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It’s time... Fire Archie Miller


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So with the news of Coach Allen getting his extension and making 4.9 mil.  Do we think this is a sign that IU will be willing to pay that much or more for a basketball coach. Or do we think after this extension there won't be money this year to make a change.  Was this meeting that was supposed to happen about coach Allen's extension and not about the basketball coaching situation.

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39 minutes ago, Bustout said:

Why does he want out?  Just because he hasn’t been successful?    He doesn’t strike me as that type of person - rather the type of person that will want to keep grinding, overhaul, and fix it.     Just me though. 

Try living in Bloomington with a family as the unpopular coach. It would be absolute hell....

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In my opinion I think the TA news bodes well for getting a higher end basketball coach. Allen getting the raise should squash the idea that the university is hurting for money. Plus, Dolson is a basketball guy. I don’t see him giving the football coach a raise and then not try to go all out for a basketball coach. I think the Allen raise is a sign of him saying “Tom is gonna get the raise he deserves, now let’s go get our basketball coach.”

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10 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

So with the news of Coach Allen getting his extension and making 4.9 mil.  Do we think this is a sign that IU will be willing to pay that much or more for a basketball coach. Or do we think after this extension there won't be money this year to make a change.  Was this meeting that was supposed to happen about coach Allen's extension and not about the basketball coaching situation.

I don’t see it as apples to apples.  Allen got a raise.  Archie would have to get fired, buyout paid, new coach paid, and new coach potential buyout paid.   
 

There’s no question - there is always money when it comes to IU b-ball.    
 

Dolson has a tough decision and unique variables ... but I don’t see this as apples to apples.   And yes - the money is there to get 95% of the realistic candidates. 

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8 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

So with the news of Coach Allen getting his extension and making 4.9 mil.  Do we think this is a sign that IU will be willing to pay that much or more for a basketball coach. Or do we think after this extension there won't be money this year to make a change.  Was this meeting that was supposed to happen about coach Allen's extension and not about the basketball coaching situation.

Are the optics ok to spend big money on a winning coach in a pandemic year when the univeristy is struggling different than paying the buyout of a losing coach?

And i don't know or understand anything this administration does.

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1 minute ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

Are the optics ok to spend big money on a winning coach in a pandemic year when the univeristy is struggling different than paying the buyout of a losing coach?

And i don't know or understand anything this administration does.

Athletics lost like 40-60mm.  A couple sports are hanging on by a thread.   The concern would be maybe men’s tennis and wrestling would have to go if this money is spent.           
 

these are just the arguments, speculation, variables. 

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58 minutes ago, Ferg 32 said:

Maybe. If he wants out I hope he makes that decision to step down but $10m is a lot to leave on the table.

There’s NO scenario where he would leave $10,000,000 on the table. At most if he wanted out it would be negotiated down but he’d still get a HUGE chunk.

So IF he’s not happy and would like to leave and start again, would you take 7-7.5 to do that or go thru hell to get 10? Plus you’d get the salary of where you’d go. So depending how the buyout would work he might love the chance to leave.

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11 minutes ago, Bustout said:

Athletics lost like 40-60mm.  A couple sports are hanging on by a thread.   The concern would be maybe men’s tennis and wrestling would have to go if this money is spent.           
 

these are just the arguments, speculation, variables. 

The buyout won't be paid by the administration but by the donors.   They won't get that money for anything else. 

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3 hours ago, IUFLA said:

That's the great thing about college sports...Players come and go according to their class/other playing options...With that, teams move up or down in the standings...

Take away Livers, Smith, and Brooks from Michigan... Ayo and Kofi from Illinois...Garza from  Iowa...Kyle Young and CJ Walker from Ohio State...That's experience, and experience wins in the B1G...Those players will more than likely be gone next year...

Without TJD, I still think we'll be in the top 4 in the conference...

We're gaining experience, and that's exactly what we need...Armaan made huge strides last year...who out of our freshmen makes them next year? That's the fun of college basketball...

College basketball is fun? Someone should let IU athletics department know that then. Seems the basketball program has been doing it all wrong for a long time. It hasn’t been fun in a long time. 

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16 minutes ago, dbmhoosier said:

The buyout won't be paid by the administration but by the donors.   They won't get that money for anything else. 

If they told me we would fire Archie and get Brad Stevens...I’d throw in a grand...and I’ve never donated. If they made it clear we were making a major change...they would have no problem convincing hundreds like me and maybe a handful of big donors alike. Money is no object if there is a major name out there. However, if we are doing nothing or playing in the kiddie pool...good luck getting a dollar.

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14 minutes ago, dbmhoosier said:

If he's worried about optics then he was never the right man for the job.

Don’t disagree.  Just presenting the counter-arguments and other side of the coin.   Like I’m sure IU as a whole is more about equal opportunity and more opportunities for more athletes, so they may view this is as - let’s do anything and everything to keep all sports afloat if money is the biggest issue here.  

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Just now, IU Scott said:

I find it funny that the administration that doesn't care about sports just gave a football coach 4.9 mil to pay for a football coach.

What was he making before?    
 

from a cost basis perspective, that’s why I don’t see it being the same situation as Archie.  Just my $0.02 ... which isn’t worth a nickel 

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1 minute ago, Bustout said:

What was he making before?    
 

from a cost basis perspective, that’s why I don’t see it being the same situation as Archie.  Just my $0.02 ... which isn’t worth a nickel 

Here we go with math again 😁

I believe he is making about a million dollars more a year.

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58 minutes ago, jefftheref said:

I am not bitter one bit. The facts are the facts when it comes to his coaching ability.  He will have to win no matter where he goes and he will be playing the same teams there as here. He couldn't do it here with all the talent in this state. 

I wish him no I'll will but he was a total failure here.

Then you are a better person (or much younger) than me.

I am completely bitter that IU has not been consistently relevant since the early '90s... but not much I can do about it.

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34 minutes ago, Bustout said:

I don’t see it as apples to apples.  Allen got a raise.  Archie would have to get fired, buyout paid, new coach paid, and new coach potential buyout paid.   
 

There’s no question - there is always money when it comes to IU b-ball.    
 

Dolson has a tough decision and unique variables ... but I don’t see this as apples to apples.   And yes - the money is there to get 95% of the realistic candidates. 

Look at it this way. You negotiate a buyout...it likely won’t be 10 million but whatever...say it’s 10. Archie gets another job at say 2 million. We owe him 8.

 If you still have to buyout Archie next year that’s still 3 million. Maybe he gets 2 and you owe him 1. The difference is 7 million. 
 

Everything else doesn’t matter. Whenever you fire him You save the 3 million you would pay Archie for that year. Take that off the new salary 5 mil?? So you spend 2 million more then currently but that will be the same this year or the next. Sunk cost. The other coaches buyout will be what it is. You have to buy it out this year or next but either way that’s money spent. In the end if it’s about money it’s 7 million (probably less once negotiated) and how much to spend on the new coach...but pushing it down the road doesn’t really make sense because every year the IU brand takes a hit you lose tv money/advertising money/donations/ticket sales...etc etc....and those losses likely are more to the University then the difference in buyout from year 4 to 5.

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56 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

So with the news of Coach Allen getting his extension and making 4.9 mil.  Do we think this is a sign that IU will be willing to pay that much or more for a basketball coach. Or do we think after this extension there won't be money this year to make a change.  Was this meeting that was supposed to happen about coach Allen's extension and not about the basketball coaching situation.

I suspect the meeting was about the extension.  Now could they have talked about other sports while there, definitely.  Actually the extension gives great cover to other topics that could have been discussed.

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4 minutes ago, FritzIam4IU said:

Here we go with math again 😁

I believe he is making about a million dollars more a year.

Right.  So the math vs Archie’s situation is a bit more than $1mm/year.  
 

Dolsons job is to support all 24 or whatever sports and evaluate each situation objectively. We are all here discussing on a b-ball message board ... primarily subjectively.   We’re fans.   While Dolsons a fan, his job is much more objective.    There are obviously many factors that play into this and on top of that, there are many one time factors this time around they are playing into it.     Will definitely be interesting. 

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2 minutes ago, iuthruandthru said:

I suspect the meeting was about the extension.  Now could they have talked about other sports while there, definitely.  Actually the extension gives great cover to other topics that could have been discussed.

Brilliant!

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