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2021 NET Rankings

ChiHoosier

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NCHoosier32

NCHoosier32

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, ChiHoosier said:

IU starts the season at 51 in the NET Rankings. 

Other Big 10 teams: 4 - Illinois, 6 - Michigan, 7 - Iowa, 11 - Wisconsin, 17 - Rutgers, 28 - Ohio St, 32 - Maryland, 42 - Penn State, 43 - Minnesota, 47 - Purdue, 50 - NW, 119 - Michigan St, 186 - Nebraska

Well, I was planning on being sarcastically over the top positive about everything so the guys who attack me would see how ridiculous it is, but I can't do it.  So... I don't really think this is particularly negative, but realistic:  We fall 12th in the conference right now and that's with NW and MSU behind us, but of course MD, PSU, and Purdue in front.  Those teams are all obviously debatable.  Thing is, I'm not saying we are a bad team.  I'm saying it is likely that we'll finish around 9th or 10th and possibly a losing overall record due to how good the conference is and that we got a particularly tough conference schedule.  No one other than IU fans would predict that we'd finish .500 in the conference at this point.  This is not me saying fire the coach or the sky is falling or we're terrible.  It just is what it is.  I'll be watching and cheering and hoping I am very pleasantly surprised.  

Edit:  didn't realize the original post was so old and it was stats from the start of the season.  Sorry, but my opinion doesn't change.  

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Indykev

Indykev

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, NCHoosier32 said:

Well, I was planning on being sarcastically over the top positive about everything so the guys who attack me would see how ridiculous it is, but I can't do it.  So... I don't really think this is particularly negative, but realistic:  We fall 12th in the conference right now and that's with NW and MSU behind us, but of course MD, PSU, and Purdue in front.  Those teams are all obviously debatable.  Thing is, I'm not saying we are a bad team.  I'm saying it is likely that we'll finish around 9th or 10th and possibly a losing overall record due to how good the conference is and that we got a particularly tough conference schedule.  No one other than IU fans would predict that we'd finish .500 in the conference at this point.  This is not me saying fire the coach or the sky is falling or we're terrible.  It just is what it is.  I'll be watching and cheering and hoping I am very pleasantly surprised.  

Edit:  didn't realize the original post was so old and it was stats from the start of the season.  Sorry, but my opinion doesn't change.  

An hour ago is old? lol

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rico

rico

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, NCHoosier32 said:

Well, I was planning on being sarcastically over the top positive about everything so the guys who attack me would see how ridiculous it is, but I can't do it.  So... I don't really think this is particularly negative, but realistic:  We fall 12th in the conference right now and that's with NW and MSU behind us, but of course MD, PSU, and Purdue in front.  Those teams are all obviously debatable.  Thing is, I'm not saying we are a bad team.  I'm saying it is likely that we'll finish around 9th or 10th and possibly a losing overall record due to how good the conference is and that we got a particularly tough conference schedule.  No one other than IU fans would predict that we'd finish .500 in the conference at this point.  This is not me saying fire the coach or the sky is falling or we're terrible.  It just is what it is.  I'll be watching and cheering and hoping I am very pleasantly surprised.  

You will survive the attacks...LOL, unless type hurts you?  Moving forward we just need to finish around .500 in conference.  Hell, who knows....12-8 might win it.

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Hoosierhoopster

Hoosierhoopster

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It's NET rankings, they matter, but you also have to look at some pretty obvious calculation metrics as of now and going forward.

Maryland, for example, same record 6-4, but they have 1 road W (1-2) to IU's 0 (0-2), and are 1-4 in Quad 1 and 5-0 in Quad 3, to IU's 0-3 in Quad 1 and 1-0 in Quad 3.

Also IU has had several Quad 2 games, going 3-1, whereas MD has 0 Quad 2 games, and 2 Quad 4 games (2-0) whereas MD has 0 Quad 4 games. 

So the currently significant ranking differential is purely who they've beaten so far in Quad levels vs. who we have, and we had that 1 basket OT loss to FSU -- that alone, if a W, would've vaulted IU's "NET" ranking up significantly. Using the current ranking to consider IU bad etc. is just not a good way to assess.

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rico

rico

Posted
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1 minute ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

It's NET rankings, they matter, but you also have to look at some pretty obvious calculation metrics as of now and going forward.

Maryland, for example, same record 6-4, but they have 1 road W (1-2) to IU's 0 (0-2), and are 1-4 in Quad 1 and 5-0 in Quad 3, to IU's 0-3 in Quad 1 and 1-0 in Quad 3.

Also IU has had several Quad 2 games, going 3-1, whereas MD has 0 Quad 2 games, and 2 Quad 4 games (2-0) whereas MD has 0 Quad 4 games. 

So the currently significant ranking differential is purely who they've beaten so far in Quad levels vs. who we have, and we had that 1 basket OT loss to FSU -- that alone, if a W, would've vaulted IU's "NET" ranking up significantly. Using the current ranking to consider IU bad etc. is just not a good way to assess.

Now explain all that to Scott...in layman's terms

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5fouls

5fouls

Posted
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12 minutes ago, rico said:

It is all about quads....I got one, a nice running Honda...wish it had 4 wheel drive.

Well, Penn State has 1 Quad 1 win.  Northwestern has 2 Quad 1 wins and a better overall record.  Yet, PSU is ranked higher.

If I recall correctly, the NET sucked really bad last year, and it appears it's going to suck again this year.

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5fouls

5fouls

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said:

It's NET rankings, they matter, but you also have to look at some pretty obvious calculation metrics as of now and going forward.

Maryland, for example, same record 6-4, but they have 1 road W (1-2) to IU's 0 (0-2), and are 1-4 in Quad 1 and 5-0 in Quad 3, to IU's 0-3 in Quad 1 and 1-0 in Quad 3.

Also IU has had several Quad 2 games, going 3-1, whereas MD has 0 Quad 2 games, and 2 Quad 4 games (2-0) whereas MD has 0 Quad 4 games. 

So the currently significant ranking differential is purely who they've beaten so far in Quad levels vs. who we have, and we had that 1 basket OT loss to FSU -- that alone, if a W, would've vaulted IU's "NET" ranking up significantly. Using the current ranking to consider IU bad etc. is just not a good way to assess.

Explain PSU and Northwestern.  

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rico

rico

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1 minute ago, 5fouls said:

Well, Penn State has 1 Quad 1 win.  Northwestern has 2 Quad 1 wins and a better overall record.  Yet, PSU is ranked higher.

If I recall correctly, the NET sucked really bad last year, and it appears it's going to suck again this year.

I don't really know.  All I know is the Selection Committee values it.  We just need W's and we will be fine.

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5fouls

5fouls

Posted
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4 minutes ago, rico said:

I don't really know.  All I know is the Selection Committee values it.  We just need W's and we will be fine.

If I am a committee member, I immediately see this comparison, and I have to throw out the formula as having any validity whatsoever.  Literally, the only metric that Penn State has over NW is a Quad 2 record of 1-1 compared to NW's of 0-1.  Every other metric, NW has the advantage.  Yet,  somehow Penn State is ranked ahead.  There is a HUGE flaw in the calculation.  Results like this just make no sense.    

42   Penn St. Big Ten 3-4 1-2 0-0 2-2 1-3 1-1 0-0 1-0
50   NW         Big Ten 5-3 1-2 0-0 4-1 2-2 0-1 1-0 2-0

 

 

 

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IowaHoosierFan

IowaHoosierFan

Posted
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5 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

If I am a committee member, I immediately see this comparison, and I have to throw out the formula as having any validity whatsoever.  Literally, the only metric that Penn State has over NW is a Quad 2 record of 1-1 compared to NW's of 0-1.  Every other metric, NW has the advantage.  Yet,  somehow Penn State is ranked ahead.  There is a HUGE flaw in the calculation.  Results like this just make no sense.    

42   Penn St. Big Ten 3-4 1-2 0-0 2-2 1-3 1-1 0-0 1-0
50   NW         Big Ten 5-3 1-2 0-0 4-1 2-2 0-1 1-0 2-0

 

 

 

Does it take into who they beat in each Quad?

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5fouls

5fouls

Posted
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13 minutes ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

Does it take into who they beat in each Quad?

Penn State has beaten

VCU and VMI at home

Virginia Tech on the road

 

Northwestern has beaten

Arkansas Pine Bluff, Chicago, Michigan State, and Ohio State at home

Indiana on the road

 

Michigan State, who was ranked 4th at the time NW beat them, is considered a Quad 3 win.  Let that sink in to appreciate how messed up this is.

I'm still not seeing the advantage.  It's not like beating Virginia Tech on the road is comparable to beating Gonzaga.  V Tech is ranked 34th in the NET.  Better than beating IU, but not significantly better.  So, basically, the formula is saying that beating VCU and VMI is as good as, or maybe even better than beating OSU and MSU.

 

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go_iu_bb

go_iu_bb

Posted
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43 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

Explain PSU and Northwestern.  

It's more complicated than just Quad wins and losses. IIRC, they also factor in things like offensive efficiency, defensive efficiency, and point differential matters up to a point (I think 10 win/loss is max). Road vs home vs neutral are all weighted differently. I think there are more factors but I can't recall what they are. I also don't think the ranking calculation is as simplistic as each win/loss within a specific quad count exactly the same. 

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BruceDouglas

BruceDouglas

Posted
Posted
44 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

Well, Penn State has 1 Quad 1 win.  Northwestern has 2 Quad 1 wins and a better overall record.  Yet, PSU is ranked higher.

If I recall correctly, the NET sucked really bad last year, and it appears it's going to suck again this year.

You have the relationship backwards. The rankings determine the quadrants (as well as home v road), not the other way around. Looking at just a team's Q1 wins doesn't really tell you much about their ranking.

It's true in general the higher ranked teams will have more Q1/Q2 wins, but it's not a direct relationship.

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5fouls

5fouls

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, BruceDouglas said:

You have the relationship backwards. The rankings determine the quadrants (as well as home v road), not the other way around. Looking at just a team's Q1 wins doesn't really tell you much about their ranking.

It's true in general the higher ranked teams will have more Q1/Q2 wins, but it's not a direct relationship.

That make sense, but there still is no way anyone can look at Penn State's resume and say it's better than Northwestern's.  

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BruceDouglas

BruceDouglas

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

That make sense, but there still is no way anyone can look at Penn State's resume and say it's better than Northwestern's.  

Sure, and it's the resumes that are used, not just the rankings.

I will point out though...PSU's Q2 win is over VCU who is ranked #31. If VCU was #30 instead, that's a Q1 win and suddenly PSU's resume looks a bit better? :)

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