Coaching Carousel has already started!

[milehiiu]

4 hours ago, Seeking6 said:

John Beilein has been linked to this job. 

 

Whatever floats their boat, I guess.  Beilein is 67 years of age. Has been fired/pushed out of the NBA.  And is less than two years from having a double bye pass operation on his heart.

If he is Wake's leading candidate. I would hate to see who else is on their list.

[ephul]

1 minute ago, milehiiu said:

Whatever floats their boat, I guess.  Beilein is 67 years of age. Has been fired from the NBA.  And is less than two years from having a double bye pass operation on his heart.

If he is Wake's leading candidate. I would hate to see who else is on their list.

I'll have to disagree. I'd take Beilein in a heartbeat. Knows how to build a program and win. Will leave a program better than he left it.

[milehiiu]

4 minutes ago, ephul said:

I'll have to disagree. I'd take Beilein in a heartbeat. Knows how to build a program and win. Will leave a program better than he left it.

Always great to hear from you.  Naw. I'll stick to my guns.  I dare say Cleveland knew something we didn't.  Don't get me wrong. I like the guy. But I would not want him in my program considering his age, and all that has gone down in recent years.

Most men have their middle age crisis's earlier in life.  John waited till his mid '60's.  First, leaving Michigan by surprise.  For what he claimed was to follow his dream in the NBA.  Only to leave Cleveland after just one year. 

 

[IU Scott]

3 minutes ago, milehiiu said:

Always great to hear from you.  Naw. I'll stick to my guns.  I dare say Cleveland knew something we didn't.  Don't get me wrong. I like the guy. But I would not want him in my program considering his age, and all that has gone down in recent years.

If we had an opening Belein would be my top choice.  Just because it didn't work out in the NBA doesn't change how good of a college coach he is.

[milehiiu]

1 minute ago, IU Scott said:

If we had an opening Belein would be my top choice.  Just because it didn't work out in the NBA doesn't change how good of a college coach he is.

It's not just the NBA.  He left MIchigan in a lurch. Not to mention, again his age, and heart issue.

Why John Beilein leaving Michigan and jumping to the Cavaliers makes a lot more sense than you think - CBSSports.com

[ephul]

8 minutes ago, milehiiu said:

Always great to hear from you.  Naw. I'll stick to my guns.  I dare say Cleveland knew something we didn't.  Don't get me wrong. I like the guy. But I would not want him in my program considering his age, and all that has gone down in recent years.

Most men have their middle age crisis's earlier in life.  John waited till his mid '60's.  First, leaving Michigan by surprise.  For what he claimed was to follow his dream in the NBA.  Only to leave Cleveland after just one year. 

 

Beilein walked into a bad situation in the NBA. Which was his mistake and choosing.... but when you have guys like Charles Barkley defending you over the players in Cleveland, that tells me Beilein never stood a chance.

I'll take a few years of winning, over decades of coaching changes. Gimme Beilein for 5 years over a crapshoot of young coaches

[BGleas]

3 minutes ago, ephul said:

Beilein walked into a bad situation in the NBA. Which was his mistake and choosing.... but when you have guys like Charles Barkley defending you over the players in Cleveland, that tells me Beilein never stood a chance.

I'll take a few years of winning, over decades of coaching changes. Gimme Beilein for 5 years over a crapshoot of young coaches

Especially at a school like Wake Forest. He’d be a grand slam hire for a program like that, even if it’s just for 5 or so years. 

[jefftheref]

11 minutes ago, milehiiu said:

Always great to hear from you.  Naw. I'll stick to my guns.  I dare say Cleveland knew something we didn't.  Don't get me wrong. I like the guy. But I would not want him in my program considering his age, and all that has gone down in recent years.

Most men have their middle age crisis's earlier in life.  John waited till his mid '60's.  First, leaving Michigan by surprise.  For what he claimed was to follow his dream in the NBA.  Only to leave Cleveland after just one year. 

 

I agree with Mile on this one. Let's say he gets the job. In will take him a couple of years to establish the culture and recruit his type of players. He will then be 70. He sticks around a couple more years and decides to retire at age 72-73. When the new coach comes in he wants his players and will want to establish his own culture. That will take another 3-5 years. Going for the short term easy fix solution with a much older coach will create long term issues. Although Archie has struggled he is young enough that when he gets his players, plan and culture in place we will be set for a long long time. 

[milehiiu]

5 minutes ago, ephul said:

Beilein walked into a bad situation in the NBA. Which was his mistake and choosing.... but when you have guys like Charles Barkley defending you over the players in Cleveland, that tells me Beilein never stood a chance.

I'll take a few years of winning, over decades of coaching changes. Gimme Beilein for 5 years over a crapshoot of young coaches

 The life expectancy of a 67 year old white male says he will live to 84.  Heck, IU could have John for more than five years !   That stat aside.  I am still passing. Go for it, WF !

[milehiiu]

2 minutes ago, jefftheref said:

I agree with Mile on this one. Let's say he gets the job. In will take him a couple of years to establish the culture and recruit his type of players. He will then be 70. He sticks around a couple more years and decides to retire at age 72-73. When the new coach comes in he wants his players and will want to establish his own culture. That will take another 3-5 years. Going for the short term easy fix solution with a much older coach will create long term issues. Although Archie has struggled he is young enough that when he gets his players, plan and culture in place we will be set for a long long time. 

Thanks. You raise some great points.  Always thinking of a young vibrant coach. One who kids expect will be there for years.  Ala Coach Knight when he first came to IU.

[ephul]

8 minutes ago, jefftheref said:

I agree with Mile on this one. Let's say he gets the job. In will take him a couple of years to establish the culture and recruit his type of players. He will then be 70. He sticks around a couple more years and decides to retire at age 72-73. When the new coach comes in he wants his players and will want to establish his own culture. That will take another 3-5 years. Going for the short term easy fix solution with a much older coach will create long term issues. Although Archie has struggled he is young enough that when he gets his players, plan and culture in place we will be set for a long long time. 

Not sure why an incoming coach would want to change the culture after Beilein. He's proven to build a culture of smart, 4 year players with a one and done here and there.

 

Sure, an incoming coach may want to change the system a bit, but Beilein is going to leave the program with great players that a new coach could win now with, while gradually recruiting to their personal style.

 

We are assuming that the choice is Beilein vs. young coach that will have great success. IU has had a hard enough time finding a young winner. I doubt Wake Forest is going to find that right off the bat.

 

Beilein is a surefire winner that will bring relevance to any program. I'll take a few years of winning versus a major gamble that'll most likely lead to years of coaching searches. Wake Forest will be a more attractive job to a young candidate AFTER Beilein than it is now

[milehiiu]

13 minutes ago, ephul said:

Not sure why an incoming coach would want to change the culture after Beilein. He's proven to build a culture of smart, 4 year players with a one and done here and there.

 

Sure, an incoming coach may want to change the system a bit, but Beilein is going to leave the program with great players that a new coach could win now with, while gradually recruiting to their personal style.

 

We are assuming that the choice is Beilein vs. young coach that will have great success. IU has had a hard enough time finding a young winner. I doubt Wake Forest is going to find that right off the bat.

 

Beilein is a surefire winner that will bring relevance to any program. I'll take a few years of winning versus a major gamble that'll most likely lead to years of coaching searches. Wake Forest will be a more attractive job to a young candidate AFTER Beilein than it is now

You make a compelling argument.  Very much appreciated.  And I might be willing to buy into it, if it were not for this :

Cavs news: John Beilein cites health reasons for resignation

[DWB]

53 minutes ago, milehiiu said:

It's not just the NBA.  He left MIchigan in a lurch. Not to mention, again his age, and heart issue.

Not to pop your balloon Mile, but I had a triple bypass 3 years ago, at a "relatively" young age. (65)

If it wasn't for the scar, I'd never know I had it done. No limitations on my activities at all. Bypass surgeries today are almost as commonplace as appendectomies. But many people who have it done, also have other significant underlying conditions. ie respiratory issues from smoking, diabetes, etc. I was lucky in that regard.

While we don't know Beilein's full medical history, on the surface I wouldn't consider that a disqualifier for him.

[Seeking6]

2 hours ago, BGleas said:

Especially at a school like Wake Forest. He’d be a grand slam hire for a program like that, even if it’s just for 5 or so years. 

Agree as well....especially considering what Mack Brown is doing 80 miles to the East with UNC Football I don't think the age thing plays a part at all. 

[5fouls]

If I was an AD, and John Beilein was 47 instead of 67, I would fire whatever coach I had and hire him.  He's that good.  

That said, if I'm Wake Forest, I do have to pause because of his age.  If you're Wake, you need to look to catch lightning in a bottle with a younger coach.  What you don't want is to be looking for a new coach at the same time Duke, UNC, Syracuse, etc.  And, given the age of those coaches, if Wake hired Belein, they would be right there in the same timeframe.

[ephul]

15 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

If I was an AD, and John Beilein was 47 instead of 67, I would fire whatever coach I had and hire him.  He's that good.  

That said, if I'm Wake Forest, I do have to pause because of his age.  If you're Wake, you need to look to catch lightning in a bottle with a younger coach.  What you don't want is to be looking for a new coach at the same time Duke, UNC, Syracuse, etc.  And, given the age of those coaches, if Wake hired Belein, they would be right there in the same timeframe.

If I'm an AD, I hire Beilein and make the job as attractive as possible when he calls it quits. Then you potentially hire from within or start looking again, but with a bit more attractiveness.

I just don't see a great young coach leaving the comfort of their current programs to take the Wake Forest job.

[5fouls]

1 minute ago, ephul said:

If I'm an AD, I hire Beilein and make the job as attractive as possible when he calls it quits. Then you potentially hire from within or start looking again, but with a bit more attractiveness.

I just don't see a great young coach leaving the comfort of their current programs to take the Wake Forest job.

It would not matter what Beilein does at Wake, that job is not going to draw interest when Duke, UNC, and Syracuse are open as well.  Texas Tech hit with Chris Beard.  Going back a while, Butler hit with Brad Stevens, and Gonzaga hit with Mark Few.  That's what a program like Wake Forest needs to hope for.  

[Seeking6]

3 minutes ago, ephul said:

If I'm an AD, I hire Beilein and make the job as attractive as possible when he calls it quits. Then you potentially hire from within or start looking again, but with a bit more attractiveness.

I just don't see a great young coach leaving the comfort of their current programs to take the Wake Forest job.

In the same spirit I agree. You have to make this position desired again and JB could do that. Especially at a time when that whole league is going to be in transition in the next few years with K, Roy, Boeheim,etc...all stepping down eventually. Get JB and make the tourney regularly (they've only made it once in ten years) again which will make others seek the job out. Or something along those lines.

[milehiiu]

2 hours ago, DWB said:

Not to pop your balloon Mile, but I had a triple bypass 3 years ago, at a "relatively" young age. (65)

If it wasn't for the scar, I'd never know I had it done. No limitations on my activities at all. Bypass surgeries today are almost as commonplace as appendectomies. But many people who have it done, also have other significant underlying conditions. ie respiratory issues from smoking, diabetes, etc. I was lucky in that regard.

While we don't know Beilein's full medical history, on the surface I wouldn't consider that a disqualifier for him.

Appreciate your input.  And may God continue to bless you with good health. However, in John's case, he admitted to stepping down from the Cleveland gig for fears the stress of losing  was causing him mentally and physically. AFTER having his surgery.  The college game is a whole different animal, when one considers having to go through the rigors of recruiting and attempting to bring young athletes to a level to complete in D-1 basketball.  Just my humble opinion.  And again so glad you are doing well after your bypass surgery.   Which has allowed you to be a great Hoosier Sports Nation contributor.

[Beowulf50]

1 hour ago, milehiiu said:

Appreciate your input.  And may God continue to bless you with good health. However, in John's case, he admitted to stepping down from the Cleveland gig for fears the stress of losing  was causing him mentally and physically. AFTER having his surgery.  The college game is a whole different animal, when one considers having to go through the rigors of recruiting and attempting to bring young athletes to a level to complete in D-1 basketball.  Just my humble opinion.  And again so glad you are doing well after your bypass surgery.   Which has allowed you to be a great Hoosier Sports Nation contributor.

Mile all do respect but you are painting JB as a DOA coach. I didn’t like his coaching against IU but no one can argue that he did a tremendous job! His tournament record we haven’t seen in a longtime unfortunately! 

[milehiiu]

11 minutes ago, Beowulf50 said:

Mile all do respect but you are painting JB as a DOA coach. I didn’t like his coaching against IU but no one can argue that he did a tremendous job! His tournament record we haven’t seen in a longtime unfortunately! 

Respect to you as well. And thanks for being a member.  I am not looking at his past. Rather his future.  And in the most recent past abandoning unexpectedly , not one, but two HC gigs.  Not even mentioning his own concern about his health.  Was a time I would have welcomed John with open arms.  But not now.

[Steubenhoosier]

4 hours ago, jefftheref said:

I agree with Mile on this one. Let's say he gets the job. In will take him a couple of years to establish the culture and recruit his type of players. He will then be 70. He sticks around a couple more years and decides to retire at age 72-73. When the new coach comes in he wants his players and will want to establish his own culture. That will take another 3-5 years. Going for the short term easy fix solution with a much older coach will create long term issues. Although Archie has struggled he is young enough that when he gets his players, plan and culture in place we will be set for a long long time. 

Ageism is a human resource issue as much as all the other-isms.

If JB is the most qualified candidate Wake can identify, then age should have no place in the conversation 

[Proud2BAHoosier]

43 minutes ago, Steubenhoosier said:

Ageism is a human resource issue as much as all the other-isms.

If JB is the most qualified candidate Wake can identify, then age should have no place in the conversation 

I'm just an old fartism…. Just ask the wife

[IU4Ever]

If I'm the Wake AD, I'd be a little concerned about the circumstances surrounding his departure from the Cavaliers and if the comments he reportedly made would impact how he was received at WF and how those comments would be used by opposing coaches in negative recruiting.  May not be fair to Beilein but I think an AD has to at least consider that angle.

[ephul]

1 hour ago, IU4Ever said:

If I'm the Wake AD, I'd be a little concerned about the circumstances surrounding his departure from the Cavaliers and if the comments he reportedly made would impact how he was received at WF and how those comments would be used by opposing coaches in negative recruiting.  May not be fair to Beilein but I think an AD has to at least consider that angle.

I think the majority of people would side with Beilein and understand that it was just poor wording/misspeak. He's widely respected and loved by his former college players.

I think Beilein wouldn't skip a beat in the recruiting scene.