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6 hours ago, southsidehoosier said:

One of my most vivid  memories was crying myself to sleep at age 7 after IU lost their only B1G game to Ohio State in 92 or 93

I was in middle school in 1992.  I did not cry myself to sleep after the final four game but I developed a passionate loathing of Ted Valentine, Mike Krzeyzewski, and all things Duke that has never gone away.

If you had told 13 year old me that I would only see 1 more Final 4 and a handful of Sweet 16 appearances over the next 30 years I would have thought you were nuts.  It is a damn shame what happened to this program.  I have a 12 year old who just has little to no interest at all.  I lived and died for those games at his age, arguing with the Michigan and Purdue fans at school...the young kids today are not invested and I think a bunch of that has to do with 20 years of futility.

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No doubt I’m spoiled from an IU basketball perspective as I was a freshman at IU during the undefeated 75-76 season (sitting behind the basket in which Benson made the tip-in against UM, to send the game to ot and preserve the undefeated season, was a highlight I’ll never forget) and I was still in Bloomington (grad school) for the ‘81 championship.  Before the younger posters get jealous,  I would trade the two nattys to be 35 again....LOL

I’ve always wanted Archie to succeed, as I’m an IU fan and coaching carousels generally don’t work, but I increasingly think he is dead man walking (hope I’m wrong). Some have mentioned that the lack of effort for the RMK game shifted their thinking. I have mentioned lack of effort/intensity almost from the start. Archies alleged “brand” of blue collar, tough mindedness, has not come close to consistently transferring to how his teams have played. The RMK game was egregious but how about the OSU BTT game, in which we did not show up for a game that was widely viewed as a play-in to get in the tourney.  How do you not leave it all on the floor when it is your last chance to make the tourney????!!!! It’s year 4 and lack of consistent effort, lack of a perimeter threat, lack of a dominant PG and scoring draughts are still an issue. Are those things going to change in year 5??? Hope so, doubt it.

I don’t think I have unrealistic expectations but in the Big Ten Archie has been 6th (with the dreaded “Creanians”),  9th, 10th and I think we are headed to another 10th (or worse) finish. I fully realize the “old days” are gone, and I do like watching our freshmen, but several years in a row finishing around 10th in the league? Not acceptable.

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6 hours ago, IU878176 said:

No doubt I’m spoiled from an IU basketball perspective as I was a freshman at IU during the undefeated 75-76 season (sitting behind the basket in which Benson made the tip-in against UM, to send the game to ot and preserve the undefeated season, was a highlight I’ll never forget) and I was still in Bloomington (grad school) for the ‘81 championship.  Before the younger posters get jealous,  I would trade the two nattys to be 35 again....LOL

I’ve always wanted Archie to succeed, as I’m an IU fan and coaching carousels generally don’t work, but I increasingly think he is dead man walking (hope I’m wrong). Some have mentioned that the lack of effort for the RMK game shifted their thinking. I have mentioned lack of effort/intensity almost from the start. Archies alleged “brand” of blue collar, tough mindedness, has not come close to consistently transferring to how his teams have played. The RMK game was egregious but how about the OSU BTT game, in which we did not show up for a game that was widely viewed as a play-in to get in the tourney.  How do you not leave it all on the floor when it is your last chance to make the tourney????!!!! It’s year 4 and lack of consistent effort, lack of a perimeter threat, lack of a dominant PG and scoring draughts are still an issue. Are those things going to change in year 5??? Hope so, doubt it.

I don’t think I have unrealistic expectations but in the Big Ten Archie has been 6th (with the dreaded “Creanians”),  9th, 10th and I think we are headed to another 10th (or worse) finish. I fully realize the “old days” are gone, and I do like watching our freshmen, but several years in a row finishing around 10th in the league? Not acceptable.

I must have been sitting next to you in 1976 at UM game. Great memory. I, too, think Coach Archie may have hit the downside. The most recent Purdue game may be the turning point for me. Year four and you can't beat your rival once. And stink it up ?

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63 and solidly behind Archie. I've been living and dying with Indiana basketball since my first game at the old fieldhouse vs Illinois in 1963. Loved the 67 team that came out of nowhere to win the B10...

And, while I do like winning B10 championships and National Championships, each year is a journey for me. Pulling for the kids and the team no matter what. Even Crean's first teams, I never missed a game. 

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16 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

63 and solidly behind Archie. I've been living and dying with Indiana basketball since my first game at the old fieldhouse vs Illinois in 1963. Loved the 67 team that came out of nowhere to win the B10...

And, while I do like winning B10 championships and National Championships, each year is a journey for me. Pulling for the kids and the team no matter what. Even Crean's first teams, I never missed a game. 

I love that mindset. I try to clear my schedule to watch all the IU games and while I get frustrated at the losses and bad play sometimes, I love rooting for these guys and living and dying with every shot attempt or defensive possession. 

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25 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

63 and solidly behind Archie. I've been living and dying with Indiana basketball since my first game at the old fieldhouse vs Illinois in 1963. Loved the 67 team that came out of nowhere to win the B10...

And, while I do like winning B10 championships and National Championships, each year is a journey for me. Pulling for the kids and the team no matter what. Even Crean's first teams, I never missed a game. 

I truly wish i had your mindset.  I just don't though.

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I’m 52. My first experience with IUBB was the 1976 team. My grandparents introduced me to basketball and my grandfather and dad had to build me a miniature basketball court in our backyard b/c of this team. 

I didn’t actually know they were capable of losing back then - my other favorite team was the Harlem Globetrotters. I’ve lived through three IU national championships and would love nothing more than to get back to that. 

I’m frustrated with this team and with some facets of Archie’s coaching, but I’m not ready to throw in the towel yet. 

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3 score and 9 years ago...my mother brought forth this...chapters later...went to IU in '69 and left for the Navy early in '71...back to IU in the fall of '75 and graduated spring of '77...then UW-Madison '79 - '82...then Dayton Ohio since.

Evansville Bosse won it's 3rd State Championship in '62.  I graduated from Bosse in '69 and had to go to IU and only IU.    My home precollege was focused on Purdue..except for me.  The Old Field House memories of Joby Wright and George McGinnis and dust in the air. I too was there in the new Assembly Hall at every game...and football too.  Graduated, got married and IU won the National Championship...in the same year!  When at UW I cheered for IU....had season tickets up there too for football, basketball and hockey

 Was at Rupp when IU upset Duke with Mike Davis' team. Was at AH 2 and 3 years ago when IU lost to OSU.  Was at Bowling Green State U in Ohio when IU football got beat about 3 years ago.  

Followed Archie Miller's time at Dayton...very closely.  Attended a few games at UD both before and during his time here.  When Archie Miller came to Dayton it was a great breath of fresh air...especially compared to Brian Gregory who left the bench and recruiting in bad shape.  Archie struggled at first getting his smart, long, motivated team-oriented system in place.  Was very impressed by his success and the team effort and performance.

Was surprised at Archie Miller being tapped for Indiana.  That is because there were a lot of other coaches that were getting hyped.  Was definitely excited for Indiana and hoped for the best...thought it was a very good hire.  Was not surprised that he was on the short list.  Three concerns at the time: 1. Would fans give him the time to put his players in place? 2. Would his recruiting and system be transferrable to the B1G? 3. His reliance on a smart PG floor general is a critical part of his system...and he did not bring the PG recruit with him...because he did not want to stiff UD...but the recruit went elsewhere.

 I am very glad that Glass hired him and gave him ample time in the contract to prove himself.  But, at times I just wonder why has he not produced the constant competing at the top of the B1G every single year and deep runs in the  NCAAT and why the chemistry challenges last year and the lack of effort every so often.

Then I reflect on specifics...not focusing on hype and false expectations.  Archie's first year PG was Newton...and Archie got his first recruiting year in year 2.  Year 3 was overhyped with Romeo but he hurt his hand, Rob got his bell rung, and there were issues in the locker room...  But, it appeared that we were in the NCAAT except for the pandemic.  This is his 4th year and the pandemic is worse.  Indiana's PG is better this year.  Shooters, wings and guards are inconsistent.  Defense is not getting better.  

As with a lot of fans, I am frustrated with the results and the effort at times.  To me the key is the guard play.  Why has Archie Miller not gotten decent backup PGs and first-rate shooters?  And why didn't he resolve the alleged locker room issue last year?  

Did the basketball  setting in Indiana and in the B1G change so much in the last 20 years that it has put IU in the hole relative to recruiting?  Is it because IU screwed the 4 previous coaching changes so badly that there is now a cloud over the program?  Did the previous coach mess with high school recruiting in Indiana so badly and the administration emphasized to Archie to focus on state high schools to recruit? Did other colleges in the region grow in the eyes of recruits to Indiana's detriment?

What is the solution?  A new coach?  More time?  

I cannot answer these questions.  But, at UD he seemed to handle them.   So, I hope he can in time.  Will he get the time?    I still support Archie Miller.  

 

 

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1 hour ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

I truly wish i had your mindset.  I just don't though.

I'm actually the same.  Never missed a game when we went 6-25 or whatever we were.  I just love to watch no matter how good or bad we are.  Then again, I am also a die hard Cubs fan.  We aren't used to winning.  

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8 hours ago, slojoe said:

I will be 69 on 1/23.  As I said in another post, I'm rooting for CAM, but I've seen this movie.  Hope it ends better this time.

I thought Archie was the chosen one. And I really wished Crean would succeed and win 5 championships for us and retire as the best IU coach ever. But then I realized I was simply torturing myself with all the wishful thinking and expectations. What I learned over the course is if someone doesn't pass the eye test, he probably never will. It's damn hard for anyone to change 180 degrees and to become a totally different person. 

More and more fans are jumping off the Archie bandwagon. The amount of negativity is growing, and obviously it'll be much harder for Archie to recruit. The only way he can stop this vicious cycle is to produce on the court, but it probably isn't going to happen. There's high chance TJD would leave, so the front court production will be down quite a bit. We desperately need another guard to step up like Armaan, and we do have some candidates but it's uncertain. If Rob is still a starting guard next season, next season won't be better than this season. 

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2 hours ago, IUFLA said:

63 and solidly behind Archie. I've been living and dying with Indiana basketball since my first game at the old fieldhouse vs Illinois in 1963. Loved the 67 team that came out of nowhere to win the B10...

And, while I do like winning B10 championships and National Championships, each year is a journey for me. Pulling for the kids and the team no matter what. Even Crean's first teams, I never missed a game. 

Sir you're the true fan. Kudos to you!

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12 minutes ago, Air Ball said:

The Old Field House memories of Joby Wright and George McGinnis and dust in the air.

71 is one of my favorite IU years...

We didn't win anything, but that was one entertaining team...

Any IU fan who never got to witness Big George snatch a rebound one handed, dribble the length of the court, behind the back sometimes too, and throw a behind the back pass or flick it into the basket like he was dunking it when dunking wasn't allowed, got cheated...

Still the best individual player I ever saw at IU...I always wonder what 73 would have been like had he stuck around... 

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2 hours ago, IUFLA said:

63 and solidly behind Archie. I've been living and dying with Indiana basketball since my first game at the old fieldhouse vs Illinois in 1963. Loved the 67 team that came out of nowhere to win the B10...

And, while I do like winning B10 championships and National Championships, each year is a journey for me. Pulling for the kids and the team no matter what. Even Crean's first teams, I never missed a game. 

I still watch every minute of every game and hope we win every game.  Saying that I am not confident that Archie will turn this around.

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On 1/19/2021 at 9:38 AM, Air Ball said:

3 score and 9 years ago...my mother brought forth this...chapters later...went to IU in '69 and left for the Navy early in '71...back to IU in the fall of '75 and graduated spring of '77...then UW-Madison '79 - '82...then Dayton Ohio since.

Evansville Bosse won it's 3rd State Championship in '62.  I graduated from Bosse in '69 and had to go to IU and only IU.    My home precollege was focused on Purdue..except for me.  The Old Field House memories of Joby Wright and George McGinnis and dust in the air. I too was there in the new Assembly Hall at every game...and football too.  Graduated, got married and IU won the National Championship...in the same year!  When at UW I cheered for IU....had season tickets up there too for football, basketball and hockey

 Was at Rupp when IU upset Duke with Mike Davis' team. Was at AH 2 and 3 years ago when IU lost to OSU.  Was at Bowling Green State U in Ohio when IU football got beat about 3 years ago.  

Followed Archie Miller's time at Dayton...very closely.  Attended a few games at UD both before and during his time here.  When Archie Miller came to Dayton it was a great breath of fresh air...especially compared to Brian Gregory who left the bench and recruiting in bad shape.  Archie struggled at first getting his smart, long, motivated team-oriented system in place.  Was very impressed by his success and the team effort and performance.

Was surprised at Archie Miller being tapped for Indiana.  That is because there were a lot of other coaches that were getting hyped.  Was definitely excited for Indiana and hoped for the best...thought it was a very good hire.  Was not surprised that he was on the short list.  Three concerns at the time: 1. Would fans give him the time to put his players in place? 2. Would his recruiting and system be transferrable to the B1G? 3. His reliance on a smart PG floor general is a critical part of his system...and he did not bring the PG recruit with him...because he did not want to stiff UD...but the recruit went elsewhere.

 I am very glad that Glass hired him and gave him ample time in the contract to prove himself.  But, at times I just wonder why has he not produced the constant competing at the top of the B1G every single year and deep runs in the  NCAAT and why the chemistry challenges last year and the lack of effort every so often.

Then I reflect on specifics...not focusing on hype and false expectations.  Archie's first year PG was Newton...and Archie got his first recruiting year in year 2.  Year 3 was overhyped with Romeo but he hurt his hand, Rob got his bell rung, and there were issues in the locker room...  But, it appeared that we were in the NCAAT except for the pandemic.  This is his 4th year and the pandemic is worse.  Indiana's PG is better this year.  Shooters, wings and guards are inconsistent.  Defense is not getting better.  

As with a lot of fans, I am frustrated with the results and the effort at times.  To me the key is the guard play.  Why has Archie Miller not gotten decent backup PGs and first-rate shooters?  And why didn't he resolve the alleged locker room issue last year?  

Did the basketball  setting in Indiana and in the B1G change so much in the last 20 years that it has put IU in the hole relative to recruiting?  Is it because IU screwed the 4 previous coaching changes so badly that there is now a cloud over the program?  Did the previous coach mess with high school recruiting in Indiana so badly and the administration emphasized to Archie to focus on state high schools to recruit? Did other colleges in the region grow in the eyes of recruits to Indiana's detriment?

What is the solution?  A new coach?  More time?  

I cannot answer these questions.  But, at UD he seemed to handle them.   So, I hope he can in time.  Will he get the time?    I still support Archie Miller.  

 

 

Great post.

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On 1/19/2021 at 10:55 AM, IUFLA said:

71 is one of my favorite IU years...

We didn't win anything, but that was one entertaining team...

Any IU fan who never got to witness Big George snatch a rebound one handed, dribble the length of the court, behind the back sometimes too, and throw a behind the back pass or flick it into the basket like he was dunking it when dunking wasn't allowed, got cheated...

Still the best individual player I ever saw at IU...I always wonder what 73 would have been like had he stuck around... 

I remember Big George, with the Pacers, coming down court, pulling up and draining one-handed 3 pointers.

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On 1/18/2021 at 10:01 PM, IUCrazy2 said:

I was in middle school in 1992.  I did not cry myself to sleep after the final four game but I developed a passionate loathing of Ted Valentine, Mike Krzeyzewski, and all things Duke that has never gone away.

If you had told 13 year old me that I would only see 1 more Final 4 and a handful of Sweet 16 appearances over the next 30 years I would have thought you were nuts.  It is a damn shame what happened to this program.  I have a 12 year old who just has little to no interest at all.  I lived and died for those games at his age, arguing with the Michigan and Purdue fans at school...the young kids today are not invested and I think a bunch of that has to do with 20 years of futility.

I feel the same exact way on literally every single thing you just posted.  I'm 35 and remember that Duke game in 1992 and have LOATHED Duke, Kreyzewski and Valentine since. 

Regarding the post title....I'm done with Archie, but I'm okay waiting one more year if we can't find someone who can get IU back to national prominence. After next year, I want to move on unless we are consistently in the Top 25 and have a good recruiting class coming in.   

If the rumors' about Alford (ie, Alford being one of the administrations top choices) are even remotely true, then I'd hold onto Miller indefinitely :(

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On 1/18/2021 at 3:12 PM, IUwins0708 said:

I would love to see the age of some posters on here.  I’m guessing most of the younger posters 35 and under are still on board with Archie.  Not all but more posters that are older are the ones who are frustrated and ready for a coaching change.  Could be wrong, just more curious than anything.

I’m 34.  My expectations were a tourney berth in year 2 and then a tourney berth being the floor.  
 

Finishing above .500 in conference I thought was a given. 
 

So basically in my eyes Archie is a failure.  And will most likely be the first multi year coach at IU not to go over .500 in conference at least once in over a hundred years. Pretty terrible when Mike Davis and Tom Crean can throw shade at you 

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On 1/18/2021 at 11:15 PM, IU878176 said:

 

I’ve always wanted Archie to succeed, as I’m an IU fan and coaching carousels generally don’t work, but I increasingly think he is dead man walking (hope I’m wrong).

Not trying to single you out with this post, but I'm getting really sick of the narrative I've seen popping up in various IU forums that we change coaches too often. Archie Miller has had a full recruiting cycle and Crean got almost a whole decade. We're in this mess because we keep bad coaches too long, not because we change coaches too often. 

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18 minutes ago, TheWatShot said:

Not trying to single you out with this post, but I'm getting really sick of the narrative I've seen popping up in various IU forums that we change coaches too often. Archie Miller has had a full recruiting cycle and Crean got almost a whole decade. We're in this mess because we keep bad coaches too long, not because we change coaches too often. 

Any coach who is worried because he doesn’t think he can make the tourney in 4 seasons and finish above .500 in conference is a guy I don’t want anyway. 

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3 hours ago, Defenserocks28 said:

I feel the same exact way on literally every single thing you just posted.  I'm 35 and remember that Duke game in 1992 and have LOATHED Duke, Kreyzewski and Valentine since. 

Regarding the post title....I'm done with Archie, but I'm okay waiting one more year if we can't find someone who can get IU back to national prominence. After next year, I want to move on unless we are consistently in the Top 25 and have a good recruiting class coming in.   

If the rumors' about Alford (ie, Alford being one of the administrations top choices) are even remotely true, then I'd hold onto Miller indefinitely :(

Welcome to the fun!

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2 hours ago, TheWatShot said:

Not trying to single you out with this post, but I'm getting really sick of the narrative I've seen popping up in various IU forums that we change coaches too often. Archie Miller has had a full recruiting cycle and Crean got almost a whole decade. We're in this mess because we keep bad coaches too long, not because we change coaches too often. 

Not feeling singled out but am curious how you thought my post inferred that we have changed coaches too often. That assumption isn’t even close to what I think. 

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