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It’s time... Fire Archie Miller


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47 minutes ago, dbmhoosier said:

He gone.

Yeah, I seriously don't see how you can defend that.  Other than Iowa, I don't think he has performed really well against the top of the conference the past few years.  

That's why people digging in to say "give him another year" now kind of have me scratching my head.  Waiting until next year when guys get older....it just has not been working.  The only reason to keep him in my mind is the buyout.  

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8 minutes ago, Shapopojoe said:

Because if you’re not ÷_/÷÷ me right now, thanks for the prime example of why the program is now in the tubes....accepting mediocrity....rest of the big ten is doing well so it’s ok if we are dookie? Ugh....pathetic

Obviously he was being funny.  Lol

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Rumor has it the funds have been raised to move on. We’ll see what happens. If it’s true that Chris Mack reached out to IU then that tells me that the IU job is still appealing to high level coaches even if fans at times don’t think so. Yes, Louisville’s issues may be part of the reason he wants out but I still find it interesting. I’m curious to see what other names pop up over the coming days. There’s to much smoke about IU reaching out to coaches and coaches reaching out to IU. Archie will be gone.

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So doing some dot connecting of rumors between some of the people who tend to have good info on this board and that chris007 who seems to have good info on btownbanners here is the picture I am gathering:

1.  The money is available for the buyout and has been available since Friday.

2.  There is a meeting this weekend (today?) with the BoT and members of the athletic department will probably be in attendance.

3.  The school is either reaching out to gauge interest (Enfield?) or has had representatives for coaches reaching out to them (Mack?)

So, just running on the idea that where there is smoke, there is fire, I think that the school might be leaning heavily towards a reboot (again) of the basketball team.

That being said, if this is true, I want the next guy to have some more latitude on handling the program.  I loved the Knight years.  Some of my first memories of holding a basketball were pretending to be Steve Alford and Keith Smart playing opponents in my head to win an NCAA championship.  I had the lunchroom debates with the sudden surge of Michigan fans around the middle school lunch table when Cheaney and Co. were not the "cool" team, but they were the winning team.  I marched around campus my senior year of college pissed off that they fired Knight.  All that being said, we need to finally bridge this gap.  Our history is AWESOME.  Here is the deal though, I am 42.  I was in 2nd grade when we last won an NCAA title.  I am the top end of the age range of an IU student who actually got to watch a Knight coached team as an IU student.  We need to figure out what is important to carry forward as Indiana tradition and we need to give some latitude to this next coach and students to build off of what we have left and build some things of their own.

The things that matter to me are the approach to the game.  I want to feel like the team cares at least as much as I used to.  I want kids who represent the school well.  (I think Miller's kids have done that.)  I want to honor the guys that have been here before.  I want to win.

Things that should be up for debate to me are where students sit at the game.  Names on jerseys.  The music selections at the games.  Allowing for alternate uniforms.  Allowing names on the back of the jerseys.  Pushing NLI to make sure we are getting our fair share of players.  Making sure the AD compliance department is working for our teams and not against.  I think we need to figure out what we do that is not considered "cool" or is seen as old fashioned and make some moves to update those areas.  Our whole aesthetic screams that we are stuck in a timewarp... right down to the cheerleaders outfits.

The next hire needs to be a starting point to really moving forward from Knight.  I don't feel we have been able to do that.  With his appearance back in the Hall last year, I feel we have the "blessing" back on the program.  I think a conversation needs to be had about what INDIANA means.  I do not think anyone has had a clear grasp of that since 2000.

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Just now, Shapopojoe said:

Enfield? Oh vey....shooting for the stars again...oof...lateral move...not impressed 

I wasn't saying I want him, just that he represents a name we heard rumors of being talked to.  Bring him up more to say that he represents that IU may be reaching out to coaches and Mack would represent that coaches may be reaching out to us.

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6 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

So doing some dot connecting of rumors between some of the people who tend to have good info on this board and that chris007 who seems to have good info on btownbanners here is the picture I am gathering:

1.  The money is available for the buyout and has been available since Friday.

2.  There is a meeting this weekend (today?) with the BoT and members of the athletic department will probably be in attendance.

3.  The school is either reaching out to gauge interest (Enfield?) or has had representatives for coaches reaching out to them (Mack?)

So, just running on the idea that where there is smoke, there is fire, I think that the school might be leaning heavily towards a reboot (again) of the basketball team.

That being said, if this is true, I want the next guy to have some more latitude on handling the program.  I loved the Knight years.  Some of my first memories of holding a basketball were pretending to be Steve Alford and Keith Smart playing opponents in my head to win an NCAA championship.  I had the lunchroom debates with the sudden surge of Michigan fans around the middle school lunch table when Cheaney and Co. were not the "cool" team, but they were the winning team.  I marched around campus my senior year of college pissed off that they fired Knight.  All that being said, we need to finally bridge this gap.  Our history is AWESOME.  Here is the deal though, I am 42.  I was in 2nd grade when we last won an NCAA title.  I am the top end of the age range of an IU student who actually got to watch a Knight coached team as an IU student.  We need to figure out what is important to carry forward as Indiana tradition and we need to give some latitude to this next coach and students to build off of what we have left and build some things of their own.

The things that matter to me are the approach to the game.  I want to feel like the team cares at least as much as I used to.  I want kids who represent the school well.  (I think Miller's kids have done that.)  I want to honor the guys that have been here before.  I want to win.

Things that should be up for debate to me are where students sit at the game.  Names on jerseys.  The music selections at the games.  Allowing for alternate uniforms.  Allowing names on the back of the jerseys.  Pushing NLI to make sure we are getting our fair share of players.  Making sure the AD compliance department is working for our teams and not against.  I think we need to figure out what we do that is not considered "cool" or is seen as old fashioned and make some moves to update those areas.  Our whole aesthetic screams that we are stuck in a timewarp... right down to the cheerleaders outfits.

The next hire needs to be a starting point to really moving forward from Knight.  I don't feel we have been able to do that.  With his appearance back in the Hall last year, I feel we have the "blessing" back on the program.  I think a conversation needs to be had about what INDIANA means.  I do not think anyone has had a clear grasp of that since 2000.

I took a look over on BTown Banners yesterday and also saw stuff about Enfield there and some seemed to like the idea. That one is puzzling to me. In 6 years at USC he has only a 58.5% winning percentage overall and is 47.6% in that weak conference. Is there something I'm missing about him that would make him a desirable hire?  Seems like he would be a downgrade from Miller or, at best, just as bad.

Chris Mack would be an upgrade for sure. I'm not convinced he would be the solution either, though. He's been good but not great so far at Louisville. A positive for him is that their trouble doesn't seem to hurt him much.

I think I'll probably be disappointed in the hire once again.

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I’m trying to gauge the coaches mentioned and they seem to fit in categories. 
 

You can’t make everyone happy but this is as close as it comes

  • Brad Stevens
  • Billy Donovan
  • John Beilien
  • Thad Matta 
  • Chris Beard
     

Keep it in the family

  • Dane Fife 
  • Steve Alford
  • Keith Smart
  • Mike Woodson
  • Randy Whitman
  • Calbert Cheaney
  • Michael Lewis

Let’s try another up and comer

  • Dennis Gates (mostly seen on other boards)
  • Andy Enfield
  • Nate Oats

Long shots that would be interesting 

  • Chris Mack
  • Dana Altman

Win now at any cost

  • Scott Drew
  • Rick Pitino

 

 

 

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7 minutes ago, go_iu_bb said:

I took a look over on BTown Banners yesterday and also saw stuff about Enfield there and some seemed to like the idea. That one is puzzling to me. In 6 years at USC he has only a 58.5% winning percentage overall and is 47.6% in that weak conference. Is there something I'm missing about him that would make him a desirable hire?  Seems like he would be a downgrade from Miller or, at best, just as bad.

Chris Mack would be an upgrade for sure. I'm not convinced he would be the solution either, though. He's been good but not great so far at Louisville. A positive for him is that their trouble doesn't seem to hurt him much.

I think I'll probably be disappointed in the hire once again.

That’s where the Enfield rumors originated. I’m fine with it if IU is casting a wide net and talking to a lot of coaches. This screams to me that Dolson is taking notes from Chris Ballard and Kevin Pritchard on how to conduct a coaching search.

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32 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

So doing some dot connecting of rumors between some of the people who tend to have good info on this board and that chris007 who seems to have good info on btownbanners here is the picture I am gathering:

1.  The money is available for the buyout and has been available since Friday.

2.  There is a meeting this weekend (today?) with the BoT and members of the athletic department will probably be in attendance.

3.  The school is either reaching out to gauge interest (Enfield?) or has had representatives for coaches reaching out to them (Mack?)

So, just running on the idea that where there is smoke, there is fire, I think that the school might be leaning heavily towards a reboot (again) of the basketball team.

That being said, if this is true, I want the next guy to have some more latitude on handling the program.  I loved the Knight years.  Some of my first memories of holding a basketball were pretending to be Steve Alford and Keith Smart playing opponents in my head to win an NCAA championship.  I had the lunchroom debates with the sudden surge of Michigan fans around the middle school lunch table when Cheaney and Co. were not the "cool" team, but they were the winning team.  I marched around campus my senior year of college pissed off that they fired Knight.  All that being said, we need to finally bridge this gap.  Our history is AWESOME.  Here is the deal though, I am 42.  I was in 2nd grade when we last won an NCAA title.  I am the top end of the age range of an IU student who actually got to watch a Knight coached team as an IU student.  We need to figure out what is important to carry forward as Indiana tradition and we need to give some latitude to this next coach and students to build off of what we have left and build some things of their own.

The things that matter to me are the approach to the game.  I want to feel like the team cares at least as much as I used to.  I want kids who represent the school well.  (I think Miller's kids have done that.)  I want to honor the guys that have been here before.  I want to win.

Things that should be up for debate to me are where students sit at the game.  Names on jerseys.  The music selections at the games.  Allowing for alternate uniforms.  Allowing names on the back of the jerseys.  Pushing NLI to make sure we are getting our fair share of players.  Making sure the AD compliance department is working for our teams and not against.  I think we need to figure out what we do that is not considered "cool" or is seen as old fashioned and make some moves to update those areas.  Our whole aesthetic screams that we are stuck in a timewarp... right down to the cheerleaders outfits.

The next hire needs to be a starting point to really moving forward from Knight.  I don't feel we have been able to do that.  With his appearance back in the Hall last year, I feel we have the "blessing" back on the program.  I think a conversation needs to be had about what INDIANA means.  I do not think anyone has had a clear grasp of that since 2000.

Excellent post.  

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19 minutes ago, Shapopojoe said:

Dennis Gates?! How does he even get a mention? Lord help us

There’s more to coaching then the overall record. Understand the program’s state when he took over verses where it’s at now. Should he be a candidate? Maybe or maybe not but to write people off you know nothing about or little about is not a good idea.

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33 minutes ago, BeerBQ said:

I’m trying to gauge the coaches mentioned and they seem to fit in categories. 
 

You can’t make everyone happy but this is as close as it comes

  • Brad Stevens
  • Billy Donovan
  • John Beilien
  • Thad Matta 
  • Chris Beard
     

Keep it in the family

  • Dane Fife 
  • Steve Alford
  • Keith Smart
  • Mike Woodson
  • Randy Whitman
  • Calbert Cheaney
  • Michael Lewis

Let’s try another up and comer

  • Dennis Gates (mostly seen on other boards)
  • Andy Enfield
  • Nate Oats

Long shots that would be interesting 

  • Chris Mack
  • Dana Altman

Win now at any cost

  • Scott Drew
  • Rick Pitino

 

 

 

  • Brad Stevens
  • Billy Donovan

    Are not coming to IU. Both have been successful in the NBA (no recruiting/NCAA BS and more $$$). The only way they become available is if they have a fall from grace in the NBA. Either way, I'd assume coaches like this call YOU to let you know they're interested. 
    16 minutes ago, Fundamentals said:

    Excellent post.  

    The uniform stuff I just don't think matters and if it does, it's semi-counter to:  I want to feel like the team cares at least as much as I used to. 

    I think IU just needs a coach that has done it a high level, not in a smaller conference. But that's my take. 

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19 minutes ago, OGIUAndy said:
  • Brad Stevens
  • Billy Donovan

    Are not coming to IU. Both have been successful in the NBA (no recruiting/NCAA BS and more $$$). The only way they become available is if they have a fall from grace in the NBA. Either way, I'd assume coaches like this call YOU to let you know they're interested. 

    The uniform stuff I just don't think matters and if it does, it's semi-counter to:  I want to feel like the team cares at least as much as I used to. 

    I think IU just needs a coach that has done it a high level, not in a smaller conference. But that's my take. 

I don't think the uniform matters with regards to play on the court directly, I think it will come into play when I, as a player, can make money off my Name, Likeness, and Image.  That impacts recruiting, which can impact on court play.

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If Archie somehow comes back, I don't know how he recruits with everyone knowing that he needs to make a huge improvement or he is gone.  On the other hand, he would have to view this as his last opportunity to coach at a school that often is talked about with the blue bloods, so he should swing for the fences.  If the administration has tied his hands with how he coaches/recruits, then he needs to force them to stop him, even if it would be grounds for dismissal.  (btw-I am not talking about paying players and using "ladies of the evening" with recruits.)  He has money already, and will always be able to make a good living in basketball, but this is his one shot at being a coach at one of the big schools.  I think it is worth the risk.  If he succeeds, and the administration tries to muzzle him or run him out of town, the fans would go nuts.  Archie has got to know that winning would give him a great deal of job security with the fans. 

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Young kids (recruits) are interested in “cool” alternate uniforms.  It’s probably not a deciding factor alone but it forms an overall image for a program.  They also sell well. The NFL and MLB trot out alternate unis and for many teams they are a huge success.  

More importantly, in my mind a critical piece for the coach is reasonable autonomy over the basketball program.  What I’m thinking of especially is we should allow the coach to have at it when it comes to transfers.  I’m tired of watching the likes of Texas Tech, Louisville, Michigan, and OSU do really well in the transfer market.  We were able to get Stewart and that’s a good sign but take it up a notch.  

It is like giving an NFL coach the final call on the 53 man roster instead of the GM.  From what we’ve heard, Glass (without a basketball background) made some calls. 

A big determining factor for us is absolutely leading and pushing the envelope on the likeness idea.  Get our players compensated at the highest level and we will take advantage of the system. 
 

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1 minute ago, IUDan93 said:

If Archie somehow comes back, I don't know how he recruits with everyone knowing that he needs to make a huge improvement or he is gone.  On the other hand, he would have to view this as his last opportunity to coach at a school that often is talked about with the blue bloods, so he should swing for the fences.  If the administration has tied his hands with how he coaches/recruits, then he needs to force them to stop him, even if it would be grounds for dismissal.  (btw-I am not talking about paying players and using "ladies of the evening" with recruits.)  He has money already, and will always be able to make a good living in basketball, but this is his one shot at being a coach at one of the big schools.  I think it is worth the risk.  If he succeeds, and the administration tries to muzzle him or run him out of town, the fans would go nuts.  Archie has got to know that winning would give him a great deal of job security with the fans. 

I think he would have to go massive into the transfer market. Like bring in 3-4 in addition to Stewart. If he's back by some chance, he can't rely on adding more freshmen. He's need to sell playing time and opportunity to guys that also only have a year left to play. 

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Just now, 13th&Jackson said:

He could step in seamlessly. Cleveland St. is shooting 45% overall, 31% from three and 66% on FTs. They have three guards who play over 25 mins/game that shoot under 30% from three.

Gates seems like an up and comer but i agree in no way is he ready for IU.  

I think the Utah State coach is good.  I like his future.  But I don’t see that happening when we just hired Archie.  We need more catchet this time. 

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