It’s time... Fire Archie Miller

[Zuckerkorn]

28 minutes ago, madmax said:

Here’s a quote from a supposed insider on another board. Obviously I can’t speak to his trustworthiness. 
 

“Is anyone a member of the Wells house society? Dolson did a conference call with them last night. A few things he said that I saw on another site was that the elephant in the room is men's basketball. Said he disappointed in the inconsistencies of the basketball program but that he and Archie are 100% on the same page. Take that for what it's worth.”

This coupled with news that IU reached out to an ISU player who just entered the portal tells me we’re about to have a lot of disappointed fans. If Archie were really about to resign, as many have suggested, would the staff really be actively recruiting days prior? I’m sure there’s a good chance that he would... but when I look at all the tea leaves I see year 5 under CAM.

Lol.  I read that a short time ago and figured he had gotten the info here.

[OGIUAndy]

2 minutes ago, BADGERVOL said:

The actively recruiting doesn’t seem strange in the least. If Archie is trying to negotiate the best buyout for himself, he’s not going to do a thing to wave a white flag or he loses all power at the table. It’s like saying “I want to leave so you can negotiate down as low as you want and I’ll take it.”

Hes going to work as though he’s gonna come back until they fire him or give him a good deal.

I would bet Archie is here next year. 

[FritzIam4IU]

27 minutes ago, madmax said:

Here’s a quote from a supposed insider on another board. Obviously I can’t speak to his trustworthiness. 
 

“Is anyone a member of the Wells house society? Dolson did a conference call with them last night. A few things he said that I saw on another site was that the elephant in the room is men's basketball. Said he disappointed in the inconsistencies of the basketball program but that he and Archie are 100% on the same page. Take that for what it's worth.”

This coupled with news that IU reached out to an ISU player who just entered the portal tells me we’re about to have a lot of disappointed fans. If Archie were really about to resign, as many have suggested, would the staff really be actively recruiting days prior? I’m sure there’s a good chance that he would... but when I look at all the tea leaves I see year 5 under CAM.

Dolson hasn't given CAM a vote of confidence in public as of yet. From everything I have read it seems like Dolson is exploring all options and isn't painting himself in a corner. The statement from the insider could very well also mean that he and Archie are on the same page regarding a buyout. @BADGERVOL is right...CAM isn't going to pack his bags and stop doing his job until something is official and my best guess is Dolson hasn't made a final decision yet and is waiting to see if he can find his "home run" hire. If not, Archie might very well be back.

[iuthruandthru]

1 minute ago, OGIUAndy said:

I would bet Archie is here next year. 

Me next year watching the season unfold if Archie is back:

[Bustout]

3 minutes ago, OGIUAndy said:

I would bet Archie is here next year. 

If it’s up to him, 100% agree. I don’t see him quitting this job and leaving.  
 

I’m still 50/50 if I think he gets let go. 

[Bustout]

1 minute ago, FritzIam4IU said:

Dolson hasn't given CAM a vote of confidence in public as of yet. From everything I have read it seems like Dolson is exploring all options and isn't painting himself in a corner. The statement from the insider could very well also mean that he and Archie are on the same page regarding a buyout. @BADGERVOL is right...CAM isn't going to pack his bags and stop doing his job until something is official and my best guess is Dolson hasn't made a final decision yet and is waiting to see if he can find his "home run" hire. If not, Archie might very well be back.

It’s possible a lot of candidates may not come to fruition until after the tourney (i.e. - Drew)

[Muddy River]

24 minutes ago, dbmhoosier said:

Wouldn't shock me.  Dolson is a yes man with little authority at this point.  McRobbie likely won't get involved so he'd need complete support from the BOT to make a change.

Do you ever get tired of posting that, or have you saved it and just cut and paste every time?  Just curious.

[GaloisGroupe]

3 minutes ago, FritzIam4IU said:

Dolson hasn't given CAM a vote of confidence in public as of yet. From everything I have read it seems like Dolson is exploring all options and isn't painting himself in a corner. The statement from the insider could very well also mean that he and Archie are on the same page regarding a buyout. @BADGERVOL is right...CAM isn't going to pack his bags and stop doing his job until something is official and my best guess is Dolson hasn't made a final decision yet and is waiting to see if he can find his "home run" hire. If not, Archie might very well be back.

Even a vote of confidence in public does not mean anything. How many times do we see an exec saying: "So-and-so is absolutely my person" in public and then they fire them two days later.

[FritzIam4IU]

1 minute ago, Bustout said:

It’s possible a lot of candidates may not come to fruition until after the tourney (i.e. - Drew)

Correct. It is also theoretically possible IU can win the Big Ten tourney and win a couple games in NCAA and Archie would almost definitely be back. I can't believe Dolson would fire CAM unless he had a replacement he liked lined up and IUs season was over.

[madmax]

4 minutes ago, Bustout said:

If it’s up to him, 100% agree. I don’t see him quitting this job and leaving.  
 

I’m still 50/50 if I think he gets let go. 

I would agree. I’ve never been swayed by the arguments for why he would willingly resign. I just don’t think it it’s in his DNA to essentially wave the white flag and give up. It’s not in many coaches at this levels DNA.

[FritzIam4IU]

1 minute ago, GaloisGroupe said:

Even a vote of confidence in public does not mean anything. How many times do we see an exec saying: "So-and-so is absolutely my person" in public and then they fire them two days later.

No doubt. But I also think if Dolson were determined to bring him back next season he would have said something positive.

[dbmhoosier]

1 minute ago, Muddy River said:

Do you ever get tired of posting that, or have you saved it and just cut and paste every time?  Just curious.

Do you ever get tired of bowing down before the Indiana Administration?  The results speak for themselves and they aren't pretty.  It's been a total sh!Tshow for over 20 years.  

[Inequality]

1 minute ago, madmax said:

Meh. I would respectfully disagree about Archie, but this has been argued a billion times here over the last month and there’s really nothing new to say.

Well then it’s time for him to pull out his ace in the hole because he has dug himself a hole.

In my opinion, he’s a guy like that could go to a much weaker conference and have success possibly like Dennis Gates has at Cleveland State. That’s still a bit of a stretch but more likely than any potential success at a P5.

I was behind him until the results this year. The guy isn’t going to get it done. If it takes some specialty piece for him to have one good year or if the B1G has to be weak for him to finish middle of the pack as looks to be the case, he’s no good.

I liked the fire at first. I likes hearing from my friends on the med staff that he is a gym rat and much more organized than Crean. They said Crean would do practices on the fly via text notification. I was told how well he would get guys to play. The whole fan base is still waiting for that.

And the players? They come in as Mr Basketball or at least the high scorer on their  HS basketball team. They suit up for Miller and the ball turns into a brick. It’s been recently that some of the players don’t care for him at all.

Serious question. How many times do you recall this team getting down the floor in a fast break situation? Very little. His defensive philosophy when not executed correctly kills the chance at any transitional offense. I believe this team would have better results in a man to man or zone. 

He can steal coach Klein’s playbook all he wants. Be a master of Xs and Os. But it’s apparent he can’t translate that into a product on the floor that can win games. To me he has shown no ability whatsoever ever to coach at the level the IU is historically known for.

It’s been a while yes but now is the chance for a fresh AD to get it right.

[Bustout]

2 minutes ago, GaloisGroupe said:

Even a vote of confidence in public does not mean anything. How many times do we see an exec saying: "So-and-so is absolutely my person" in public and then they fire them two days later.

He may give him a vote of confidence, but it would be after the season. Glass did that with Crean - then fired him a year later.    Part of any of these jobs these days is ignoring the noise and not feeding it.    He really doesn’t have to say anything.  Then after next season - Archie will either be fired or extended.   That will be his vote of confidence (or lack thereof).   
 

[OGIUAndy]

Here’s the thing, like it or not, agree with it or not, he’s had two seasons impacted by Covid, both with the team itself and recruiting, he’s got a long contract with a high buyout. Fans patience usually runs out one or two years before the administration in most situations. I like Archie, but something ain’t clicking, mostly on offense. I would suspect changes within the coaching staff and super aggressive play for transfers/shooters. That’s my two cents. 

[Bustout]

2 minutes ago, OGIUAndy said:

Here’s the thing, like it or not, agree with it or not, he’s had two seasons impacted by Covid, both with the team itself and recruiting, he’s got a long contract with a high buyout. Fans patience usually runs out one or two years before the administration in most situations. I like Archie, but something ain’t clicking, mostly on offense. I would suspect changes within the coaching staff and super aggressive play for transfers/shooters. That’s my two cents. 

I’m sure that’s his pitch to Dolson too. 
 

on the flip side, if Dolson is to make a change, this is the season to do it bc a new coach can rebuild the roster by August and really accelerate any rebuild.   

[NotIThatLives]

23 minutes ago, BADGERVOL said:

The actively recruiting doesn’t seem strange in the least. If Archie is trying to negotiate the best buyout for himself, he’s not going to do a thing to wave a white flag or he loses all power at the table. It’s like saying “I want to leave so you can negotiate down as low as you want and I’ll take it.”

Hes going to work as though he’s gonna come back until they fire him or give him a good deal.

IIRC Crean was out recruiting the week of fire.  

[IUProfessor]

The immediate transfer rule hasn't been approved. That may or may not happen.

[OGIUAndy]

4 minutes ago, Bustout said:

I’m sure that’s his pitch to Dolson too. 
 

on the flip side, if Dolson is to make a change, this is the season to do it bc a new coach can rebuild the roster by August and really accelerate any rebuild.   

And pay two coaches. The big hitter hire that everyone is clamoring for can do it any season. Also, NCAA allows paying players for use of their likeness IU will get their share of players etc. 

[NCHoosier32]

18 minutes ago, GaloisGroupe said:

Even a vote of confidence in public does not mean anything. How many times do we see an exec saying: "So-and-so is absolutely my person" in public and then they fire them two days later.

This AND... wouldn't it kind of be weird to make a public announcement that he is behind him?  Like I guess he would do it based on articles, podcasts, etc., but I would think if Dolson wants to keep him, he'd just tune all of that out and doesn't need to address it.  It's not like something happened that necessitates showing support.  

[Muddy River]

6 minutes ago, dbmhoosier said:

Do you ever get tired of bowing down before the Indiana Administration?  The results speak for themselves and they aren't pretty.  It's been a total sh!Tshow for over 20 years.  

Great comeback.  You have me nailed.  Which by the way supports my position that you make broad sweeping judgements about people without any real knowledge.  You have 3812 posts on this board, and 3811 are bashing Fred Glass, Tom Crean, and Archie Miller.  You have one post letting us know Snowling passed.  You refuse to ever see or post anything positive about IU which makes me question why you follow IU at all.  You take everything personal to the point you resort to name calling.  It's not healthy man.  Take a break, go outside and get a breath of fresh air.  Nothing IU athletics does is life or death.  Debate is fine, and can even be fun, but constantly being negative and taking things so personally is not good for your mental health.

[OGIUAndy]

All this being said, they "fired" Davis and Crean with far superior performances. Seems like a strange time to suddenly have patience, but I'm guessing it's about $ as much as performance this year. The fans deserve better. This team is not inconsistent, it's very consistent-below average in the BIG and bad on offense. Archie (if he is back) has one year to prove he can turn it around. My guess is the administration rather use the donor money to pay the next big time contract than to buy one out. But we'll see soon enough. 

[IUJoe]

1 hour ago, madmax said:

Here’s a quote from a supposed insider on another board. Obviously I can’t speak to his trustworthiness. 
 

“Is anyone a member of the Wells house society? Dolson did a conference call with them last night. A few things he said that I saw on another site was that the elephant in the room is men's basketball. Said he disappointed in the inconsistencies of the basketball program but that he and Archie are 100% on the same page. Take that for what it's worth.”

This coupled with news that IU reached out to an ISU player who just entered the portal tells me we’re about to have a lot of disappointed fans. If Archie were really about to resign, as many have suggested, would the staff really be actively recruiting days prior? I’m sure there’s a good chance that he would... but when I look at all the tea leaves I see year 5 under CAM.

With the we're "on the same page" comment, plus hearing we are interested in the transfer from Indiana State, I wonder how likely this scenario is:  Dolson has told Archie his results are unacceptable, and Archie agrees.  They have agreed to let Archie aggressively work the transfer market for a few months to see if he can significantly upgrade the roster for next season.  If he can't, he could be let go mid-summer, much like Ohio State did with Thad Matta, which would then open the door for NBA candidates since their season would be over.

[dbmhoosier]

1 minute ago, OGIUAndy said:

All this being said, they "fired" Davis and Crean with far superior performances. Seems like a strange time to suddenly have patience, but I'm guessing it's about $ as much as performance this year. The fans deserve better. This team is not inconsistent, it's very consistent-below average in the BIG and bad on offense. Archie (if he is back) has one year to prove he can turn it around. My guess is the administration rather use the donor money to pay the next big time contract than to buy one out. But we'll see soon enough. 

At minimum, if Dolson gives him another year he should force him to bring in new assistants.  That's what OSU did with Matta reportedly but he refused.  

[jefftheref]

2 minutes ago, OGIUAndy said:

All this being said, they "fired" Davis and Crean with far superior performances. Seems like a strange time to suddenly have patience, but I'm guessing it's about $ as much as performance this year. The fans deserve better. This team is not inconsistent, it's very consistent-below average in the BIG and bad on offense. Archie (if he is back) has one year to prove he can turn it around. My guess is the administration rather use the donor money to pay the next big time contract than to buy one out. But we'll see soon enough. 

Great post! I am not an Archie fan but I think you may of hit the nail on the head.