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Coach Mike Woodson Megathread


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Something that should not be overlooked is what having Woodson means for this summer's season of 'free agency' in college.  It's possible there are some hard working players who have a borderline NBA future that might be interested in getting a year of two of coaching under Woodson to bolster their NBA prospects and transfer to IU (without penalty).  It's a consideration IU would not have benefitted from had we hired a college coach.  

Edited by 5fouls
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20 hours ago, NotIThatLives said:

Sweet.  

Coach,

Go check out the transfer portal.  And also, while you are at it, would you please bring on 2 or 3 of the top juco guys?

Thanks,

Love the hire(think you are about to kill it and not play games)

Notithatlives

P.S. Also, take advice from my guy @BGleas, in fact hire him. He has celtics marketing skills with Hoosier blood and passion.  

Let me know if you seek any other advice on how to run the program.  

The @BGleas advice is legit though, you should listen, seriously.

#cmw #coachmike #coachmikewoodson

#lol

 

jerry maguire GIF by Jerology

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1 minute ago, 5fouls said:

Something that should not be overlooked is what having Woodson means for this summer's season of free agency.  It's possible there are some hard working players who have a borderline NBA future that might be interested in getting a year of two of coaching under Woodson to bolster their NBA prospects and transfer to IU (without penalty).  It's a consideration IU would not have benefitted from had we hired a college coach.  

That remains to be seen. It could also go the other way where he's not that well known by these players and outside of Matta doesn't have a ton if built in connections. 

I'm not predicting that, I'm just saying I could see him hitting a grand slam this summer but could also see him striking out. 

We'll see, but the potential prospect of Woodson landing some great transfers is exciting. 

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17 minutes ago, BGleas said:

Been really busy so haven't posted since the weekend. That also gave me a chance to digest this a bit more after the initial disappointment. 

I still think this is a really risky move, and could potentially do more long term damage to the program if it doesn't work. I'm also still disappointed that after Stevens, IU didn't go big game hunting in the college ranks (Beard, Musselman, Drew, Oats, etc.), as I felt the move here was to get a coach with proven Power 5 experience. Think a Kelvin Sampson move but finally getting it right with a cleaner version. 

With that said and more time to hear Woodson speak, etc., I am more optimistic than I was before. I still think this is either a massive mistake or a genius move with little in between, but I do have a little more hope that it's genius, and here's why. 

I'm hoping this wasn't just a "we need an IU guy" move to bring in an old player and Woodson is the best they could find.

What I am hoping is that this was actually a strategic decision by Dolson to be at the forefront of a shift in college basketball. I'm hoping this was a strategic decision with the NIL coming to be ahead of the curve and turn IU basketball into almost an NBA training ground. To be a program that is player friendly and that the top players want to be.

I don't mean a one and done factory, I just mean to build the program as almost an NBA training ground. When you come to IU you have a head coach that ties the tradition of IU with the forward thinking ways of the NBA in terms of style of play, taking care of players, off the court preparation, etc. As consultants you have one of the best college basketball coaches of the last 15 years in Matta and potentially you have one of the top coaches in all of basketball in the last 30-40 years in Larry Brown. As some have said, almost like the Alabama of college basketball with Saban surrounding the program with former head coaches, etc. 

Right there you have three guys that are highly successful in the game of basketball at all levels and have been there and done that. Then you add things like the Cuban Center for Sports Media, hopefully a fantastic, forward thinking group of assistants, and this could be a genius move. 

My hope is that this was strategic beyond just "let's get an IU guy". I don't mean that as a negative necessarily, I'm just hoping there is potentially an even larger strategic plan in play here. 

 

Yes I said earlier that I support him now. My fear is if it doesn’t work out and we can’t get rid of him because of all the IU homer’s . Then making the next hire even harder perception wise.

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Just now, BGleas said:

That remains to be seen. It could also go the other way where he's not that well known by these players and outside of Matta doesn't have a ton if built in connections. 

I'm not predicting that, I'm just saying I could see him hitting a grand slam this summer but could also see him striking out. 

We'll see, but the potential prospect of Woodson landing some great transfers is exciting. 

They may not know who he is now, but once he introduces himself and provides his background, the player almost has to listen a little harder.  It's not like Woodson is simply going to say 'I'm Mike Woodson.  Come to IU.  We missed the tournament last season and we need you.".  No.  He's going to say.  "i'm Mike Woodson, and let me tell you a little bit about myself."

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1 minute ago, Bowhunter said:

Yes I said earlier that I support him now. My fear is if it doesn’t work out and we can’t get rid of him because of all the IU homer’s . Then making the next hire even harder perception wise.

I support him too. I've moved past the disappointment to now being excited to see what he can do. I'm really excited for hopefully a more NBA-style offense with better tempo and more 3's, as well as the type of players he can attract with that style and his background. 

I am worried that if it doesn't work then the perception changes to "an IU guy couldn't even do it. No way I'm going there". 

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2 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

They may not know who he is now, but once he introduces himself and provides his background, the player almost has to listen a little harder.  It's not like Woodson is simply going to say 'I'm Mike Woodson.  Come to IU.  We missed the tournament last season and we need you.".  No.  He's going to say.  "i'm Mike Woodson, and let me tell you a little bit about myself."

I never said he wasn't going to introduce himself. I just said it remains to be seen if he can recruit. We don't know how well he'll do with that yet. I'm optimistic, but we won't know the answer for a little while because he doesn't have a track record to draw on. 

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23 minutes ago, BGleas said:

Been really busy so haven't posted since the weekend. That also gave me a chance to digest this a bit more after the initial disappointment. 

I still think this is a really risky move, and could potentially do more long term damage to the program if it doesn't work. I'm also still disappointed that after Stevens, IU didn't go big game hunting in the college ranks (Beard, Musselman, Drew, Oats, etc.), as I felt the move here was to get a coach with proven Power 5 experience. Think a Kelvin Sampson move but finally getting it right with a cleaner version. 

With that said and more time to hear Woodson speak, etc., I am more optimistic than I was before. I still think this is either a massive mistake or a genius move with little in between, but I do have a little more hope that it's genius, and here's why. 

I'm hoping this wasn't just a "we need an IU guy" move to bring in an old player and Woodson is the best they could find.

What I am hoping is that this was actually a strategic decision by Dolson to be at the forefront of a shift in college basketball. I'm hoping this was a strategic decision with the NIL coming to be ahead of the curve and turn IU basketball into almost an NBA training ground. To be a program that is player friendly and that the top players want to be.

I don't mean a one and done factory, I just mean to build the program as almost an NBA training ground. When you come to IU you have a head coach that ties the tradition of IU with the forward thinking ways of the NBA in terms of style of play, taking care of players, off the court preparation, etc. As consultants you have one of the best college basketball coaches of the last 15 years in Matta and potentially you have one of the top coaches in all of basketball in the last 30-40 years in Larry Brown. As some have said, almost like the Alabama of college basketball with Saban surrounding the program with former head coaches, etc. 

Right there you have three guys that are highly successful in the game of basketball at all levels and have been there and done that. Then you add things like the Cuban Center for Sports Media, hopefully a fantastic, forward thinking group of assistants, and this could be a genius move. 

My hope is that this was strategic beyond just "let's get an IU guy". I don't mean that as a negative necessarily, I'm just hoping there is potentially an even larger strategic plan in play here. 

 

Good post but really those college coaches have not been a D1 coach more than 6 years so it is not like they have a huge advantage.  I would think with you being part of an NBA team you would think that coaching in the NBA for 25 years would give you a lot more experience than in college.  Also Musselman started out in the NBA and he has proven you can go from that level and still do well at the college level.  Musselman record in the pros was not better than what Woodson was either.

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I hope Mike will bring a better style of offense than a lot of the college coaches were were looking at would have brought.  I see a lot of of bad offense or at least style of no movement and all guy trying to break down their defenders off the dribble.  Gonzaga is so fun to watch offensively because they have player and ball movement.

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6 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

Good post but really those college coaches have not been a D1 coach more than 6 years so it is not like they have a huge advantage.  I would think with you being part of an NBA team you would think that coaching in the NBA for 25 years would give you a lot more experience than in college.  Also Musselman started out in the NBA and he has proven you can go from that level and still do well at the college level.  Musselman record in the pros was not better than what Woodson was either.

Outside of Musselman, those guys came up in college basketball. They came up as assistants in the recruiting game, they've been around the college game for years, and they're proven commodities at the Power 5 level. 

Coaching in the NBA gives you a lot more experience in the NBA, it doesn't give you more experience than a coach that has been in college for over a decade. 

I think being an NBA guy gives you good chance to have an X's and O's advantage, and potentially an advantage in how players need to be treated, but there is so much more that goes into running a high level, elite program. 

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5 minutes ago, BGleas said:

I never said he wasn't going to introduce himself. I just said it remains to be seen if he can recruit. We don't know how well he'll do with that yet. I'm optimistic, but we won't know the answer for a little while because he doesn't have a track record to draw on. 

Agreed. My issue if I’m a recruit is I have nothing to work off of. He has no game tape with his system. No examples of how it will look with college players. Sure you can show Nba tape but that’s a big leap for kids to see how it would look with college talent. I mean it comes down to trust...do I trust this man with 4 years of my life and maybe my dreams of the nba. I think he is going to have to show something this year to get kids to buy in. If I’d say at least 1/3 of IU fans are questioning and unsure of him how many recruits would be. Kinda want to stick to a proven commodity. Many recruits talk about relationships developed over a few years of recruiting. Woodson has none of that. He has a lot of ground to make up. I think it’s critical to bring back a good portion of our team and maybe land a shooter and big in the portal if he is going to have a good shot to win early and show future kids what he can do with them.

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10 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

I hope Mike will bring a better style of offense than a lot of the college coaches were were looking at would have brought.  I see a lot of of bad offense or at least style of no movement and all guy trying to break down their defenders off the dribble.  Gonzaga is so fun to watch offensively because they have player and ball movement.

I totally agree with you.  I like ball movement with the pass.  I won’t be offended if we screen off the ball and each player takes shots that fit his skill set and not a random hodge podge of shots. What I don’t want is aimless dribbling. 

I also hope if something is not working, we recognize it and fix it quickly.  And we exploit matchups that work in our favor.  For example you can invert a guard with a big and let a guard with a size advantage go to work on a smaller guy, or a big could get in space on a slower, plodding guy.  

I would imagine Woody is an A plus on all that. Especially if Matta and/or Larry Brown are also around.  

Recruit well (guys that fit), be fundamentally sound (don’t beat yourself), teach roles, and do all that strategy above, and we will (a) get back on brand and (b) kick ass.  The formula isn’t super complicated. 

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5 minutes ago, BGleas said:

Outside of Musselman, those guys came up in college basketball. They came up as assistants in the recruiting game, they've been around the college game for years, and they're proven commodities at the Power 5 level. 

Coaching in the NBA gives you a lot more experience in the NBA, it doesn't give you more experience than a coach that has been in college for over a decade. 

I think being an NBA guy gives you good chance to have an X's and O's advantage, and potentially an advantage in how players need to be treated, but there is so much more that goes into running a high level, elite program. 

I think that jus ton the court stuff Woodson will be great and bring in Matta will help learning the other things of the college game.  Also hopefully at least 1 if not 2 of his assistants will have college experience.

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11 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

I hope Mike will bring a better style of offense than a lot of the college coaches were were looking at would have brought.  I see a lot of of bad offense or at least style of no movement and all guy trying to break down their defenders off the dribble.  Gonzaga is so fun to watch offensively because they have player and ball movement.

Completely agree. That is my hope too. I hope he can sell Lander, Franklin and Stewart on this especially, and then hit the transfer market and sell that to some legit wings that can score. 

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2 minutes ago, BobSaccamanno said:

 

I also hope if something is not working, we recognize it and fix it quickly.  And we exploit matchups that work in our favor.  For example you can invert a guard with a big and let a guy with a size advantage go to work on a smaller guy or a bigger hit could get in space on a bigger guy.  

 

Failing to recognize and exploit mismatches always bothered me. Seemed so obvious but all to often the players would continue running their set play and be oblivious to it

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Just now, BGleas said:

Completely agree. That is my hope too. I hope he can sell Lander, Franklin and Stewart on this especially, and then hit the transfer market and sell that to some legit wings that can score. 

I would hope all of them will come back and go get a 6'9 stretch 4 that can shoot from outside.  I also can see getting another quality PG as well that can shoot.

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4 minutes ago, dgambill said:

Agreed. My issue if I’m a recruit is I have nothing to work off of. He has no game tape with his system. No examples of how it will look with college players. Sure you can show Nba tape but that’s a big leap for kids to see how it would look with college talent. I mean it comes down to trust...do I trust this man with 4 years of my life and maybe my dreams of the nba. I think he is going to have to show something this year to get kids to buy in. If I’d say at least 1/3 of IU fans are questioning and unsure of him how many recruits would be. Kinda want to stick to a proven commodity. Many recruits talk about relationships developed over a few years of recruiting. Woodson has none of that. He has a lot of ground to make up. I think it’s critical to bring back a good portion of our team and maybe land a shooter and big in the portal if he is going to have a good shot to win early and show future kids what he can do with them.

This summer, it's not about '4 years'.  We got Duncomb and he's the only freshman we will have next season.  This summer is about getting those transfers, which is more critical than ever with the open transfer rule.  So, circling back to my point above.  If I'm a player who is projected late 2nd rounder and I have the opportunity to learn some stuff from an NBA coach by transferring to Indiana for a season, I might just listen to what he has to say.  If you talk to 3-4 of those guys, your chances of getting one are pretty good.  Someone is going to take the plunge.  

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