Racial tensions

[Brass Cannon]

1 minute ago, Reacher said:

Come on. Elected officials are not infallible. There was no evidence, nothing factual. Do you doubt the presence/ involvement of Antifa? @mrflynn03 posted a better source on the previous page. You don't have to believe the tweet I saw. Listen to the President, Attorney General, or any of a multitude of news outlets. 

So you aren’t against believing elected official just the ones you agree with. 
 

And no I never said I didn’t think Antifa was there.  But to believe White supremacist groups aren’t also involved shows an extremely unwillingness to observe facts you disagree with. 

[Seeking6]

5 minutes ago, Proud2BAHoosier said:

Just announced the Mn. medical examiner has said George Floyds death was murder. Does this bump the charge to murder 1?

I will defer to the actual attorneys on the board. I would normally ask my better half but anyone who has spent a fair amount of time with someone in the legal world knows that when you ask a question you get the customary it depends followed by 11 scenarios of why it would or wouldn't be applicable.

Here's my lay person reply. The pressure the DA's office will be under is enormous. They have to weight the risk of 12 people sitting in a box determining guilty or not guilty....and everyone comes in with their own thoughts on obviously a very controversial topic. I think it was 8-9 pages back where we discussed. The public will want Murder 1 and guilty. Prosecutors understand the risks of going to trial....which in a strange way puts the onus or pressure back on the public to decide.

Would you rather see this cop or cops go away for 15+ years....or walk because a white jury might see things differently. Big risk and enormous consequences. If I were the cop I'd want a jury all day long. 

[Reacher]

8 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

So you aren’t against believing elected official just the ones you agree with. 
 

And no I never said I didn’t think Antifa was there.  But to believe White supremacist groups aren’t also involved shows an extremely unwillingness to observe facts you disagree with. 

I have seen no evidence white supremacists are involved. Not saying they aren't. i have no idea. Please show me what proof you have. And bo I don't believe official that I agree with more than others. Never said that. One might have better access to information and a bit more influence. If he's wrong, we'll know about it in a nanosecond.

Whats your early guess as to % Antifa and % White Supremacist?

[Seeking6]

4 minutes ago, btownqb said:

There's still going to be a lot more of the officers past come out, then what we know now. 

(All the infractions he has are already a really bad start)

Past= text messages, conversations, likes/retweets on social media, etc. Are alllll going to be combed through millions of times. 

This is either going to be very bad for the officer or somewhat good. 

I have no clue. 

There's the rub though. If a judge decides the (I forget the exact term) probative value outweighs the relevance or whatever she or he could exclude any mention of this officers history. If that evidence doesn't come in you essentially come down to a video and the video can show many, many things....i.e. Rodney King, OJ,etc....and good defense attorneys can cast enough doubt to turn a few jurors.

[btownqb]

Just now, Seeking6 said:

There's the rub though. If a judge decides the (I forget the exact term) probative value outweighs the relevance or whatever she or he could exclude any mention of this officers history. If that evidence doesn't come in you essentially come down to a video and the video can show many, many things....i.e. Rodney King, OJ,etc....and good defense attorneys can cast enough doubt to turn a few jurors.

Gotcha. Makes sense, unfortunately. 

[bluegrassIU]

2 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

I will defer to the actual attorneys on the board. I would normally ask my better half but anyone who has spent a fair amount of time with someone in the legal world knows that when you ask a question you get the customary it depends followed by 11 scenarios of why it would or wouldn't be applicable.

Here's my lay person reply. The pressure the DA's office will be under is enormous. They have to weight the risk of 12 people sitting in a box determining guilty or not guilty....and everyone comes in with their own thoughts on obviously a very controversial topic. I think it was 8-9 pages back where we discussed. The public will want Murder 1 and guilty. Prosecutors understand the risks of going to trial....which in a strange way puts the onus or pressure back on the public to decide.

Would you rather see this cop or cops go away for 15+ years....or walk because a white jury might see things differently. Big risk and enormous consequences. If I were the cop I'd want a jury all day long. 

Just a guess...

 

If the families autopsy comes off as more/equally convincing, hard to imagine the murder charge not sticking.

If the defense can convince the original autopsy is more convincing, it may fall back to the manslaughter charge.

I am totally just thinking out loud here.

Good God, the weight of the world is on the prosecutor here. As bad as things are now, imagine if the verdict is not what is expected. Scary, really.

 

[Brass Cannon]

3 minutes ago, Reacher said:

I have seen no evidence white supremacists are involved. Not saying they aren't. i have no idea. Please show me what proof you have. And bo I don't believe official that I agree with more than others. Never said that. One might have better access to information and a bit more influence. If he's wrong, we'll know about it in a nanosecond.

Whats your early guess as to % Antifa and % White Supremacist?

You have seen no evidence of either.  Your basing the quality of the source on whether or not they agree with your preconceived notions. 

[mrflynn03]

14 minutes ago, btownqb said:

There's still going to be a lot more of the officers past come out, then what we know now. 

(All the infractions he has are already a really bad start)

Past= text messages, conversations, likes/retweets on social media, etc. Are alllll going to be combed through millions of times. 

This is either going to be very bad for the officer or somewhat good. 

I have no clue. 

Saw where he was involved in 3 shootings with 1 being fatal. That's gotta be above average. 

[Steubenhoosier]

2 minutes ago, bluegrassIU said:

Just a guess...

 

If the families autopsy comes off as more/equally convincing, hard to imagine the murder charge not sticking.

If the defense can convince the original autopsy is more convincing, it may fall back to the manslaughter charge.

I am totally just thinking out loud here.

Good God, the weight of the world is on the prosecutor here. As bad as things are now, imagine if the verdict is not what is expected. Scary, really.

 

The defense attorneys are gonna scream loud and clear that this guy is not going to get an unbiased jury... anywhere. 

Bench trial? 

[Reacher]

2 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

You have seen no evidence of either.  Your basing the quality of the source on whether or not they agree with your preconceived notions. 

Not at all. I have seen no evidence of white supremacists. You refused to provide any. Antifa is everywhere around this even admitting it themselves.  You also conveniently forgot to answer my question, so I'll ask again- Whats your early guess as to % Antifa and % White Supremacist?

[Brass Cannon]

5 minutes ago, Reacher said:

Not at all. I have seen no evidence of white supremacists. You refused to provide any. Antifa is everywhere around this even admitting it themselves.  You also conveniently forgot to answer my question, so I'll ask again- Whats your early guess as to % Antifa and % White Supremacist?

That’s a question deflecting. Post your evidence.  That you claim to have and no tweets aren’t evidence.  If Elected officials can’t provide evidence then you don’t have it. 

[Seeking6]

8 minutes ago, bluegrassIU said:

Just a guess...

 

If the families autopsy comes off as more/equally convincing, hard to imagine the murder charge not sticking.

If the defense can convince the original autopsy is more convincing, it may fall back to the manslaughter charge.

I am totally just thinking out loud here.

Good God, the weight of the world is on the prosecutor here. As bad as things are now, imagine if the verdict is not what is expected. Scary, really.

 

Yep. Having known a few prosecutors here in Indy over the years the conversations that are taking place in Minneapolis right now have to be 14-15 consequences of each and every action/decision deep. If we do this....what happens here. If we do that while doing this what happens,etc.....I don't envy that call one bit because to your point. This verdict will start this all up again if it goes against public demands. 

[bluegrassIU]

Man,

Let's be real. The evidence is called common sense that both sides have extremists making this a cluster-you know what. 

Both distracting us from the real issue. Our system is flawed. People are angry. We have major social issues to figure out.

But the extremists on both sides win when we debate which side has the bigger douchebag extremists.

Totally taking our eye off of what needs to happen. We talk more about the idiot people, on both sides, and stop talking about the good people on both sides that want to address the real issues.

 

The more we chase rabbits, the more we fall for their sick game.

 

[Brass Cannon]

Just now, bluegrassIU said:

Man,

Let's be real. The evidence is called common sense that both sides have extremists making this a cluster-you know what. 

Both distracting us from the real issue. Our system is flawed. People are angry. We have major social issues to figure out.

But the extremists on both sides win when we debate which side has the bigger douchebag extremists.

Totally taking our eye off of what needs to happen. We talk more about the idiot people, on both sides, and stop talking about the good people on both sides that want to address the real issues.

 

The more we chase rabbits, the more we fall for their sick game.

 

Not debate which side. I’m well aware that both sides are there. Just trying to get somebody to say the real reason they don’t think white supremacy groups are out there. 

[mrflynn03]

If one wants to do some light reading, Saul Alinskys Rules for Radicals will give some insight into what has been going on the last decade or so. 

[mrflynn03]

7 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

Not debate which side. I’m well aware that both sides are there. Just trying to get somebody to say the real reason they don’t think white supremacy groups are out there. 

To me it's more a matter which white supremacy group(s).  Who is providing funding. Dry up the flow of money to the extremists and this crap will settle down. 

[JaybobHoosier]

4 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

Not debate which side. I’m well aware that both sides are there. Just trying to get somebody to say the real reason they don’t think white supremacy groups are out there. 

My pastor on Sunday made some great comments with everything going on. It’s not about proving your point that you are right and everyone else is wrong who differs, but right now needs to be about sharing your opinion while also listening wholeheartedly to others to try and understand them.

I can be very opinionated, as a lot of us are as seen in this thread, but we also need to try and understand each other as well. Like I said some pages back, we need love and compassion in this world to make things better. I lose site of that at times, and have in this thread. 
 

Hope we can unite instead of fight with what is going on. Changes need to be made, but the right away. Both sides coming together to truly work things out. No band-aids for a temporary fix, but let’s get it done now! 

[Reacher]

17 minutes ago, Brass Cannon said:

That’s a question deflecting. Post your evidence.  That you claim to have and no tweets aren’t evidence.  

I'll be patient and let history be the judge rather than believe these officials who have already been proven to be wrong- https://www.foxnews.com/politics/st-paul-claim-arrest-out-of-state

"St. Paul Mayor Melvin Carter on Saturday walked back a prior claim that all those arrested in city riots a day earlier were from out of state, reportedly saying he was given inaccurate police data."

I've said mutiple times I have no idea who is responsible. What I have not seen is any evidence of white Supremacists that you keep bringing up. Apparently, you haven't either.

[milehiiu]

10 minutes ago, JaybobHoosier said:

My pastor on Sunday made some great comments with everything going on. It’s not about proving your point that you are right and everyone else is wrong who differs, but right now needs to be about sharing your opinion while also listening wholeheartedly to others to try and understand them.

I can be very opinionated, as a lot of us are as seen in this thread, but we also need to try and understand each other as well. Like I said some pages back, we need love and compassion in this world to make things better. I lose site of that at times, and have in this thread. 
 

Hope we can unite instead of fight with what is going on. Changes need to be made, but the right away. Both sides coming together to truly work things out. No band-aids for a temporary fix, but let’s get it done now! 

Justin. Are you attending church, physically ? Or viewing via Zoom ? As the mile family does.  Our pastor has said he is not comfortable, yet in having  members attend church.

Just curious. As I know some churches have opened up for Sunday services.

[5fouls]

28 minutes ago, bluegrassIU said:

both sides have extremists making this a cluster-you know what. 

No.  I don't.  A cluster what?  

[KoB2011]

1 hour ago, Reacher said:

Come on. Elected officials are not infallible. There was no evidence, nothing factual. Do you doubt the presence/ involvement of Antifa? @mrflynn03 posted a better source on the previous page. You don't have to believe the tweet I saw. Listen to the President, Attorney General, or any of a multitude of news outlets. 

Edited:

Come no. You know that can not stay posted. Help us out here.     -blue

[KoB2011]

Same.....

-blue

[mrflynn03]

Louisville man shot and killed at protest today. Protest keep taking more lives. 

Innocent bystander shot

[HoosierFaithful]

As a reminder, we'll be less forgiving to those breaking our rules in this thread.  Don't bring any nonsense in here, vbg.

[JaybobHoosier]

26 minutes ago, milehiiu said:

Justin. Are you attending church, physically ? Or viewing via Zoom ? As the mile family does.  Our pastor has said he is not comfortable, yet in having  members attend church.

Just curious. As I know some churches have opened up for Sunday services.

Hey Mile,

We have been doing drive in church in the parking lot. It’s been awesome to still be able to come together, but stay in the vehicles (or sit by them) to keep social distancing. Our church has everyone park every other spot to ensure these rules.

We do a livestream on FB too, so you can see live jamming on the bass  lol. Our audio quality has been pretty poor the last couple Sundays though......