Jump to content

Recommended Posts

3 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

I think most peoples expectations are still based on winning championships and not just making the tournament.  I guarantee you even if we made the the tournament every year but it  get to the final four our fans will still be up in arms calling for the coaches head.

Yo have to get in it to win it, we can't even do that. 1st step would be a tourney birth

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 100
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

He lost a game he was favored by double digits in by double digits twice that season.  Twice.  That is rare to see that big a turn around once in 5 years.  Archie did it twice.  He then brought in the

One thing I’d like to see is IU as a program get more active with transfers.  This goes back across multiple coaches and it’s kind of how we do business.  Yes, I am aware we take transfers such as Ste

if i'm a confident, experienced college head coach, i might care about the AD and president, but i'm not losing sleep over fans on a message board.  there's just no way that all fans are going to love

Posted Images

2 minutes ago, Billingsley99 said:

It was well after 88 that he would have came. It was also after 92 even thought RMK and K were not speaking. K had enough respect for RMK to not even consider it after the firing. K wanted to be the successor to RMK. I got that from several very close to that relationship 

Well, Mike Davis led us to the 2002 championship game.  Not sure Coach K could/would have done that.  :coffee:

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

He lost a game he was favored by double digits in by double digits twice that season.  Twice.  That is rare to see that big a turn around once in 5 years.  Archie did it twice.  He then brought in the biggest name to come out of Indiana HS basketball since Damon Bailey and lost 12 of 13 games.  You can get on the fans here about expectations or whatever but I am telling you right now that Iowa, Michigan, Purdue, Illinois, etc. fans would have been flipping out about that too.

I get tired of this idea that Indiana fans are impatient.  We are not impatient, our coaching hires have sucked.  Everyone who said Mike Davis was a mediocre coach was right.  Everyone who said that Crean's style was too erratic to consistently win, was correct.  Everyone who said Miller was having problems with his program has been correct.  There is too much good ball that has been played in our building and by other teams in our conference for it not to be clear when things are off the rails.

Lost 12 of 13..."but injuries...."  Yeah, people could buy that if the years around that have not been so subpar.  Archie doing a mediocre job made that bad injury situation worse.  And the reason our fans look so bad is because the dumb (expletive deleted) who run this University ALWAYS wait too long to pull the plug.  They wait until the house is burnt to the ground before bringing a water bucket.  We are getting ready to possibly do it again.

"He should get another year no matter what..."  No, he shouldn't.  He should be fired at the end of the year.  But we'll probably keep him around.  TJD is said to be leaving by people who might be in a position to know.  So you are going into year 5 hoping that Race and Armaan carry us and a bunch of Freshmen who have not shown much to date suddenly improve enough to carry you through a season.  And when that inevitably leads to a season of around .500 ball in the BIG (at best) and the fans are going nuts...then we get the blame for being mean and having too high of expectations because with TJD leaving we are young and blah, blag, blag.  But the reality is the admin sucked for being too chicken shhh to ever be the bad guy in these situations.

.

.

Sorry for the rant but this stuff drives me nuts.

Again I am not saying the fans are the only reason but to say we don't have any responsibility to where this program is wrong in my opinion.

1) Administration is responsible because it seems like they don't put as much emphasis on basketball.  It was Herbert that ruined IU basketball when he demanded we hire Sampson.

2) College basketball is just so different today than it was 30 years ago.  Recruiting is so different because it is way more nationally driven than it use to be.  You see more coaches staying put because they care as much about fit and culture than they do money.  Before you probably wouldn't see Mark Few or even guys like Byrd at Belmont or McKillop at Davidson stay at their mid major programs.

3) TV changed things because every team is pretty much on national TV every day so kids think they can go anywhere and be seen.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, IU Scott said:

Again I am not saying the fans are the only reason but to say we don't have any responsibility to where this program is wrong in my opinion.

1) Administration is responsible because it seems like they don't put as much emphasis on basketball.  It was Herbert that ruined IU basketball when he demanded we hire Sampson.

2) College basketball is just so different today than it was 30 years ago.  Recruiting is so different because it is way more nationally driven than it use to be.  You see more coaches staying put because they care as much about fit and culture than they do money.  Before you probably wouldn't see Mark Few or even guys like Byrd at Belmont or McKillop at Davidson stay at their mid major programs.

3) TV changed things because every team is pretty much on national TV every day so kids think they can go anywhere and be seen.

 

Sorry, your fans argument doesn't hold any water with me when there are other fanbases worse than us with more successful teams in all sports at all levels. 

  • Like 2
  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

I get the comparison to Holtman ,Underwood and Archie, we all know that Archie way under performed. What I don’t understand is that Archie knowing his job depended on him winning. Never recruited over Robert Johnson, Devote Green, Durham are Rob P. Why. Unlike Crean he had extra scholarships to give. 
Does anyone really think our guard play will be substantially better next year. I don’t, landers can’t shoot a lick. I was told he took all the high schoolers to the rim. Can’t do that now. We are hanging our hat on Stewart. 

If TJD leaves what do we have. Oh yeah the 12 or 13 best recruited class in the Big Ten. # 78 in the country! Very promising 

Link to post
Share on other sites
39 minutes ago, AxnJxn said:

Why are the expectations today so high? Seriously? There are currently 4 B1G teams in the top 10, and we're struggling to make the tournament. Does that answer your question?

And what high expectations is anyone even talking about?  There would be a parade on Kirkwood if we managed to finish with a winning conference record this season.

  • Haha 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

He lost a game he was favored by double digits in by double digits twice that season.  Twice.  That is rare to see that big a turn around once in 5 years.  Archie did it twice.  He then brought in the biggest name to come out of Indiana HS basketball since Damon Bailey and lost 12 of 13 games.  You can get on the fans here about expectations or whatever but I am telling you right now that Iowa, Michigan, Purdue, Illinois, etc. fans would have been flipping out about that too.

I get tired of this idea that Indiana fans are impatient.  We are not impatient, our coaching hires have sucked.  Everyone who said Mike Davis was a mediocre coach was right.  Everyone who said that Crean's style was too erratic to consistently win, was correct.  Everyone who said Miller was having problems with his program has been correct.  There is too much good ball that has been played in our building and by other teams in our conference for it not to be clear when things are off the rails.

Lost 12 of 13..."but injuries...."  Yeah, people could buy that if the years around that have not been so subpar.  Archie doing a mediocre job made that bad injury situation worse.  And the reason our fans look so bad is because the dumb (expletive deleted) who run this University ALWAYS wait too long to pull the plug.  They wait until the house is burnt to the ground before bringing a water bucket.  We are getting ready to possibly do it again.

"He should get another year no matter what..."  No, he shouldn't.  He should be fired at the end of the year.  But we'll probably keep him around.  TJD is said to be leaving by people who might be in a position to know.  So you are going into year 5 hoping that Race and Armaan carry us and a bunch of Freshmen who have not shown much to date suddenly improve enough to carry you through a season.  And when that inevitably leads to a season of around .500 ball in the BIG (at best) and the fans are going nuts...then we get the blame for being mean and having too high of expectations because with TJD leaving we are young and blah, blag, blag.  But the reality is the admin sucked for being too chicken shhh to ever be the bad guy in these situations.

.

.

Sorry for the rant but this stuff drives me nuts.

 

hit-the-nail-on-the-head-gif.gif

Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, FW_Hoosier said:

And what high expectations is anyone even talking about?  There would be a parade on Kirkwood if we managed to finish with a winning conference record this season.

Sure they would and if that was the case Crean would still be here.  He was fired after winning two conference titles in 5 years and making 3 sweet 16's

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

Sure they would and if that was the case Crean would still be here.  He was fired after winning two conference titles in 5 years and making 3 sweet 16's

He was fired for having no consistency.  He had 2 NBA players on his squad the last year and missed the tournament...again.  He got 3 years of really bad basketball until Cody Zeller came along and saved his butt.  Then Yogi had the one year that was really good after the Watford's, Zeller's and Oladipos left.  But in between that was another team with Noah Vonleh and Yogi Ferrell (both future NBA players) where he missed the tournament as well.  And based on the supposed awful team that Miller inherited (that is the defense of Miller's first few years) Crean had nothing left in the pipeline either.  His recruiting had fallen apart.  What you leave out is those 3 years where he made the Sweet 16 (and 1 first round loss) were the only years he did anything out of the 9 he was at Indiana.  Crean's teams were bipolar.  He got let go because while his highs were nice, he had too many low lows.  Even removing the first 3 awful years, he was still 63-45 (58.8%) in Big Ten games.  He was 66% in overall games if you remove the first 3 years but he was notorious for having weak schedules in preconference.  

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

He was fired for having no consistency.  He had 2 NBA players on his squad the last year and missed the tournament...again.  He got 3 years of really bad basketball until Cody Zeller came along and saved his butt.  Then Yogi had the one year that was really good after the Watford's, Zeller's and Oladipos left.  But in between that was another team with Noah Vonleh and Yogi Ferrell (both future NBA players) where he missed the tournament as well.  And based on the supposed awful team that Miller inherited (that is the defense of Miller's first few years) Crean had nothing left in the pipeline either.  His recruiting had fallen apart.  What you leave out is those 3 years where he made the Sweet 16 (and 1 first round loss) were the only years he did anything out of the 9 he was at Indiana.  Crean's teams were bipolar.  He got let go because while his highs were nice, he had too many low lows.  Even removing the first 3 awful years, he was still 63-45 (58.8%) in Big Ten games.  He was 66% in overall games if you remove the first 3 years but he was notorious for having weak schedules in preconference.  

I know why he was fired and agreed with it but was responding to the post who said we would have a celebration for finishing with a winning conference record.  I know it was tongue in cheek comment but he was acting like this was our expectations now.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, IU Scott said:

I know why he was fired and agreed with it but was responding to the post who said we would have a celebration for finishing with a winning conference record.  I know it was tongue in cheek comment but he was acting like this was our expectations now.

I think it is the expectation now.  That is why people wonder why we would be viewed poorly as a fanbase.  Everyone going into this year said we just need to make the tournament and finish top half of the BIG.  So 7th or better.  In year 4.  When 2 of his peers hired at the same time are currently ranked in the Top 5 in the country...we were hoping to be Top 7 in our conference and make the tournament.  I don't know how you lower expectations any more than that without saying you don't care about what kind of job he does.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

I think it is the expectation now.  That is why people wonder why we would be viewed poorly as a fanbase.  Everyone going into this year said we just need to make the tournament and finish top half of the BIG.  So 7th or better.  In year 4.  When 2 of his peers hired at the same time are currently ranked in the Top 5 in the country...we were hoping to be Top 7 in our conference and make the tournament.  I don't know how you lower expectations any more than that without saying you don't care about what kind of job he does.

I don't think just finishing 7th or higher is the expectations of the fan base.  I predicted us to finish 5th this year and make it to at least the second round.  My expectations for IU going forward should be finishing at least in the top 5-6 of the big ten most years if not all.  The floor should me making the tournament every year and go to at least sweet 16 2 out of 4 years.  I would hope we make the final four at least once every 6 or 7 years.  I also wouldn't fire a coach who wins a lot during the regular season every season but doesn't make a final four.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, IUCrazy2 said:

If Miller misses the tournament this year, that is 4 years of no tournament (I know that ticks IUFLA off to say that, but we were a bubble team last year and there was no guarantee we were in the tournament last year).

I don't get ticked off...I just don't understand why people want to pile on with things that are untrue...

So, just a question...

Kansas (30) and Gonzaga (21) have two of the longer consecutive NCAA appearance streaks...

Did those go back to zero after last year? 

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

I don't get ticked off...I just don't understand why people want to pile on with things that are untrue...

So, just a question...

Kansas (30) and Gonzaga (21) have two of the longer consecutive NCAA appearance streaks...

Did those go back to zero after last year? 

We were 9-11 last season.  COVID or not it's nothing to brag about in year 3.

Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

I don't get ticked off...I just don't understand why people want to pile on with things that are untrue...

So, just a question...

Kansas (30) and Gonzaga (21) have two of the longer consecutive NCAA appearance streaks...

Did those go back to zero after last year? 

Nope.  It is an asterisk year but I am not going to act like we were in when we were firmly on the bubble going into the BTT.  We won a game and then had Ohio State I believe coming up.  A team that we have not performed well against.  We had a losing record in the BT and I think would have needed 2 wins in the BTT to just get us to .500 against conference opponents.  

I don't think we were a slam dunk to be in the tournament.  We were just as likely to be NIT bound as we were in the tourney.   If we would have had a better year around sandwiched around those off years, fans would be more willing to give benefit of the doubt.  But we haven't.  That was a subpar year where we went into our conference tournament needing to win games.  This year is likely to be the same.

Call it fair or unfair, it is not like we had 25 wins and were 3rd place in our conference.  I think if that was the case everyone would have given a pass, but we weren't, so alot of people aren't.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, IU Scott said:

Why do you think Billy Donnovan turned UK down twice

1st time: https://www.chron.com/sports/college-basketball-men/article/Donovan-spurns-Kentucky-offer-stays-at-Florida-1672295.php

IMO - Off of back to back championships, I'd say he turned it down b/c it was a step down at the time. Why leave something you've built that is currently more successful that some other place (in your same conference). Also while he was an assistant there for 5 years, it was because of his connection to Pitino (his former HC while playing at Providence) not some strong connection(s) to fUK.

2nd time:https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/news/story?id=4022074

IMO - Basically the same thing but fUK was even further down after 2 years with Billy G. Leave the place you won 2 NCAA titles and have plenty of leeway b/c of it for a lateral move at best at the time? I wouldn't.

Doesn't matter what I think, but I seriously doubt he turned them down b/c he was afraid of the fan base. Maybe he likes living in Gainesville more than Lexington. Maybe he doesn't want to live in Pitino's shadow. I can think of a plethora of reasons before I get to "fan impact".

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, IUCrazy2 said:

Nope.  It is an asterisk year but I am not going to act like we were in when we were firmly on the bubble going into the BTT.  We won a game and then had Ohio State I believe coming up.  A team that we have not performed well against.  We had a losing record in the BT and I think would have needed 2 wins in the BTT to just get us to .500 against conference opponents.  

I don't think we were a slam dunk to be in the tournament.  We were just as likely to be NIT bound as we were in the tourney.   If we would have had a better year around sandwiched around those off years, fans would be more willing to give benefit of the doubt.  But we haven't.  That was a subpar year where we went into our conference tournament needing to win games.  This year is likely to be the same.

Call it fair or unfair, it is not like we had 25 wins and were 3rd place in our conference.  I think if that was the case everyone would have given a pass, but we weren't, so alot of people aren't.

So, let me get this straight...

Kansas and Gonzaga get to keep their record intact with an asterisk for the 2020 season, but IU, who was in the field by every 2020 bracket I can find, "missed the tournament for 4 straight years." 

I think this is where I get a little lost...Everyone, save a few posters, are supposed to be IU fans...Yet anything you can dream up to get this coach gone is fair game, even if it smells...

I haven't said a word about criticism  of Archie, because some of it is deserved...But be fair about it...

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
54 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

I don't get ticked off...I just don't understand why people want to pile on with things that are untrue...

So, just a question...

Kansas (30) and Gonzaga (21) have two of the longer consecutive NCAA appearance streaks...

Did those go back to zero after last year? 

I don't have the answer when athletes went to war and missed seasons how was that tracked? 

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Billingsley99 said:

I don't have the answer when athletes went to war and missed seasons how was that tracked? 

A better analogy to me would be if in the middle of Joe DiMaggio's 56 game hit streak there was a rainout, does that snap the streak?

Edited by IUFLA
Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...