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Reacher

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21 hours ago, Reacher said:

Are you saying there are no long term side effects? We obviously don't know for sure, and won't for many years, but with all the early adverse reactions, it stands to reason there will be. I don't think that is a stretch. I think you are nit picking there.

You can’t prove a negative. You just can’t. Could long-term side effects eventually occur? I guess they could and anything is possible. But there is a lot of information out there to suggest that they won’t. 

https://wexnermedical.osu.edu/blog/covid-19-vaccine-long-term-side-effects?fbclid=iwar2msah5m-rsymx-ivbum1bodtdwaqndcg4jod8nnsnnzkuxhauus41yg48

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One thing we can do is look at all vaccines we’ve produced and studied over time.

Going back at least as far as the polio vaccine, which was widely released to the public in the 1960s, we’ve never seen a vaccination with long-term side effects, meaning side effects that occur several months or years after injection.

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The Pfizer and Moderna vaccines are both messenger RNA vaccines, or mRNA vaccines. RNA stands for ribonucleic acid, a molecule that contains the genetic blueprint for our cells to make proteins. Proteins are used by cells to perform our bodily functions.

mRNA vaccines had been studied for decades before COVID-19 emerged. The vaccine technology had been studied in vaccines against other viruses, such as influenza, rabies and Zika, as well as in treatments for cancer.

Regarding short-term side effects. Yes, they do exist. Nobody has ever said they don’t exist. But again, it’s about measuring risks.

And yes, it’s very important to continue to do research (Again, nobody is saying continued research is a bad thing), but given the information that we have now the benefits outweigh the risks. 

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COVID-19 vaccines have been studied in humans for more than a year now, and more than 174 million people have been fully vaccinated in the United States alone. The vaccines have been shown to be extremely safe. There are several robust safety monitoring systems in place for these vaccines that can detect the very rare adverse events, including: 

 Thrombosis with thrombocytopenia syndrome (TTS) — This is a rare syndrome of blood clots (cerebral venous thrombosis) associated with low platelets that occurred within a few weeks of vaccination of the adenoviral vector vaccine (the Johnson & Johnson vaccine). A recent report from the CDC estimated the rate of this rare effect at approximately three cases per million doses. It was more common in women of child-bearing age. A study from the University of Oxford found that the risk of cerebral venous thrombosis after COVID-19 infection was nearly 15 times higher compared to the rate following vaccination.  

 Guillain-Barre syndrome — This is a rare syndrome, causing a temporary paralysis, that occurred within days of vaccination of the adenoviral vector vaccine. A recent report from the CDC estimated the rate of this rare effect at approximately 7.8 cases per million doses. It’s much more common to get Guillain-Barre syndrome after a viral infection, including COVID-19, than it is to develop the condition from a vaccine.

 Myocarditis — This is inflammation of the heart muscle that was detected within days of vaccination with mRNA vaccines. The cases tended to be mild and self-limited (meaning the patients recovered without intervention). A recent report from the CDC estimated the rate of this rare effect at approximately 3.5 cases per million complete vaccine series. The highest rate was seen in young men (18-29 years). A study from Case Western Reserve University found that young men were up to six times more likely to develop myocarditis after COVID-19 infection compared to those who received the vaccine.  

The safety monitoring systems have been able to detect very rare adverse effects — all of which occurred within days or weeks following vaccination. This is what gives scientists and public health officials confidence in COVID-19 vaccines’ long-term safety — if there were significant side effects, they very likely would have been discovered by now.

 

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Benefits well outweigh risks

Data-gathering is ongoing when it comes to COVID-19 vaccines, and we’re learning more every day about their safety and efficacy. However, we currently have enough information to know that the risk of possible side effects is very low compared to the growing risk of contracting COVID-19, which we do know can cause severe disease, long-term effects and/or death.

 

Edited by tdhoosier
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More facts. The unvaccinated are more likely to spread, catch, be hospitalized, and die from COVID that the vaccinated. 

CDC data shows that there is a significant difference between both groups across all age cohorts in the likeliness to become infected with the coronavirus. Between August and September 2021, the infection rates per 100,000 individuals were six to ten times higher among unvaccinated people compared with vaccinated people of the same age group.

The infection rates have a direct impact on hospitalizations, also newly reported by the CDC by vaccination status. Depending on the age group, hospitalization rates were ten to 15 times higher for unvaccinated individuals.”

Death rates for the two groups are similar to hospitalization rates.

We seem to be having a massive influx of unvaccinated people getting vaccinated b/c of Omicron news. This is good news for everyone. 

With the US currently at roughly 70% of over 12 population vaccinated and 60% of all ages being vaccinated, the numbers are getting better. 

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7 hours ago, tdhoosier said:

You can’t prove a negative. You just can’t. Could long-term side effects eventually occur? I guess they could and anything is possible. But there is a lot of information out there to suggest that they won’t. 

https://wexnermedical.osu.edu/blog/covid-19-vaccine-long-term-side-effects?fbclid=iwar2msah5m-rsymx-ivbum1bodtdwaqndcg4jod8nnsnnzkuxhauus41yg48

Regarding short-term side effects. Yes, they do exist. Nobody has ever said they don’t exist. But again, it’s about measuring risks.

And yes, it’s very important to continue to do research (Again, nobody is saying continued research is a bad thing), but given the information that we have now the benefits outweigh the risks. 

 

 

"we’ve never seen a vaccination with long-term side effects, meaning side effects that occur several months or years after injection."

What kind of definition is this? It's like the CDC changing the definition of a a vaccine.  Nobody is talking about side effects popping up years later. But rather all the adverse events that have been reported, and the untold amounts that haven't been discovered / reported lasting for the long term. We know deaths gave occurred from the vaccines. I'd say that is long term. 

My personal opinion, that article is rather biased. I understand much of the info I bring is biased as well. I am not arguing against bias but if you are going to point it out, than I will as well.

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7 hours ago, Lostin76 said:

More facts. The unvaccinated are more likely to spread, catch, be hospitalized, and die from COVID that the vaccinated. 

CDC data shows that there is a significant difference between both groups across all age cohorts in the likeliness to become infected with the coronavirus. Between August and September 2021, the infection rates per 100,000 individuals were six to ten times higher among unvaccinated people compared with vaccinated people of the same age group.

The infection rates have a direct impact on hospitalizations, also newly reported by the CDC by vaccination status. Depending on the age group, hospitalization rates were ten to 15 times higher for unvaccinated individuals.”

Death rates for the two groups are similar to hospitalization rates.

We seem to be having a massive influx of unvaccinated people getting vaccinated b/c of Omicron news. This is good news for everyone. 

With the US currently at roughly 70% of over 12 population vaccinated and 60% of all ages being vaccinated, the numbers are getting better. 

I have seen a lot of data lately showing that vaccinations are not helping with case counts and deaths .

 

https://roundingtheearth.substack.com/p/systemic-covid-19-vaccine-efficacy-fe3

Observations:

  • Every correlation is positive, meaning that more vaccination is associated with more COVID-19 cases and more COVID-19 deaths, as reported. I plan to set up various time-lagged endpoints and create heat maps for a bigger picture view.

  • Correlations trended more strongly positive as vaccination campaigns matured toward their nearly present state.

 

Check out this slide presentation comparing lives saved vs lives lost-

chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/viewer.html?pdfurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.skirsch.com%2Fcovid%2FVaccineEssentials.pdf&clen=12553017&chunk=true

 

If the vaccines are so effective, why are we seeing all these cases in highly vaccinated countries? Record levels of new cases in Denmark.

https%3A%2F%2Fbucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F1815a951-949d-4991-83af-a7b9a31f5681_750x1334.png

 

But you argue that lives are being saved. Then why are deaths increasing in highly vaxxed Germany?

 

https%3A%2F%2Fbucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F84af834b-2066-49c2-9b99-b6742814f95f_750x1334.png

Look at the tik tok video @Inequality posted. 

To pretend the vaccines are safe and have no side effects is burying your head in the sand. I'm not saying they are not without benefit, but the more information that comes out, the lower that benefit seems to be. 

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3 hours ago, RoadToZion said:

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"Super Green Pass".

It's been all about control since the beginning, been saying it all along but nobody would listen. Scare the shit out of people and they fall in line. Not me. 

Yuri Besnenov, ex KGB agent did an interview on Canadian TV.  If you want the link PM me.

Or look up ideological subversion.  

Edited by mrflynn03
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36 minutes ago, Reacher said:

I have seen a lot of data lately showing that vaccinations are not helping with case counts and deaths .

 

https://roundingtheearth.substack.com/p/systemic-covid-19-vaccine-efficacy-fe3

Observations:

  • Every correlation is positive, meaning that more vaccination is associated with more COVID-19 cases and more COVID-19 deaths, as reported. I plan to set up various time-lagged endpoints and create heat maps for a bigger picture view.

  • Correlations trended more strongly positive as vaccination campaigns matured toward their nearly present state.

 

Check out this slide presentation comparing lives saved vs lives lost-

chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/viewer.html?pdfurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.skirsch.com%2Fcovid%2FVaccineEssentials.pdf&clen=12553017&chunk=true

 

If the vaccines are so effective, why are we seeing all these cases in highly vaccinated countries? Record levels of new cases in Denmark.

https%3A%2F%2Fbucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F1815a951-949d-4991-83af-a7b9a31f5681_750x1334.png

 

But you argue that lives are being saved. Then why are deaths increasing in highly vaxxed Germany?

 

https%3A%2F%2Fbucketeer-e05bbc84-baa3-437e-9518-adb32be77984.s3.amazonaws.com%2Fpublic%2Fimages%2F84af834b-2066-49c2-9b99-b6742814f95f_750x1334.png

Look at the tik tok video @Inequality posted. 

To pretend the vaccines are safe and have no side effects is burying your head in the sand. I'm not saying they are not without benefit, but the more information that comes out, the lower that benefit seems to be. 

Tiktok videos and crazies on Substack, sounds fun! No thank you. I’m sure you’ve seen “a lot” of data proving your point, b/c their is a cottage industry of whackos out there. 

Here is your EU athlete claim already being investigated and proven wrong:

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2021/dec/01/blog-posting/theres-no-proof-covid-19-vaccines-are-causing-heal/

But I get it, I understand your goal is to flood the thread with bogus information and hope that the three of us who bother refuting it are too tired or busy to respond. 

 

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Hi all - the following is unrelated to any of the last 10-15 posts, so please don't view it as a response to that.

After careful consideration over a long period of time, the mod team here has decided to at least temporarily close this thread.

I've been one of the most active participants in this thread - it should not shock you to hear that I think it has provided great value!  From a time when we knew so little about COVID, to a time now where I think we can all agree we know far too much about viruses for comfort, this thread has served as a largely informative back-and-forth between members from all walks of life.  It has helped me broaden my viewpoints and learn how others approach problems we're all facing.  A hearty thank-you to everyone who engaged in good faith and good spirits.  

At the same time, I would imagine anyone reading this thread would agree that opinions seem relatively baked in.  If a time re-emerges where we feel it would be in everyone's best interest to have a good faith back-and-forth here, we'll consider re-opening this thread.  As it stands, we don't see much utility in the same back-and-forth over a particular set of facts.

This thread has sparked activity in our fun little OT board.  Going forward, we hope you stick around and discuss the more mundane, non-IU sports parts of our lives!  I know that I've deeply enjoyed getting to know more than if a particular poster likes or dislikes Archie Miller.  It adds complexity and depth to my understanding of who each of you are.

As a mod team, we try not to think of ourselves as any smarter, better, or more knowledgeable than anyone else.  We see ourselves as the shepherds of good times and good conversations, no more.  We made this decision after careful consideration. 

This is not an outright ban on COVID discussion.  As always, please remember our rules.  If COVID comes up organically in another topic, so be it.  We're living through a transformative time in our collective lives - it would be foolish to try to say we can't talk about it.  Instead, what we're saying is this: we don't feel we need a dedicated thread that has been going around in circles for 100 pages solely focused on it.

Hope to see you all in the DIY thread, the beer thread, or the next great thread here in OT that someone thinks of.  

HF

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