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It’s time... Fire Archie Miller


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10 minutes ago, BobSaccamanno said:

I’d say more like far less than 1%. I have a group of friends who love ball.  They watch the games, go to the occasional game etc.  But they don’t follow recruiting beyond maybe a Romeo sighting from Twitter where the masses see everything.  They’ve heard so many times so and so is a stud coming in and then it turns out somebody isn’t as good as hyped. So they reserve judgment on recruits and really only care about the team as it is constituted when they play games.  Bottom line, they won’t go to a message board and they see that as not the best use of their time.  

But to be clear, they will still watch the games and do care.  Anecdotally, my crew has been completely out on Archie and has been since about year two.  “He doesn’t have it.”  Verbatim. 

These guys don’t over complicate the analysis.  They see the final product and they know what they see and it’s not good enough.  They understand the game.  I argued that they were way too premature.  

But the funny thing is that the more straightforward fan like that might see the truth faster.  Because they don’t pay attention to how the sausage is made.  They don’t know anything about summer workouts, gold shirts in practice etc.  They don’t have any idea who Cliff Marshall is and they don’t care.  They are living their lives.  It’s anecdotal but my cohort has long been out on Archie.  

I can vouch for this experience. The friends and family I have aren't the passionate fans on message board, but that means they're not diving deep into every nuance of the situation. They aren't crafting arguments for why this might turn around. They see that we haven't made the tournament and decide Archie has to go. It's a results driven business, and if you're having to give explanations for why results aren't there, you're already losing the argument.

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1 minute ago, BobSaccamanno said:

I can understand being upset with Archie’s offense.  I don’t think it’s scheme for the most part.  He just has lackluster guards other than Franklin.  We can move the ball and get shots.  Sometimes they get way too far into the shot clock.  I’d like to see more picks.  But I wouldn’t say it’s the philosophy.  We don’t have shot makers.  

I hate the pace and the few times we run the ball we can score.  Like I said if we could call a timeout every possession and have out of bounds under our basket we would be a great offensive teams.  What he doesn't do is allow the players or can't get them to play with pace the whole game.  Either way it is on him that they can' run the offense with a good pace the whole game.  To many possessions start with around 12 seconds of the weave and they try to get an open look.

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5 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

I hate the pace and the few times we run the ball we can score.  Like I said if we could call a timeout every possession and have out of bounds under our basket we would be a great offensive teams.  What he doesn't do is allow the players or can't get them to play with pace the whole game.  Either way it is on him that they can' run the offense with a good pace the whole game.  To many possessions start with around 12 seconds of the weave and they try to get an open look.

I think it is a boring style for trying to recruit guards too.

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27 minutes ago, Maedhros said:

I can vouch for this experience. The friends and family I have aren't the passionate fans on message board, but that means they're not diving deep into every nuance of the situation. They aren't crafting arguments for why this might turn around. They see that we haven't made the tournament and decide Archie has to go. It's a results driven business, and if you're having to give explanations for why results aren't there, you're already losing the argument.

Exactly this.  I think fans on message boards might be the only ones defending Archie at this point.

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1 minute ago, FW_Hoosier said:

Exactly this.  I think fans on message boards might be the only ones defending Archie at this point.

I know my brother who is the one that got me into IU basketball and had great passion for IU.  He is 8 years older than me but we would watch every game together and then go out and play basketball. He has coached at the junior high level and travel ball and he has lost a lot of his interest in IU basketball.  He says that watching Archie's team is so hard to watch and the team is boring to watch.  I don't think he goes to message boards at all.  Unlike me he is more into the Pacers now and him and his wife has a mini season tickets for them.  His company also has suits at Bankers life and had a chance to go with him once and it was great.

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46 minutes ago, Maedhros said:

I can vouch for this experience. The friends and family I have aren't the passionate fans on message board, but that means they're not diving deep into every nuance of the situation. They aren't crafting arguments for why this might turn around. They see that we haven't made the tournament and decide Archie has to go. It's a results driven business, and if you're having to give explanations for why results aren't there, you're already losing the argument.

Literally to a man and woman I know who wear IU gear all the time, consider themselves die hard (just aren’t message board junkies) are done with Archie. BUT not one is pissed at him or anything which shows he’s like able with our fanbase. These same fans were super pissed about Crean but even a couple of them were kinda ok with keeping Crean. But not one of the 10-12 I know think this will turn around. 
I can’t blame them. Looking into next year I have zero reason to believe that the “ground work” that has been laid with a slower and more “deliberate” building of a program that “gets old and stays old” is on the verge of delivering consistent results our base expects at a BARE minimum.

 

More so, I see a few of us who really do like Archie and think he’s no basketball dummy, scraping the bottom of the barrel coming up with arguments like, “Well, if player X comes back, and players A,B and C improve in these areas (which can happen), and we get a grad transfer Q, and our team FT % improves modestly, then we’d only need a few more teams to lose a key player here and there and us play a little more consistently and we’d probably finish 5th or 6th next year. AND THEN we’d see that we’d be in the “top half” of the conference and that might project the next couple years to be a little better than that. So we could be looking at a future that might happen someday if we just wait.”

what in the #%$& have we come to as IU basketball???

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43 minutes ago, BADGERVOL said:

More so, I see a few of us who really do like Archie and think he’s no basketball dummy, scraping the bottom of the barrel coming up with arguments like, “Well, if player X comes back, and players A,B and C improve in these areas (which can happen), and we get a grad transfer Q, and our team FT % improves modestly, then we’d only need a few more teams to lose a key player here and there and us play a little more consistently and we’d probably finish 5th or 6th next year. AND THEN we’d see that we’d be in the “top half” of the conference and that might project the next couple years to be a little better than that. So we could be looking at a future that might happen someday if we just wait.”

what in the #%$& have we come to as IU basketball???

And this sums up perfectly how the expectations have changed over the last four seasons.  Crean got fired because he was only competing for conference championships every couple of years.  Now we’d be thrilled if we were just in the top half of the conference again.

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2 minutes ago, FW_Hoosier said:

And this sums up perfectly how the expectations have changed over the last four seasons.  Crean got fired because he was only competing for conference championships every couple of years.  Now we’d be thrilled if we were just in the top half of the conference again.

Yes Yes Yes! I don’t want Crean back but we definitely down graded.  Actually coaching wise we’ve down graded since Sampson.  Not a the trend you want to see.

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1 hour ago, Maedhros said:

I can vouch for this experience. The friends and family I have aren't the passionate fans on message board, but that means they're not diving deep into every nuance of the situation. They aren't crafting arguments for why this might turn around. They see that we haven't made the tournament and decide Archie has to go. It's a results driven business, and if you're having to give explanations for why results aren't there, you're already losing the argument.

Would love to live in this simplistic of a world. There are about 850 reasons why we've lost or won. Just to wrap it up by saying it's a results business? I'm actually jealous. Wish it was that easy. 

Reminder. Our PG for the last few years is playing pretty well at University of Colorado. Maybe ask the IU Admin why they wouldn't allow Wright to transfer with Coach Miller. 

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1 minute ago, Leathernecks said:

I wonder if there are any "non-IU" IU guys out there who could be an option.  Someone like Tom Allen who grew up cheering for IU, but didn't actually go to IU.  I know that would probably be a long shot and really tough to know, just wonder if there could be an "IU guy" out there that people are missing.

Matt Painter? 

 

 

 

 

😂😂😂

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7 minutes ago, Leathernecks said:

I wonder if there are any "non-IU" IU guys out there who could be an option.  Someone like Tom Allen who grew up cheering for IU, but didn't actually go to IU.  I know that would probably be a long shot and really tough to know, just wonder if there could be an "IU guy" out there that people are missing.

Brad Stevens LOL!

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6 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

Would love to live in this simplistic of a world. There are about 850 reasons why we've lost or won. Just to wrap it up by saying it's a results business? I'm actually jealous. Wish it was that easy. 

Reminder. Our PG for the last few years is playing pretty well at University of Colorado. Maybe ask the IU Admin why they wouldn't allow Wright to transfer with Coach Miller. 

I try to just watch it as a fan and not look at every little detail like a coach.  I think to many of us thinks of ourselves as coaches and have to  look at every little thing in the game.  If we would just watch it for entertainment and getting away from everything in your life then we would be a little happier.

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7 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

I try to just watch it as a fan and not look at every little detail like a coach.  I think to many of us thinks of ourselves as coaches and have to  look at every little thing in the game.  If we would just watch it for entertainment and getting away from everything in your life then we would be a little happier.

You have spent your day on the internet complaint and trying to convince people to write an email to Dolson to get Archie fired. Have you considered taking your own advice?

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3 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

Would love to live in this simplistic of a world. There are about 850 reasons why we've lost or won. Just to wrap it up by saying it's a results business? I'm actually jealous. Wish it was that easy. 

Reminder. Our PG for the last few years is playing pretty well at University of Colorado. Maybe ask the IU Admin why they wouldn't allow Wright to transfer with Coach Miller. 

McKinley Wright started his career four years ago. I've seen no evidence that Archie was prohibited from bringing Wright with him, only conjecture from those fans seeking external factors to explain why Archie hasn't met expectations. But even granting the premise, so what? In the time that Wright has become a senior, Archie is still without a reliable point guard. Sucks that we were prevented from bringing in a recruit that would go on to become a star, if that's indeed what happened. Now what about every miss that's happened since? Regardless of the reason why Wright didn't come to Indiana, Archie has had the opportunity and the responsibility to rectify the situation. A miss four years ago, even one he couldn't control, is no longer an extenuating factor.

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