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It's Time........Hire Dane Fife!


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Just now, BobSaccamanno said:

We have no idea whether Fife can develop high level strategy or make adjustments or put a team out there that can compete on the road and be ready to battle.  There is no way that i would hire with all those unknowns.  It’s a total stab in the dark.  

I appreciate your argument and understand having a guy who gets IU but to me that point is far outweighed by critical aspects of coaching.  With Dane I would have wanted to see sustained success somewhere.  We can’t afford to take the risk. 

Besides, Beard learned under Knight and Pat Knight and he probably does in fact get it.  Based on your argument I would think Beard becomes the most attractive candidate. Musselman doesn’t come off the Knight coaching tree but he is the son of a coach and just a coaching lifer and grinder.  I think he knows what IU means. If you had your choice, if we factor in your argument, Beard might win the tie breaker.  

At least there’s some aspect of Beard out side of his solid resume that tickles a place in our past. Some emotion there...

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If Dolson and the donors just coughed up 10 million to remove Archie to bring in Fife then something is terribly wrong with the water they are drinking.

If I’m a donor in this situation, and you come at me now with the Fife plan, I’m subject to hit you with something before I call in Pat Kraft to replace you.

Joking aside, kind of, there is more to the story that’s being kept quiet. I’m pretty sure, not positive that Dolson will prove to have got it right.

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1 hour ago, 5fouls said:

I think it means understanding the expectations of the fan base.  The last week with Archie's firing and the Stevens drama are perfect examples.  What happened in Hoosierland this week does not happen with 99% of the programs in the country.  Of all the names thrown on the board that aren't IU guys, Rick Pitino is probably the only one that has a true understanding of what to expect.  And, IU honestly can't hire him.  

Okay.  I get that, but understanding fan base expectations isn't going to help Alford, Fife, or Woodson if they are in over their head, right?

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9 minutes ago, Inequality said:

If Dolson and the donors just coughed up 10 million to remove Archie to bring in Fife then something is terribly wrong with the water they are drinking.

If I’m a donor in this situation, and you come at me now with the Fife plan, I’m subject to hit you with something before I call in Pat Kraft to replace you.

Joking aside, kind of, there is more to the story that’s being kept quiet. I’m pretty sure, not positive that Dolson will prove to have got it right.

I also have a little faith that he had a better plan than just one guy then if he says no “well let’s start asking around.”

More likely had some big fish in the hand and sold boosters on “worst case we have this but I’m even going to swing for Stevens first.”

But then I also think that IF that’s the case it should’ve been kept more tight lipped that Stevens was even pursued because that fact makes a “Beard Hire” seem less impressive. So that fact makes me feel like he sold the Boosters on “we almost certainly will get Stevens,” so I talk myself back to a mess again.

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1 hour ago, 5fouls said:

No emotion at all factored into the original post.  I came to a personal conclusion that being a good coach does not mean that one can be a good coach at Indiana.  And, when someone who grew up in the state either does not understand it, or wants no part of it, how can we expect Chris Beard or Eric Musselman to get it.  Kelvin Sampson didn't.  Archie miller didn't.  Tom Crean did to a degree, but miscalculated in a couple of key places.

I'm not advocating an IU guy just to advocate an IU guy.  We know what Steve Alford can do, and it's not good enough.  But, Bob Knight was unproven when he first took the job,  Fife could be another Knight or end up being another Archie Miller. But, so can Chris Beard. 

I agree with you here that Fife may end up being great some day.  Also, all great coaches get a start somewhere.  I just don't see how we are in a position to take the chance.  Of course Beard is not a guarantee, but he has been a head coach at a P5 school and taken them to the Final 4.  Seems like much less risk.    

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7 minutes ago, OLDIUFAN said:

You know I heard this the other day an was like hummm! Why not bring in Beilein an Fife as his Assistant to take over after a few years. 

I actually like this idea in a lot of ways, but I keep saying unless there is a relationship between the two that I am unaware of, it seems like a fantasy.  You don't really go to two guys who don't know each other and say "Hey guys.  We want you to work together.  John, we figure you'll only last 4-5 years and want you to prepare Dane.  Dane, just give us 4-5 years and the job is your's."  

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4 minutes ago, NCHoosier32 said:

I actually like this idea in a lot of ways, but I keep saying unless there is a relationship between the two that I am unaware of, it seems like a fantasy.  You don't really go to two guys who don't know each other and say "Hey guys.  We want you to work together.  John, we figure you'll only last 4-5 years and want you to prepare Dane.  Dane, just give us 4-5 years and the job is your's."  

Furthermore if it’s true MSU doesn’t see Fife as their replacement for Izzo, are we to assume their assessment after years of Fife being there is Horse Crap and they don’t know what they’re talking about? They have a future star coach they work with on a daily basis that we haven’t worked with and they don’t “get it?”

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Too many great points in this thread to quote all. Fife would be interesting to me 4 years ago. I think he truly gets it I just wonder what kind of staff he could put together. I think he would be fine in recruiting.  He was a MCD all American played in title game and would bring a true toughness. It would be a huge leap of faith for him to be hired but I just don't see that happening.  

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5 hours ago, 5fouls said:

Now, before you all start thinking that Fouls has taken one too many frying pans to the side of the head, hear me out.

The more I think about what Stevens said in his little presser, the more I've convinced myself that he either does not 'get' what IU means, or he does not want any part of it.  Either way, I think 'getting' it and 'wanting' it are both pre-requisites of the job.  I don't think Archie ever had either of those things.  I think Crean wanted it, and got it to a degree, but even he fell short of fully understanding what it took (see his relationships with in-state high school coaches).

All that said, can we really expect guys like Chris Beard or Eric Musselman to both get it and want it?  I think we would run the risk of both of those guys falling short in one or the other of those things.  Thad Matta probably gets it, but does he want it.  Good chance he doesn't.  Beilein, like Crean, probably has a good foundation of understanding what it would take, but also like Crean, he has some built in flaws that would prevent him from ever truly succeeding.

So, who out there would both 'get' it and 'want' it?  A former IU player.  That's who.  And, with all due respect to guys like Cheaney, Smart, Wittman, and Woodson, they have been away from the college game too long to understand what it would take to succeed with today's player.  So, who does that leave?  Guys like Fife and Lewis.  I'm going to give the edge to Fife because he's been working in the Big Ten all this time.  And, while Lewis has some Big Ten experience with Nebraska, Fife has more in his tenure with Michigan State.

Would Fife be a risk?  Absolutely.  But, assuming he has the best chance to both 'get' it and 'want' it of all the names being tossed around, he might just possess the most upside as well.  And, if after talking to him, Dolson has reservations, then look towards Lewis.  

I've never felt it was necessary to have an IU guy.  But, after listening to and absorbing what Stevens said, I've changed my mind.  Sure, Beard or Musselman may be attracted to the money.  And, they may be drawn to the banners in the rafters.  But, would they truly understand what Indiana means?

Throw your rocks.  I've got thick skin.

What is your take on Scott Drew? Unless I missed it I didn't see it. He lived in Indiana and has Indiana ties (the state). He built up a dumpster fire at Baylor that was way worse than IU and has a good offensive scheme. Do you think he would do well at IU? Would you consider him despite the Hanner stuff? Not trying to put you on the spot, but just curious since you mentioned Beard/Musselman but not Drew.

I think he would do very well....I just don't know if Dolson would consider him.

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2 minutes ago, FritzIam4IU said:

What is your take on Scott Drew? Unless I missed it I didn't see it. He lived in Indiana and has Indiana ties (the state). He built up a dumpster fire at Baylor that was way worse than IU and has a good offensive scheme. Do you think he would do well at IU? Would you consider him despite the Hanner stuff? Not trying to put you on the spot, but just curious since you mentioned Beard/Musselman but not Drew.

I think he would do very well....I just don't know if Dolson would consider him.

I for one would be fine with Drew. The Haner situation was terrible and I don't condone it but I am 1 for learning from mistakes and I also love what he has done at Baylor. I don't mind if he plays in the gray and I don't care if other fan bases think we are cheating because they will anyway. 

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1 minute ago, Billingsley99 said:

I for one would be fine with Drew. The Haner situation was terrible and I don't condone it but I am 1 for learning from mistakes and I also love what he has done at Baylor. I don't mind if he plays in the gray and I don't care if other fan bases think we are cheating because they will anyway. 

i agree with this, but i do believe the outlook that IN travel coaches and HS coaches want nothing to do with him.  that would not be okay.  

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2 minutes ago, Billingsley99 said:

I for one would be fine with Drew. The Haner situation was terrible and I don't condone it but I am 1 for learning from mistakes and I also love what he has done at Baylor. I don't mind if he plays in the gray and I don't care if other fan bases think we are cheating because they will anyway. 

That is where I am at. He would have to mend some fences and earn some trust, but he knows how to construct a team and win.

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I think a lot of these guys like Beard, Musselman, or Drew might use a dalliance with IU to get a raise, but I seriously doubt we get any of them...And if we have to go into the 7 million per territory to lure one of them here, I think we're way overpaying...

Musselman is especially worrisome for me, because of thoughts like this...I think any college job is simply a stepping stone back into the NBA for him...

Like I said, I might entertain Beilein as a stop gap, but if I'm gonna roll the dice, I think Calbert Cheaney deserves consideration over Fife and Lewis...

Cheaney checks some boxes, but not one person checks them all...

I know I poked fun at @IU Scott for suggesting Keith Smart, but I think this is the territory we're in right now... 

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1 hour ago, Inequality said:

If Dolson and the donors just coughed up 10 million to remove Archie to bring in Fife then something is terribly wrong with the water they are drinking.

If I’m a donor in this situation, and you come at me now with the Fife plan, I’m subject to hit you with something before I call in Pat Kraft to replace you.

Joking aside, kind of, there is more to the story that’s being kept quiet. I’m pretty sure, not positive that Dolson will prove to have got it right.

Dolson and the owners coughed up $10 million to bring in Stevens.  Let's not kid ourselves. They believed they had their man.  I'm not convinced there was a solid Plan B.  

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1 hour ago, FritzIam4IU said:

What is your take on Scott Drew? Unless I missed it I didn't see it. He lived in Indiana and has Indiana ties (the state). He built up a dumpster fire at Baylor that was way worse than IU and has a good offensive scheme. Do you think he would do well at IU? Would you consider him despite the Hanner stuff? Not trying to put you on the spot, but just curious since you mentioned Beard/Musselman but not Drew.

I think he would do very well....I just don't know if Dolson would consider him.

Drew is not getting nearly as much conversation as expected.  Even the Vegas odds like others better.  My guess is that there is a solid reason for that.  We just don't know for sure what it is.  I'll speculate and go back to that story from 7-8 years ago that ranked him as the 2nd biggest cheat behind Calipari.   

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55 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

I think a lot of these guys like Beard, Musselman, or Drew might use a dalliance with IU to get a raise, but I seriously doubt we get any of them...And if we have to go into the 7 million per territory to lure one of them here, I think we're way overpaying...

Musselman is especially worrisome for me, because of thoughts like this...I think any college job is simply a stepping stone back into the NBA for him...

Like I said, I might entertain Beilein as a stop gap, but if I'm gonna roll the dice, I think Calbert Cheaney deserves consideration over Fife and Lewis...

Cheaney checks some boxes, but not one person checks them all...

I know I poked fun at @IU Scott for suggesting Keith Smart, but I think this is the territory we're in right now... 

What makes you believe Cheaney and Smart are better choices than Fife?  Fife is currently involved in the college game with a very good program in our own conference.  That's a lot of ground to make up for those other two guys.  

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16 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

Dolson and the owners coughed up $10 million to bring in Stevens.  Let's not kid ourselves. They believed they had their man.  I'm not convinced there was a solid Plan B.  

There is no way to know if plan A still is not in the works.  Rumors, that turn out to be false.  I know people like to put down Rabj, but the guy is as connected as anyone.  All he needs to do is make a real text to the source itself, and they get back to him.  He has stood by no announcement this weekend.  But, people were saying done deal and announcement.  

Fans are fans - But, plan A is still probably in place and being worked on.  And, that could be Stevens, or that could not be Stevens.

This is tight lipped, Dolson made that clear.  There isn't going to be fans who are in the know.  And, the 10 million dollar donor wants to be anonymous-  doesnt want fame, attention or ruin the process.  

Let this unfold.

If Dane is plan A, cool!  Meant to be.

I STILL want Woodson, Calbert or Smart.  I THINK they would rock it.

But, I am just one fan, one proud IU graduate.

Mostly likely plan A might be in the tourney or on a NBA sideline or office and that is also why no announcement right now.  

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6 hours ago, 5fouls said:

Now, before you all start thinking that Fouls has taken one too many frying pans to the side of the head, hear me out.

The more I think about what Stevens said in his little presser, the more I've convinced myself that he either does not 'get' what IU means, or he does not want any part of it.  Either way, I think 'getting' it and 'wanting' it are both pre-requisites of the job.  I don't think Archie ever had either of those things.  I think Crean wanted it, and got it to a degree, but even he fell short of fully understanding what it took (see his relationships with in-state high school coaches).

All that said, can we really expect guys like Chris Beard or Eric Musselman to both get it and want it?  I think we would run the risk of both of those guys falling short in one or the other of those things.  Thad Matta probably gets it, but does he want it.  Good chance he doesn't.  Beilein, like Crean, probably has a good foundation of understanding what it would take, but also like Crean, he has some built in flaws that would prevent him from ever truly succeeding.

So, who out there would both 'get' it and 'want' it?  A former IU player.  That's who.  And, with all due respect to guys like Cheaney, Smart, Wittman, and Woodson, they have been away from the college game too long to understand what it would take to succeed with today's player.  So, who does that leave?  Guys like Fife and Lewis.  I'm going to give the edge to Fife because he's been working in the Big Ten all this time.  And, while Lewis has some Big Ten experience with Nebraska, Fife has more in his tenure with Michigan State.

Would Fife be a risk?  Absolutely.  But, assuming he has the best chance to both 'get' it and 'want' it of all the names being tossed around, he might just possess the most upside as well.  And, if after talking to him, Dolson has reservations, then look towards Lewis.  

I've never felt it was necessary to have an IU guy.  But, after listening to and absorbing what Stevens said, I've changed my mind.  Sure, Beard or Musselman may be attracted to the money.  And, they may be drawn to the banners in the rafters.  But, would they truly understand what Indiana means?

Throw your rocks.  I've got thick skin.

Just watch the IU round table on Indiana Sports Beat and all of those former players is saying that the next coach has to know what basketball is like at Indiana and the state of Indiana.  I use to not think it had to be an Indiana guy but I am changing my mind and think it is time to bring someone home.  The slogan is that in 49 states its basketball but this is Indiana.  We have tried everything else so why not try an IU guy or someone with ties to Indiana.  

I think going forward I am done with posting one here and message boards because I am becoming obsessed with all of this coaching carousel. I am tired of worrying what other fans think of the hire so I am just going to worry who I think is a hire and don't care what others think of it.  Also I am tired of myself worrying about who others think is a hire and trying to argue with their choice.  To me sports is for entertainment and what has been going on message boards and social media lately is just not fun any longer.  All i care about is IU getting a good coach who that can win games and bring in kids we can be proud of.  I don't want kids coming to IU who won't represent IU in a great way and embarrass the program.  Even though we haven't won we have for the most part  brought in good kids who represented IU in a good way.

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1 minute ago, 5fouls said:

What makes you believe Cheaney and Smart are better choices than Fife?  Fife is currently involved in the college game with a very good program in our own conference.  That's a lot of ground to make up for those other two guys.  

Fife is a good option, maybe great option.  He has worked under one of the best coaches.  He does have a different personality.  He could rock it.  

But, Calbert and Smart have if factor, they would be cool to today's recruits, have the NBA pitch, played for the greatest coach, and coached with great coaches.  They are known for being great human beings, role models.  Love IU, give back anychance they have - what's not to like.  Maybe Crews would join forces with Calbert.  

It's 2021 new adaptable ways and innovative ideas is what takes the marketplace.  Creativity is a must- IU needs the energy.

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3 hours ago, 5fouls said:

What cred did Chris Beard have the first time he walked into a recruit's home?  Fife has been a long time assistant for a much better program than Beard ever was.

Listen to Kent Sterling yesterday and he was talking about Fife when he was a coach at IPFW.  Sterling's son was on the same AAU team as Howard, Hahn and Botts.  He said the only two coaches who were at every game no matter the time of their game was Stevens and Fife.  He said Fife worked so hard to get Botts who ended up at IPFW and the last two years they won 19 games.  sterling talked to people about Fife even taking that job and no one thought he should go because you just can't win there.

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18 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

Dolson and the owners coughed up $10 million to bring in Stevens.  Let's not kid ourselves. They believed they had their man.  I'm not convinced there was a solid Plan B.  

This is what worries me. I would like to believe the powers that be had a legit backup plan and have back channeled to check on interest of other coaches that were on the short list just in case, but I'm not convinced this is the case. 

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1 minute ago, 5fouls said:

What makes you believe Cheaney and Smart are better choices than Fife?  Fife is currently involved in the college game with a very good program in our own conference.  That's a lot of ground to make up for those other two guys.  

I'm not backing Keith Smart, just Calbert Cheaney...

Dolson's comments for one...

"basketball is different than it was three years ago, four years ago, six years ago in terms of how it fits into the NBA and moving on and playing professionally. I think we have to blend all of that together to have an attractive style of play, that obviously can win consistently, but that players want to play in and see themselves in."

Calbert played 12 seasons in the NBA and has had a couple of stints as an NBA assistant...He knows the game...Fife never played or coached in the NBA...

Plus the fact that while Fife was a good player for IU, Calbert is an all time great...I know it might not impress 18 year old Indiana kids, but it'll damn sure impress their parents...Being the all time leading scorer in B1G history is nothing to sneeze at...

I'm just saying if we're going to roll the dice, he should be in consideration...

 

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2 hours ago, BobSaccamanno said:

We have no idea whether Fife can develop high level strategy or make adjustments or put a team out there that can compete on the road and be ready to battle.  There is no way that i would hire with all those unknowns.  It’s a total stab in the dark.  

I appreciate your argument and understand having a guy who gets IU but to me that point is far outweighed by critical aspects of coaching.  With Dane I would have wanted to see sustained success somewhere.  We can’t afford to take the risk. 

Besides, Beard learned under Knight and Pat Knight and he probably does in fact get it.  Based on your argument I would think Beard becomes the most attractive candidate. Musselman doesn’t come off the Knight coaching tree but he is the son of a coach and just a coaching lifer and grinder.  I think he knows what IU means. If you had your choice, if we factor in your argument, Beard might win the tie breaker.  

I watched his teams when he was a head coach.  Those teams were VERY good and were coached real well.  He can coach.  At that time, he would be the first to admit, he wasn't ready for the administrative side of being a head coach.  Now, he probably is after being mentored by Izzo.

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