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Reacher
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11 hours ago, Reacher said:

If we will have boosters that account for Omnicron in a couple months, I think it is pointless to get a booster now. Just wait for the new improved version. 

As for Omnicron, The unvaccinated cases I heard about were asymptomatic. Agree that all cases have been mild. No cause for panic. Or states of emergencies. Or extra boosters.

Only 2 known deaths in Africa reported so far.

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Heart issues in women under 50 with the J&J jab. The warning used to be in big red letters, but that has disappeared on the cdc and my local drug store sites. 

Heart issues in young males with Moderna and Pfizer.....

Both are said to be rare.  But j&j is enough of an issue, they openly push women towards "better options"

I personally don't know anyone who has had these heart issues from the shot.

But my dads Dr and cardiologist both told him not to take the shot earlier this year.  2 months later they told him to go ahead and take, it was safe. What changed, why go from we don't recommend it, to meh, its safe?

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This story hits close to home as I previously lived in Naperville and both my kids were born at that hospital. 

https://www.theepochtimes.com/dying-covid-19-patient-recovers-after-court-orders-hospital-to-administer-ivermectin_4130754.html?utm_source=partner&utm_campaign=ZeroHedge

I won't go there for medical care after seeing this story. They are supposed to care for their patients, not fight them.

If it happened here, I'm sure there are many other similar cases. How many died unnecessarily? And who will be held accountable for those deaths? 

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1 hour ago, hoosier_exotics said:

So far Omicron looks to be very mild...  could this be what covid is mutating to?  The more contagious,  less deadly version that we will have to live with?

Not saying its a cold or flu, but following that path?

Viral history seems to suggest that virus's mutate quite a bit (the RNA replication process is typically full of errors thus leading to many millions of slight mutations) so it will be very common just like the flu virus we will see this change over time. Now through natural selection those mutations that lead to more transmissibility are what is typically favored and typically take hold and become the more dominant strain. Now, this would mean that those changes that could cause the virus to spread more easily (perhaps live longer on surfaces or evade detection in the immune system etc etc) would have a higher chance to replace the older strain. However, that isn't the only way it can change....it can become more resistant, virulent, and deadly but if it is more deadly and makes people sicker it would naturally run into the problem of limiting it's ability to spread. Kill or sicken your host too quickly and efficiently then that mutation dies along with those few that attain it. If someone becomes so sick or immobilized by a stronger/more deadly virus those people are far less likely to go around spreading it and for it to take hold in the public and muscle out the other more common strains. It is far more likely and what we typically see the strains that become highly transmissible be the ones that spread more rapidly and become the norm we deal with. A strain that might go undetected or have high rates of asymptomatic hosts would lend itself very well to pervading it's way through society.

This doesn't mean those types aren't deadly....far be it...after all the simple flu virus was killing tens of thousands of people a year. Even this new strain of Covid that has limited symptoms for most people could still become very deadly perhaps to sick and at risk individuals if it is able to evade our antibody defenses through these vaccines and our protective PPE measures. Sometimes it isn't how strong the virus is that makes it deadly...it's just the fact that the virus can get into more people more easily and undetected until it finds a very weak host that it overwhelms. So while most of the studying I've done on how virus's typically react suggests that over time this virus will change many many times up and down the severity spectrum, it is more likely then not for the more "successful" strains of the virus skew to being more transmissible and less virulent (lethal) if it is to survive long term (which is what I would expect). So I'd say less severe symptoms and less virulent virus might be what we continue to see it doesn't mean it can't be deadly to very weak immune hosts, so we still have to be vigilant in protecting them. It also doesn't mean that later on a potentially very deadly/strong strain could come along....however given our vigilence and increased understanding of the virus and how to treat it now...we should be much more capable of isolating, containing, and treating a more virulent/lethal strain.

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https://phmpt.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/11/5.3.6-postmarketing-experience.pdf

The FDA wanted 55 years to turn over documents relating to their vaccine approvals process. Now we know why. The first batch of documents have been released. Over 1200 deaths in the first 90 days post vaccine. And tens of thousands adverse reactions. Females should be extra careful as they reported 3 times the number of adverse events. 

I think it is now abundantly clear. The vaccine has risks. Covid has a 99.9% recovery rate. The FDA has something to hide. 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, Reacher said:

This story hits close to home as I previously lived in Naperville and both my kids were born at that hospital. 

https://www.theepochtimes.com/dying-covid-19-patient-recovers-after-court-orders-hospital-to-administer-ivermectin_4130754.html?utm_source=partner&utm_campaign=ZeroHedge

I won't go there for medical care after seeing this story. They are supposed to care for their patients, not fight them.

If it happened here, I'm sure there are many other similar cases. How many died unnecessarily? And who will be held accountable for those deaths? 

My wife spent a night in there for a heart episode (minor) about 15 years ago...

The place struck me as one that placed more emphasis on appearance than anything...burled wood furniture and the whole bit...one night, $4,800...

Of course, they didn't get that much out of Tricare...

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4 minutes ago, Reacher said:

https://phmpt.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/11/5.3.6-postmarketing-experience.pdf

The FDA wanted 55 years to turn over documents relating to their vaccine approvals process. Now we know why. The first batch of documents have been released. Over 1200 deaths in the first 90 days post vaccine. And tens of thousands adverse reactions. Females should be extra careful as they reported 3 times the number of adverse events. 

I think it is now abundantly clear. The vaccine has risks. Covid has a 99.9% recovery rate. The FDA has something to hide. 

 

 

SMH no.  Thats not what my tv told me :coffee:

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20 minutes ago, dgambill said:

Viral history seems to suggest that virus's mutate quite a bit (the RNA replication process is typically full of errors thus leading to many millions of slight mutations) so it will be very common just like the flu virus we will see this change over time. Now through natural selection those mutations that lead to more transmissibility are what is typically favored and typically take hold and become the more dominant strain. Now, this would mean that those changes that could cause the virus to spread more easily (perhaps live longer on surfaces or evade detection in the immune system etc etc) would have a higher chance to replace the older strain. However, that isn't the only way it can change....it can become more resistant, virulent, and deadly but if it is more deadly and makes people sicker it would naturally run into the problem of limiting it's ability to spread. Kill or sicken your host too quickly and efficiently then that mutation dies along with those few that attain it. If someone becomes so sick or immobilized by a stronger/more deadly virus those people are far less likely to go around spreading it and for it to take hold in the public and muscle out the other more common strains. It is far more likely and what we typically see the strains that become highly transmissible be the ones that spread more rapidly and become the norm we deal with. A strain that might go undetected or have high rates of asymptomatic hosts would lend itself very well to pervading it's way through society.

This doesn't mean those types aren't deadly....far be it...after all the simple flu virus was killing tens of thousands of people a year. Even this new strain of Covid that has limited symptoms for most people could still become very deadly perhaps to sick and at risk individuals if it is able to evade our antibody defenses through these vaccines and our protective PPE measures. Sometimes it isn't how strong the virus is that makes it deadly...it's just the fact that the virus can get into more people more easily and undetected until it finds a very weak host that it overwhelms. So while most of the studying I've done on how virus's typically react suggests that over time this virus will change many many times up and down the severity spectrum, it is more likely then not for the more "successful" strains of the virus skew to being more transmissible and less virulent (lethal) if it is to survive long term (which is what I would expect). So I'd say less severe symptoms and less virulent virus might be what we continue to see it doesn't mean it can't be deadly to very weak immune hosts, so we still have to be vigilant in protecting them. It also doesn't mean that later on a potentially very deadly/strong strain could come along....however given our vigilence and increased understanding of the virus and how to treat it now...we should be much more capable of isolating, containing, and treating a more virulent/lethal strain.

I would like to see this message from doctors and elected officials because it is virus behavior 101. Killing the host at a high enough rate and the virus itself dies. The milder the symptoms, the greater the opportunity to spread. Honest messaging is always preferable to fear mongering. As you said, this doesn't mean that it is not dangerous to some at risk or compromised people. It just means that the majority can continue to live their lives in a relatively normal manner.

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2 hours ago, Lostin76 said:

Recently saw this quote and it feels apt to me:

“Insisting on your rights without acknowledging your responsibilities isn’t freedom. It’s adolescence.”

I think substituting something like 'misguided' for adolescence carries a more powerful message.  

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4 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said:

This is asinine

Seems alot of people are dismissive of those that have concerns because of religious beliefs.

I remember reading the last chapter of a very old book that has some similarities to what is going on. Maybe the world needs the rapture. Getting harder to deal with this clown show. 

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21 minutes ago, mrflynn03 said:

Seems alot of people are dismissive of those that have concerns because of religious beliefs.

I remember reading the last chapter of a very old book that has some similarities to what is going on. Maybe the world needs the rapture. Getting harder to deal with this clown show. 

But hey, follow the science.  Germans may put up a fight.  I know my old stubborn grandma would.

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20 minutes ago, mrflynn03 said:

Seems alot of people are dismissive of those that have concerns because of religious beliefs.

I remember reading the last chapter of a very old book that has some similarities to what is going on. Maybe the world needs the rapture. Getting harder to deal with this clown show. 

You know I love you man, but I would point out that “alot of people” are also dismissive of the roughly 800,000 US deaths so far b/c of this. And we are still averaging just under a 1,000 new deaths a day. 

It’s also hard to deal with people not taking this seriously. That’s the clown show I see. 

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5 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said:

But hey, follow the science.  Germans may put up a fight.  I know my old stubborn grandma would.

Who knows what will transpire here, but I will never be forced out of my house and separated from my family. If that's how it ends for me then so be it, but I'll go down fighting. 

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6 minutes ago, Lostin76 said:

You know I love you man, but I would point out that “alot of people” are also dismissive of the roughly 800,000 US deaths so far b/c of this. And we are still averaging just under a 1,000 new deaths a day. 

It’s also hard to deal with people not taking this seriously. That’s the clown show I see. 

The human toll in so many ways death,mental,physical  hasn't been ignored by me. 

The whole world is a clown show on all levels. Just getting hard to deal with it all. 

Honestly, I'm considering using my insurance and possibly finding a professional to talk to. All of it is wearing me out. 

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