also are human and have every day problems that all of us have to go through while still be an athlete. They have classes to worry about, they might have something wrong at home that we don't know about or are having relationship problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackson Kellogs Posted February 18, 2020 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 15 minutes ago, IUFLA said: So the main object of your derision, Coach Miller, demonstrates volumes of emotion every game... So now he's absolved? I agree he does show emotion during games, but his players don’t. His players don’t care. That’s the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUwins0708 Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 15 hours ago, JugRox said: LOL....ah, yeah...... Keep going guys, this is better than the Donovan Horse Farm..... What don’t you like? Ignore me please..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IUFLA Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 26 minutes ago, Jackson Kellogs said: I agree he does show emotion during games, but his players don’t. His players don’t care. That’s the problem. I don't know that "they don't care" and you really don't either... Leading a team is difficult. I like the emotion CAM shows but different people handle getting pissed different different ways...I'm not going to judge what someone is feeling by what I see on TV or even from afar if I attended a game... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATX_sig Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 On 2/16/2020 at 11:24 PM, 5fouls said: John Beilein has always been my favorite opposing coach. That said, I still think Archie deserves enough respect to see how this year actually ends and to see how he does with the 2021 recruiting class before we start hiring replacements. I agree about waiting a year. I am more interested to see how the team looks next year to see what he has built. Even if Archie is not the answer, I expect this team will improve. IMO, TJD, Hunter, and Phin are the core to build on and they are just getting their feet wet playing together. Race has been looking good. They will have 3 seniors to provide depth. Franklin looks promising. That said if a new AD came in and pulled the trigger on replacing Archie I would not be disappointed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDB Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 1 hour ago, ATX_sig said: I agree about waiting a year. I am more interested to see how the team looks next year to see what he has built. Even if Archie is not the answer, I expect this team will improve. IMO, TJD, Hunter, and Phin are the core to build on and they are just getting their feet wet playing together. Race has been looking good. They will have 3 seniors to provide depth. Franklin looks promising. That said if a new AD came in and pulled the trigger on replacing Archie I would not be disappointed. Did you copy, paste and edit this post from last year? vbg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JugRox Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 2 hours ago, CrimsonV said: He would be owed north of $13M over 4 years. The contract runs through March 2024 (See Section G). I couldn't see him doing the analyst gig. However, I believe he would be scooped up very quickly. The things that initially made him attractive to IU would still be in play for him: youth, pedigree, passion, results. Crean even got a pay increase of $100K going to Georgia. We all know IU is a meat grinder and it takes a special coach to make it tick. I was excited about the hire and really thought we had the guy with the fortitude to make it happen. I'm surprised we're at this point with nothing really solid to hold onto as an identity. This administration certainly had no issue navigating Crean's $4M deal. This one is larger but it would file in just as smoothly. I really hope Coach can figure this thing out. So many want it so bad. I attached sections G and H of the contract. Also ... I'm not saying he is or isn't here for 2 more years. I'm just giving you the details and letting you know buyouts can be navigated. I thought it would be through 2022....not 2024. Good to know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milehiiu Posted February 18, 2020 Report Share Posted February 18, 2020 2 hours ago, JugRox said: I thought it would be through 2022....not 2024. Good to know. The full compensation goes into March 31 of 2022. As I have posted numerous of times. After that, it gets reduced to 50%. Don't know about you. But I want Archie's attorney. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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