New Logo on IU uniforms...

[milehiiu]

Black Panther Party and Civil Protest Display | Neal-Marshall Black Culture Center Library- Indiana University

[Muddy River]

1 hour ago, IUCrazy2 said:

Look up who uses that clenched fist symbol and you will start to get an idea.

Like this?

 

[IUCrazy2]

1 minute ago, Muddy River said:

Like this?

 

That makes me like it even less.

[dgambill]

3 hours ago, IUFLA said:

Look familiar, @IU Scott? 

Everyone knows what the symbol means. Everyone. If they don’t that just speaks to how sad our education system has become that they no longer teach this in school anymore. It’s been adopted and evolved for several other movements in recent history and all have been pretty radical but they all date back to this image above.

Everyone knows the BLM movement is a black fist. Heck your phone even turns your words to an emoji when you type it. Everyone also knows because they have admitted it from the start it is a Marxist organization although recently they have been trying to distance themselves by deleting pages from their website and changing their tone in public interviews. Doesn’t change what they are and what they believe in and what their goals are while taking advantage of the confusion and sensitivity during this emotional time. A simple patch that says end racism or equality would be perfectly acceptable but we all know what the fist represents and a has for so long. It isn’t appropriate imo but unfortunately it’s the world we live in today. I’ll leave it at that. Doesn’t surprise me. Just wish people would educate themselves about this stuff instead of just accepting things at face value. Sure black lives matter...but that doesn’t make the organization a good one but I doubt our kids have had anyone take the time to educate them on what they will be wearing and what it has meant over time.

[5 championships]

39 minutes ago, dgambill said:

Everyone knows what the symbol means. Everyone. If they don’t that just speaks to how sad our education system has become that they no longer teach this in school anymore. It’s been adopted and evolved for several other movements in recent history and all have been pretty radical but they all date back to this image above.

Everyone knows the BLM movement is a black fist. Heck your phone even turns your words to an emoji when you type it. Everyone also knows because they have admitted it from the start it is a Marxist organization although recently they have been trying to distance themselves by deleting pages from their website and changing their tone in public interviews. Doesn’t change what they are and what they believe in and what their goals are while taking advantage of the confusion and sensitivity during this emotional time. A simple patch that says end racism or equality would be perfectly acceptable but we all know what the fist represents and a has for so long. It isn’t appropriate imo but unfortunately it’s the world we live in today. I’ll leave it at that. Doesn’t surprise me. Just wish people would educate themselves about this stuff instead of just accepting things at face value. Sure black lives matter...but that doesn’t make the organization a good one but I doubt our kids have had anyone take the time to educate them on what they will be wearing and what it has meant over time.

Very good post! Shame on IU but I’m not surprised 

[Muddy River]

On a serious note, I definitely think politics should be kept out of sports.  I would however like to see sports introduced into politics, especially if it was kickboxing or MMA.  

[rico]

If the logo bothers you(it does me) then fire off some emails to your federal and state congressional representatives.

[rico]

9 hours ago, Muddy River said:

On a serious note, I definitely think politics should be kept out of sports.  I would however like to see sports introduced into politics, especially if it was kickboxing or MMA.  

Of course every match would be until death, right?

[mrflynn03]

What I would say has already been said but more politely.  If I was a player I would cut it off my uniform or play in a jockstrap. 

I'm pretty much down to watching the Food Network.  People need a break from this stuff.

[3Ballin]

21 minutes ago, rico said:

Of course every match would be until death, right?

So a real life version of this? 🤔

[NotIThatLives]

Chances are this logo is the concept of a couple of wealthy white people.  So caught up in their virtue signalling world, so arrogant that they are the educated, woke, elite, they think all should think and act like them.  

The symbol is not about unity.  Has the symbol been used as black power for generations?  Then literally put power, in black, at the top?  Baffling how woke and educated folks can screw up so massively.  

[mrflynn03]

2 hours ago, rico said:

If the logo bothers you(it does me) then fire off some emails to your federal and state congressional representatives.

Done. If I get time might even try calling later. 

[rico]

1 minute ago, mrflynn03 said:

Done. If I get time might even try calling later. 

Never underestimate the power of your "voice"...heck, those that are against could start a petition.  That always gets noticed.

[IUCrazy2]

15 minutes ago, rico said:

Never underestimate the power of your "voice"...heck, those that are against could start a petition.  That always gets noticed.

I think my biggest voice is my wallet.  From my past experience when it comes to the University, they don't care what I say because I do not donate enough for them to care.  That symbol was developed by the Cuban Center at the school and Mark has made his stance clear on all of that.  So the way I "voice" my displeasure is to just stop watching.

I have had an issue with the administration of IU for awhile.  I don't think the school is run as efficiently and competently as it could be.  This is just another example of that.  You want an equality message and wanted to tie in that Indiana University is an inclusive place, you have a logo that is fairly well known in the college basketball world that also is a symbol that most normal IU fans are going to accept as their own as well, available.  The interlocking IU is already part of the uniform.  This was so simple and they bungled it bad.

[13th&Jackson]

17 hours ago, IUCrazy2 said:

I know we don't want to be political on this forum, so I will try to be as a-political as you possibly can (and in my defense, I believe this is the school inserting politics into sports) 

So, someone could ask what the issue is with the individual items in the fist, but that symbol is very much a Communist symbol.  It has been adopted by BLM (the movement, not the concept) and there are things to disagree with politically with that group.

I really wish Indiana U. would not have waded into this in this manner.  I have reached the point where with sports, I am cutting them out when they get political, particularly with this kind of stuff.  There is a bunch wrapped up in the symbolism they chose that doesn't give off the peace and unity vibe to me that they slapped all over the hands.

Delete if this is too political, just not a fan of this.  To the point that I probably won't be watching this year now.

"The logo was imagined by the Mark Cuban Center for Sports Media and Technology staff in consultation with the Athletic Director's Council for Diversity and Inclusivity."

https://iuhoosiers.com/news/2020/10/19/diversity-equity-and-inclusion-iu-athletics-unveils-new-social-justice-logo-football-to-incorporate-logo-into-gameday-uniforms.aspx

 

[mrflynn03]

I dont have a problem with the message.  It's the imagery I dont like. 

Why not incorporate the message into the IU logo. 

[IUCrazy2]

12 minutes ago, 13th&Jackson said:

"The logo was imagined by the Mark Cuban Center for Sports Media and Technology staff in consultation with the Athletic Director's Council for Diversity and Inclusivity."

https://iuhoosiers.com/news/2020/10/19/diversity-equity-and-inclusion-iu-athletics-unveils-new-social-justice-logo-football-to-incorporate-logo-into-gameday-uniforms.aspx

 

Yes, I know it was the Cuban Center Staff if that is what you are getting at...I was saying that it was developed by a place with Cuban's name on it.  I would not want my name on that, Cuban has made it clear in his responses about NBA fans that he is cool with that kind of thing.  So a billionaire giving that the thumbs up is going to trump any old joe schmo calling in to complain.

The diversity and inclusion folks obviously have a pretty large blind spot on who they were trying to include in this message given the response on this thread.  Choosing a symbol that about 40% nationally given voting trends and probably a larger percentage of your fanbase, given it is Indiana we are talking about, is going to have a problem with is stupid.  

[IUCrazy2]

Also...just a question but what path are the topics in the forums listed going to take?

• Annual, mandatory, in-person racial inclusivity training for all staff and students;
• Election Day as a mandatory day off for students for all athletically-related activities;
• Major new Excellence Academy programs on civics, citizenship, and voter education;
• Establishment of the "Indiana University Athletics Anti-Hate and Anti-Racism Coalition;
• Instituting staff-wide and student-wide conversations at least once every semester on issues related to race.

 Is it going to be Critical Race Theory being forced on all of our athletes or are they going to get the more traditional "treat others based on content of character and not color of skin" type of seminars.  Again, you start touching on some pretty politically touchy subjects on this stuff, like the 1619 Project, White Fragility, etc., etc.  And there are a bunch of people who are not cool with the direction of those discussions because they are not conversations, they are lectures based on dubious scholarship.

[13th&Jackson]

47 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

Yes, I know it was the Cuban Center Staff if that is what you are getting at...I was saying that it was developed by a place with Cuban's name on it.  I would not want my name on that, Cuban has made it clear in his responses about NBA fans that he is cool with that kind of thing.  So a billionaire giving that the thumbs up is going to trump any old joe schmo calling in to complain.

The diversity and inclusion folks obviously have a pretty large blind spot on who they were trying to include in this message given the response on this thread.  Choosing a symbol that about 40% nationally given voting trends and probably a larger percentage of your fanbase, given it is Indiana we are talking about, is going to have a problem with is stupid.  

I think our posts were sent at the same time. I was just adding info that others on the Board may not know.

[tdhoosier]

16 hours ago, IUFLA said:

Look familiar, @IU Scott? 

I think it's fair to say that the clenched fist has been used for many causes throughout history. It was used as symbol in the French Revolution and it was used as an anti-fascist symbol in the Spanish revolution to contrast the open palmed salute used by the nationalists. Nelson Mandela raised his fist after being released from prison. It was iconically raised on the gold medal stand in the olympics.  Comparing it directly and only to communism isn't exactly fair. The fist is used for a variety of causes and its symbolism to a cause varies. If you ask BLM what the fist means to them, I'm pretty sure they're not going to say "Communist Russia". In fact, they spelled out what it means to them in that logo: peace, love, empathy, compassion, etc. 

[IUCrazy2]

59 minutes ago, tdhoosier said:

I think it's fair to say that the clenched fist has been used for many causes throughout history. It was used as symbol in the French Revolution and it was used as an anti-fascist symbol in the Spanish revolution to contrast the open palmed salute used by the nationalists. Nelson Mandela raised his fist after being released from prison. It was iconically raised on the gold medal stand in the olympics.  Comparing it directly and only to communism isn't exactly fair. The fist is used for a variety of causes and its symbolism to a cause varies. If you ask BLM what the fist means to them, I'm pretty sure they're not going to say "Communist Russia". In fact, they spelled out what it means to them in that logo: peace, love, empathy, compassion, etc. 

It doesn't matter what the symbol means to them.  It matters what it means to others.  Schools in the SEC would tell you that the confederate battle flag just means "southern" to them and that it was used by music groups and many others to denote their "pride in the south".  To many others it is a symbol of slavery and racism.  If you were trying to promote unity you don't pick a symbol that has controversial meanings depending on the audience.  BLM (the organization) are affirmed Marxists.  Not to get into politics even more, but they scrubbed their website to remove that controversial stuff as soon as they started getting called on it.  Antifascists in the U.S. today do not exactly give everyone the warm and fuzzies because, to many of us, those who claim that mantle are anything but...and you will find that same symbol in areas where they have burned down cities and murdered people over the past few months.

To me it is as simple as this:  the University stupidly picked a controversial symbol that is going to have a different meaning to different people.  It can go from supporting a political movement that many see as terrible, to a symbol that those who riot, burn, and murder individuals have marched behind, the idea that any race should be screaming about its power being a bad thing, etc.  Some view it positively, many of us don't.  They have a symbol that the entire IU community views positively.  Instead of using that they picked something that they knew was going to be like a punch in the face to many in the fanbase.  And then when you complain about it, the University and its supporters ask "well what is wrong with the words on there..."  Nothing.  So what if we stuck the words on a cross?  We good there?  If not, why?  If you could not disagree with the words, how about a swastika?  I mean that has a different meaning for Hindus so we all good there?  And the answer to that is going to be a no because symbols carry meaning.

[NotIThatLives]

59 minutes ago, tdhoosier said:

I think it's fair to say that the clenched fist has been used for many causes throughout history. It was used as symbol in the French Revolution and it was used as an anti-fascist symbol in the Spanish revolution to contrast the open palmed salute used by the nationalists. Nelson Mandela raised his fist after being released from prison. It was iconically raised on the gold medal stand in the olympics.  Comparing it directly and only to communism isn't exactly fair. The fist is used for a variety of causes and its symbolism to a cause varies. If you ask BLM what the fist means to them, I'm pretty sure they're not going to say "Communist Russia". In fact, they spelled out what it means to them in that logo: peace, love, empathy, compassion, etc. 

You left out the black power part.  Everyone I know is for equality.  Literally don't know one person who isn't.  Can you imagine a white power symbol or a Mexican power symbol?  No.  Me either.  Why does this continually get a pass?  It's not equality, at all.  

[cybergates]

Just now, NotIThatLives said:

You left out the black power part.  Everyone I know is for equality.  Literally don't know one person who isn't.  Can you imagine a white power symbol or a Mexican power symbol?  No.  Me either.  Why does this continually get a pass?  It's not equality, at all.  

I don't get that either. 

Also, you can be for equality just don't say All Lives Matter it may get you fired or stabbed.

https://nypost.com/2020/06/04/nba-voice-grant-napear-was-fired-for-stating-all-lives-matter-truth/

https://www.newsweek.com/all-lives-matter-claira-janover-tiktok-deloitte-1514930

 

[tdhoosier]

33 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

It doesn't matter what the symbol means to them.  It matters what it means to others.  Schools in the SEC would tell you that the confederate battle flag just means "southern" to them and that it was used by music groups and many others to denote their "pride in the south".  To many others it is a symbol of slavery and racism.  If you were trying to promote unity you don't pick a symbol that has controversial meanings depending on the audience.  BLM (the organization) are affirmed Marxists.  Not to get into politics even more, but they scrubbed their website to remove that controversial stuff as soon as they started getting called on it.  Antifascists in the U.S. today do not exactly give everyone the warm and fuzzies because, to many of us, those who claim that mantle are anything but...and you will find that same symbol in areas where they have burned down cities and murdered people over the past few months.

To me it is as simple as this:  the University stupidly picked a controversial symbol that is going to have a different meaning to different people.  It can go from supporting a political movement that many see as terrible, to a symbol that those who riot, burn, and murder individuals have marched behind, the idea that any race should be screaming about its power being a bad thing, etc.  Some view it positively, many of us don't.  They have a symbol that the entire IU community views positively.  Instead of using that they picked something that they knew was going to be like a punch in the face to many in the fanbase.  And then when you complain about it, the University and its supporters ask "well what is wrong with the words on there..."  Nothing.  So what if we stuck the words on a cross?  We good there?  If not, why?  If you could not disagree with the words, how about a swastika?  I mean that has a different meaning for Hindus so we all good there?  And the answer to that is going to be a no because symbols carry meaning.

You basically just said it doesn't matter what it means to them; it matters what it means to others. Others meaning yourself?  Because I don't see it that way. It makes my point that some see hatred in that symbol and others see a symbol for fighting oppression. Some will see a Communist fist....some will see Nelson Mandela's fist. I think the intention behind the use of the logo matters. IU made their intentions blatantly clear with text. I understand why you don't agree with the logo, but I disagree with your opinion....and that's okay. 

41 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said:

You left out the black power part.  Everyone I know is for equality.  Literally don't know one person who isn't.  Can you imagine a white power symbol or a Mexican power symbol?  No.  Me either.  Why does this continually get a pass?  It's not equality, at all.  

I didn't intentionally leave that out. White power and black power mean completely different things to me. White power refers to whites being the dominant race. Black power is a fight for equality. When you hear black power you actually think that their message is black people should be the dominant race? IMO, it seems like you are getting swept up in verbiage and not meaning. 

I'll stop here but the strongest word in that logo is "empathy." I'm sure that logo has different meanings to, say, Race Thompson then it does to me or you. My overall point is understanding different perspectives and realities is important. And I fully admit that it goes both ways. 

[jv1972iu]

Hey guys, Trey is announcing October 30!!   😊