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Coach Mike Woodson Megathread


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8 minutes ago, rico said:

Yeah, the thread has veered a tad off course.

Explain to me what an NBA style of offense is.  Seems like what little I watch of it there is a lot of iso or two man game with lots of kick outs to open shooters.  

We won't iso as much, expect for Trayce. But... we will have a ton of two man game. In general, we will have much better spacing, we will have designated places to be when the ball is on certain spots on the floor. We will understand when to cut much better, and much more frequently, as well. 

It will be fluid. Less wasted motion. The ball will also move much quicker. Ball screen, noticed how they are playing it... take what they give you, and then execute on the back end of the play scoring. Sounds simple, but there will be plenty of ways we go about scoring. 

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1 minute ago, NotIThatLives said:

The NBA seems to have much more purposeful ball movement. When you only have 24 seconds to get a shot off you got to make something happen faster.  There's no bull crap dribble weave and crap up top for 25 seconds.

It absolutely does. For some reason there is a perception amongst some of ours fans that the NBA is just pounding the ball up top and going ISO, but that is much more prevalent in college than the NBA. 

Before someone posts a video of James Harden, just understand that is the exception not the rule. For the most part, an NBA defense isn't going to allow a team to just go ISO then break you down off of the dribble; they'll trap and force the ball out of someones hand. Think back to our games against MSU were Aaron Henry took over or the Illinois game where Ayo did - that's not going to happen with Woodson. He's going to force the ball out of those guys hands and make someone else beat us. Even if a guy like Miller Kopp isn't a great individual defender, we are going to have team schemes that are much more important over the course of a game than a guys ability to lock someone up 1:1. 

This is really important because most college teams don't have enough guys who can beat you; you force the ball past the first couple options and most college teams are in trouble. On the flip side, we look to be rolling out a lineup of 5 guys who can beat you and are used to being a primary or at worst secondary option on their team. There won't be any, "take away TJD and you can beat Indiana" against us next year, because XJ, Stewart, and Kopp have all been primary scorers on D1 teams plus Bates has shown he can knock down shots at a high clip. 

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13 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said:

The NBA seems to have much more purposeful ball movement. When you only have 24 seconds to get a shot off you got to make something happen faster.  There's no bull crap dribble weave and crap up top for 25 seconds.

Absolutely, no question. 

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45 minutes ago, rico said:

Yeah, the thread has veered a tad off course.

Explain to me what an NBA style of offense is.  Seems like what little I watch of it there is a lot of iso or two man game with lots of kick outs to open shooters.  

Mike Davis ran the NBA style offense. :coffee:

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1 hour ago, NotIThatLives said:

The NBA seems to have much more purposeful ball movement. When you only have 24 seconds to get a shot off you got to make something happen faster.  There's no bull crap dribble weave and crap up top for 25 seconds.

I was just thinking about this while watching the Bulls this weekend. Every player on the floor is a good passer. It's pretty remarkable that in 24 seconds how often NBA offenses get a good shot up. As stated above, it's all about match-ups. Each team has their star who has a green light in isolation that's going to suck in double teams, leaving one guy open. This is not that much different from college, but the difference is how quickly they can find that shooter/driver (directly or through a hockey assist) and how quickly they can physically get the ball in his hands. The ball flies around the perimeter: the movement is crisp and everybody on the offense knows where it's going. It's why it amazes me when some say that today's NBA lacks skill. It's just a different kind of skill than in eras past.

Directing this back to Woody, I think he maybe able to play an NBA 'style', but it will be NBA 'light'. Those fundamentals, IQ and vision takes time to develop and the accuracy of the shooters needs to be WAY better in order to spread the floor to resemble a true NBA style offense.  I almost think for this team it may take a couple of months of going back to basics (ala Beilein): work on passing, work on coming off of screens, stop holding the ball, etc.

In interviews I keep hearing the assistant coaches use the term: "high tempo", but with the caveat: "it doesn't mean we're going to be jacking up shots early in the shot clock". By high tempo, I think it's more of an emphasis on moving the ball quickly and instinctively. (side to side as well as up and down) In order to do this everybody needs to be moving with a purpose and be on the same page. Which is something I didn't see last year and is probably easier said than done. This staff has their work cut out for them. I can't wait for November. 

 

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19 minutes ago, tdhoosier said:

I was just thinking about this while watching the Bulls this weekend. Every player on the floor is a good passer. It's pretty remarkable that in 24 seconds how often NBA offenses get a good shot up. As stated above, it's all about match-ups. Each team has their star who has a green light in isolation that's going to suck in double teams, leaving one guy open. This is not that much different from college, but the difference is how quickly they can find that shooter/driver (directly or through a hockey assist) and how quickly they can physically get the ball in his hands. The ball flies around the perimeter: the movement is crisp and everybody on the offense knows where it's going. It's why it amazes me when some say that today's NBA lacks skill. It's just a different kind of skill than in eras past.

Directing this back to Woody, I think he maybe able to play an NBA 'style', but it will be NBA 'light'. Those fundamentals, IQ and vision takes time to develop and the accuracy of the shooters needs to be WAY better in order to spread the floor to resemble a true NBA style offense.  I almost think for this team it may take a couple of months of going back to basics (ala Beilein): work on passing, work on coming off of screens, stop holding the ball, etc.

In interviews I keep hearing the assistant coaches use the term: "high tempo", but with the caveat: "it doesn't mean we're going to be jacking up shots early in the shot clock". By high tempo, I think it's more of an emphasis on moving the ball quickly and instinctively. (side to side as well as up and down) In order to do this everybody needs to be moving with a purpose and be on the same page. Which is something I didn't see last year and is probably easier said than done. This staff has their work cut out for them. I can't wait for November. 

 

Yep.  I didn't see Michigan wasting time with excessive dribbling.  That is how I hope we play.  

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1 hour ago, tdhoosier said:

I was just thinking about this while watching the Bulls this weekend. Every player on the floor is a good passer. It's pretty remarkable that in 24 seconds how often NBA offenses get a good shot up. As stated above, it's all about match-ups. Each team has their star who has a green light in isolation that's going to suck in double teams, leaving one guy open. This is not that much different from college, but the difference is how quickly they can find that shooter/driver (directly or through a hockey assist) and how quickly they can physically get the ball in his hands. The ball flies around the perimeter: the movement is crisp and everybody on the offense knows where it's going. It's why it amazes me when some say that today's NBA lacks skill. It's just a different kind of skill than in eras past.

Directing this back to Woody, I think he maybe able to play an NBA 'style', but it will be NBA 'light'. Those fundamentals, IQ and vision takes time to develop and the accuracy of the shooters needs to be WAY better in order to spread the floor to resemble a true NBA style offense.  I almost think for this team it may take a couple of months of going back to basics (ala Beilein): work on passing, work on coming off of screens, stop holding the ball, etc.

In interviews I keep hearing the assistant coaches use the term: "high tempo", but with the caveat: "it doesn't mean we're going to be jacking up shots early in the shot clock". By high tempo, I think it's more of an emphasis on moving the ball quickly and instinctively. (side to side as well as up and down) In order to do this everybody needs to be moving with a purpose and be on the same page. Which is something I didn't see last year and is probably easier said than done. This staff has their work cut out for them. I can't wait for November. 

 

One thing in the NBA they take the first open look and they don't waste the first half of the shot clock wasting time.  

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12 hours ago, slojoe said:

You're never more open than when you catch the ball.

 

56 minutes ago, cybergates said:

Best James Harden Drops Wes Johnson GIFs | Gfycat

Uhh...yeah...well...lol  but I totally get what your saying. We need to catch ready and confident to shoot. Pass up a lot of good looks hesitating or turning and dribbling out clock. Be purposeful in either catch and shoot or catch and drive. No more fear of the Archie death stare for missing a good shot.

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they are in the NBA for a reason.  Most of the starters on every NBA team was at one point the best players on their team or in the country.  It is somewhat comparable to college but we're not comparing apples to apples here.  You don't make to the nba or the starting rotation by not having good BB IQ or a skillset that makes you a hard matchup.

 

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5 minutes ago, slojoe said:

OK.  I'll amend that.  You're never more open than when you catch the ball except when your defender falls down!

I'll amend it more.  You're never more open than when you push your defender down and the refs let it happen bacause you're an overpaid baby on the court and they don't want to hear it from you for the next 40 minutes.

Edited by IowaHoosierFan
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2 hours ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

they are in the NBA for a reason.  Most of the starters on every NBA team was at one point the best players on their team or in the country.  It is somewhat comparable to college but we're not comparing apples to apples here.  You don't make to the nba or the starting rotation by not having good BB IQ or a skillset that makes you a hard matchup.

 

This is true, but part of that is because NBA coaches and teams are better at maximizing what guys do. Duncan Robinson wasn't even a full-time starter at Michigan yet he starts and plays a pivotal role for the Heat because Spoelstra finds a way to maximize the use of one of the best shooters on the planet. 

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14 hours ago, KoB2011 said:

This is true, but part of that is because NBA coaches and teams are better at maximizing what guys do. Duncan Robinson wasn't even a full-time starter at Michigan yet he starts and plays a pivotal role for the Heat because Spoelstra finds a way to maximize the use of one of the best shooters on the planet. 

Robinson is an interesting story.  The Heat told him they were sending him to the G-league.  They told him to shoot whenever he was open even if only slightly so.  That was the good news.  The bad news was that he would always guard the best offensive player on the other team regardless of position.  Guess that worked.

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21 hours ago, KoB2011 said:

This is true, but part of that is because NBA coaches and teams are better at maximizing what guys do. Duncan Robinson wasn't even a full-time starter at Michigan yet he starts and plays a pivotal role for the Heat because Spoelstra finds a way to maximize the use of one of the best shooters on the planet. 

True but for the most part they are all highly talented players.  College might have 1 of them on a team and rest are usually never going to make it to the NBA.  Its just not the same game either direction you go.  And we never take in to account the officiating or whatever they call it at the NBA level that allows for so much more everything.

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