Coach Mike Woodson Megathread

[HoosierJax]

10 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

Has Archie been linked to ANY job opening yet?  

Last i heard he was on a private island drinking Pina Colada's  mumbling something about 10 million 

[BGleas]

1 minute ago, 5fouls said:

This summer, it's not about '4 years'.  We got Duncomb and he's the only freshman we will have next season.  This summer is about getting those transfers, which is more critical than ever with the open transfer rule.  So, circling back to my point above.  If I'm a player who is projected late 2nd rounder and I have the opportunity to learn some stuff from an NBA coach by transferring to Indiana for a season, I might just listen to what he has to say.  If you talk to 3-4 of those guys, your chances of getting one are pretty good.  Someone is going to take the plunge.  

Agree. I'd rather Woodson focus on the transfer portal to build a team for next year, while moving attention to the 2022 class for freshmen. 

He needs to bring in some ready to go men for next season. 

[dgambill]

1 hour ago, BobSaccamanno said:

That’s mesmerizing.  I love the IU fan base.  For anyone who’s become self loathing about IU basketball, that shows you who we can be.   

PS I assume the Fire Marshall looked the other way, lol.  The number of random, unaccounted humans sitting Indian style in random spots or standing around is mind boggling.   I will defend this fan base to death.  By the way, those were two stacked teams.  

I’d be interested in how many current IU players know who Woodson was when he was announced? This might play well in Indiana but how does it play in Texas...in Michigan...etc. Then take that to knowing the guy coached NBA and is the Indiana coach but what kind of system does he run...how to invision how I fit in it when he has no recent history of him coaching college kids. It’s a big difference then say what Holtmon...Painter...and Izzo will be able to do when going head to head for kids.

[IU Scott]

2 minutes ago, HoosierJax said:

Last i heard he was on a private island drinking Pina Colada's  mumbling something about 10 million 

[Seeking6]

2 hours ago, IUDan93 said:

You know, age doesn't matter as much as some are trying to make out. Many kids lean on grandparents all the time and appreciate their wisdom. Also, if we are worried that he can't coach for 20 years, but maybe for only another 10-12, well that will mean that he has been successful, because CAM only got 4 years and Crean 9.  I hope he does well enough to get an extension, because being young and having the potential for 20-25 years as coach didn't work out for Archie.  We need a coach that does well for the next 3-4 years, and than go from there.

I'll say the same thing as I've said in other threads. Saban is 69. He's the CEO and has surrounded himself with 7-8 staff members that bridge the past to present and has been doing that pretty well in my book....and has no signs of slowing down.

[IU Scott]

1 minute ago, dgambill said:

I’d be interested in how many current IU players know who Woodson was when he was announced? This might play well in Indiana but how does it play in Texas...in Michigan...etc. Then take that to knowing the guy coached NBA and is the Indiana coach but what kind of system does he run...how to invision how I fit in it when he has no recent history of him coaching college kids. It’s a big difference then say what Holtmon...Painter...and Izzo will be able to do when going head to head for kids.

Probably can say that about 90% of college coaches and Patrick Ewing was not recognized at Madison Square Garden where he played for years.

[IU Scott]

To me it looks like Dolson is trying to set up a front office for college like they do in the pros.

Matta- GM

Brown- Director of player Development if he comes

[dgambill]

Just now, IU Scott said:

To me it looks like Dolson is trying to set up a front office for college like they do in the pros.

Matta- GM

Brown- Director of player Development if he comes

And maybe that works...maybe that’s the key. In the end it’s going to come down to talent though. No matter how good he is can he get talent. Jimmy’s and joes etc

[ephul]

6 minutes ago, BGleas said:

I never said he wasn't going to introduce himself. I just said it remains to be seen if he can recruit. We don't know how well he'll do with that yet. I'm optimistic, but we won't know the answer for a little while because he doesn't have a track record to draw on. 

Responding to your longer, previous post (didn't want to quote it and eat up space), but I don't think the Woodson hire is really much riskier than taking an Oats, Musselman, Beard, or Drew. I dont think Beard was ever really an option, but with the other three, you could make an argument against any of them. Drew is dirty as hell. Oats has been good, but there's a lot of similarities between his rise and Archie's. Musselman seemed like the most realistic, but he's been a bit of a journeyman. Could he handle the pressure of IU? Is his end goal NBA? If he'd do a "meh" job at IU and leave for the NBA, how much worse off would we be?

We don't really know if Dolson made any calls to them or about them, but the complete failure of Archie has to put a little fear in hiring someone else that may or may not be ready for the limelight. It's hard to know the complete story of why he failed, what went on behind the scenes, etc but you draw some similarities between his rise and Oats, Musselman, Beard, etc.

Woodson does two things: brings excitement back to the IU family, and gives us a coach with massive NBA experience. Listening to Landon Turner talk about the hire was incredible. Having guys like that around the program again won't hurt.

I get Woodson hasn't coached a college game, hasn't recruited a kid, etc. Listening to guys like Fran Franschilla, I don't think Woody will struggle with the in game coaching. Fran basically said coaching in the NBA takes so much more than coaching college (I think it was Fran). Listening to people talk about Woodys player development and coaching styles/strategy, I don't see an issue with that aspect.

Recruiting I'm sure is everyone's biggest question mark, and I get it. People don't "remember" Woody. Ill say this... did people really know Archie when he took over at IU? Probably not until they looked him up or spoke with him... and if they looked up Woody, they'll find a hell of a lot more credential wise than Archie. Personality wise? Woody vs Miller? It's Woody and it's not even close. And Archie still got some recruits.

This is personal for Woody. The guy will do whatever it takes to get Indiana basketball rolling again. And he's got a lot of connections to help him along the way.

Listen, Woody may flop. But looking at the last 21 years, I wouldn't feel warm and fuzzy with any of the realistic candidates that we think were available.... and I think you're on to something with the NIL and what not. NBA connections are going to be as crucial as they've ever been. And Woody has them. If he can get off to a hot start, I have very little doubt he can keep thr momentum going.

[BGleas]

3 minutes ago, IU Scott said:

To me it looks like Dolson is trying to set up a front office for college like they do in the pros.

Matta- GM

Brown- Director of player Development if he comes

That's where I think this has the potential to be a really innovative move. I really like that aspect and hope it was a vision from Dolson all along. 

[rico]

4 minutes ago, dgambill said:

I’d be interested in how many current IU players know who Woodson was when he was announced? This might play well in Indiana but how does it play in Texas...in Michigan...etc. Then take that to knowing the guy coached NBA and is the Indiana coach but what kind of system does he run...how to invision how I fit in it when he has no recent history of him coaching college kids. It’s a big difference then say what Holtmon...Painter...and Izzo will be able to do when going head to head for kids.

An IU basketball player that has never heard of Mike Woodson is like a Notre Dame football player that has never heard of Tim Brown.

sort of...

[IU Scott]

14 minutes ago, dgambill said:

And maybe that works...maybe that’s the key. In the end it’s going to come down to talent though. No matter how good he is can he get talent. Jimmy’s and joes etc

How many recruits knew who Musselman and Oats were before they  got to Arkansas and Alabama,  Just look at most of the coaches in the elite 8 and probably 5 of them was  not that well known until they got their big opportunity,

OSU- Tinkle most probably did not know who he was 2 weeks ago

Gonzaga- Did anyone know who Mark Few was when he took this job

USC- Enfeld only had 1 great run in the tournament but was not well known.

UM- Howard they knew him from his playing days but no HC experience

UCLA-  Cronin he was a a good coach but how many recruits really knew who he was when he went to UCLA

Alabama- Oats been a HC coach in D1 4 years an no one  really knew who he was before this year.

Arkansas- Musselman been HC for 5 ears in D1 and how many recruits new him until 2 years ago

Baylor- Drew he is well known now but when he took over Baylor he had 1 year d1 coaching experience.

Edited March 31, 2021 by IU Scott

[BobSaccamanno]

I think Brown would also help with strategy. He will see things out there.  His knowledge of the game is amazing.  He was great for the Pacers with adjustments and player utilization.

If you land Brown, be prepared for effusive praise for IU and it’s stature from him.  This is a guy who knows basketball and context.  He knows what IU is.

If you land Brown with Matta, let there be no doubt we are a blueblood.  I’m sorry there’s no shot that those guys would go to Purdue lol.  No shot.  Nobody gives a crap about Purdue.  IU will stir massive interest for as long as any of us are around.  Purdue can fantasize all they want but they will never have that stature.  

Edited March 31, 2021 by BobSaccamanno

[HoosierJax]

2 minutes ago, ephul said:

Responding to your longer, previous post (didn't want to quote it and eat up space), but I don't think the Woodson hire is really much riskier than taking an Oats, Musselman, Beard, or Drew. I dont think Beard was ever really an option, but with the other three, you could make an argument against any of them. Drew is dirty as hell. Oats has been good, but there's a lot of similarities between his rise and Archie's. Musselman seemed like the most realistic, but he's been a bit of a journeyman. Could he handle the pressure of IU? Is his end goal NBA? If he'd do a "meh" job at IU and leave for the NBA, how much worse off would we be?

We don't really know if Dolson made any calls to them or about them, but the complete failure of Archie has to put a little fear in hiring someone else that may or may not be ready for the limelight. It's hard to know the complete story of why he failed, what went on behind the scenes, etc but you draw some similarities between his rise and Oats, Musselman, Beard, etc.

Woodson does two things: brings excitement back to the IU family, and gives us a coach with massive NBA experience. Listening to Landon Turner talk about the hire was incredible. Having guys like that around the program again won't hurt.

I get Woodson hasn't coached a college game, hasn't recruited a kid, etc. Listening to guys like Fran Franschilla, I don't think Woody will struggle with the in game coaching. Fran basically said coaching in the NBA takes so much more than coaching college (I think it was Fran). Listening to people talk about Woodys player development and coaching styles/strategy, I don't see an issue with that aspect.

Recruiting I'm sure is everyone's biggest question mark, and I get it. People don't "remember" Woody. Ill say this... did people really know Archie when he took over at IU? Probably not until they looked him up or spoke with him... and if they looked up Woody, they'll find a hell of a lot more credential wise than Archie. Personality wise? Woody vs Miller? It's Woody and it's not even close. And Archie still got some recruits.

This is personal for Woody. The guy will do whatever it takes to get Indiana basketball rolling again. And he's got a lot of connections to help him along the way.

Listen, Woody may flop. But looking at the last 21 years, I wouldn't feel warm and fuzzy with any of the realistic candidates that we think were available.... and I think you're on to something with the NIL and what not. NBA connections are going to be as crucial as they've ever been. And Woody has them. If he can get off to a hot start, I have very little doubt he can keep thr momentum going.

All Woody has to do is get his foot in the door of a recruit and talk about his NBA experience, his IU experience, tell a couple stories to parents ...explain his thoughts on offense/defense ,refer to his self in the third person and the commitments will start coming .

[rico]

3 minutes ago, BGleas said:

That's where I think this has the potential to be a really innovative move. I really like that aspect and hope it was a vision from Dolson all along. 

Innovative is a fabulous word for what has been going on...kudos.

[iucane]

17 minutes ago, HoosierJax said:

Last i heard he was on a private island drinking Pina Colada's  mumbling something about 10 million 

Heard him linked at UC

[dgambill]

15 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

This summer, it's not about '4 years'.  We got Duncomb and he's the only freshman we will have next season.  This summer is about getting those transfers, which is more critical than ever with the open transfer rule.  So, circling back to my point above.  If I'm a player who is projected late 2nd rounder and I have the opportunity to learn some stuff from an NBA coach by transferring to Indiana for a season, I might just listen to what he has to say.  If you talk to 3-4 of those guys, your chances of getting one are pretty good.  Someone is going to take the plunge.  

Again...comes back to his ability to convey and build trust. No one has seen what his offense will look like in a college setting. Will those nba sets work with college talent? You got guys with one year left to make it...do you trust an unproven commodity on the college level or do you trust Cal...do you trust Izzo...do you trust Drew guys that have proven to put guys into the nba and a proven system that works and has taken transfers before. Your right it only takes 1 or 2....I’m praying for good results....he needs to hit the ground running because just as easy as I can see it taking off...it could snowball into negativity too if he has a rough first year.

[5fouls]

SIAP.  Don Fischer interview with Coach Woodson.

https://www.facebook.com/IndianaMBB/videos/705205863481006/

 

Edited March 31, 2021 by 5fouls

[bluegrassIU]

2 minutes ago, rico said:

Innovative is a fabulous word for what has been going on...kudos.

Fabulous is an innovative way to describe the word innovative.

[IU Scott]

1 minute ago, iucane said:

Heard him linked at UC

Didn't realize they fired their coach

[BGleas]

4 minutes ago, ephul said:

Responding to your longer, previous post (didn't want to quote it and eat up space), but I don't think the Woodson hire is really much riskier than taking an Oats, Musselman, Beard, or Drew. I dont think Beard was ever really an option, but with the other three, you could make an argument against any of them. Drew is dirty as hell. Oats has been good, but there's a lot of similarities between his rise and Archie's. Musselman seemed like the most realistic, but he's been a bit of a journeyman. Could he handle the pressure of IU? Is his end goal NBA? If he'd do a "meh" job at IU and leave for the NBA, how much worse off would we be?

We don't really know if Dolson made any calls to them or about them, but the complete failure of Archie has to put a little fear in hiring someone else that may or may not be ready for the limelight. It's hard to know the complete story of why he failed, what went on behind the scenes, etc but you draw some similarities between his rise and Oats, Musselman, Beard, etc.

Woodson does two things: brings excitement back to the IU family, and gives us a coach with massive NBA experience. Listening to Landon Turner talk about the hire was incredible. Having guys like that around the program again won't hurt.

I get Woodson hasn't coached a college game, hasn't recruited a kid, etc. Listening to guys like Fran Franschilla, I don't think Woody will struggle with the in game coaching. Fran basically said coaching in the NBA takes so much more than coaching college (I think it was Fran). Listening to people talk about Woodys player development and coaching styles/strategy, I don't see an issue with that aspect.

Recruiting I'm sure is everyone's biggest question mark, and I get it. People don't "remember" Woody. Ill say this... did people really know Archie when he took over at IU? Probably not until they looked him up or spoke with him... and if they looked up Woody, they'll find a hell of a lot more credential wise than Archie. Personality wise? Woody vs Miller? It's Woody and it's not even close. And Archie still got some recruits.

This is personal for Woody. The guy will do whatever it takes to get Indiana basketball rolling again. And he's got a lot of connections to help him along the way.

Listen, Woody may flop. But looking at the last 21 years, I wouldn't feel warm and fuzzy with any of the realistic candidates that we think were available.... and I think you're on to something with the NIL and what not. NBA connections are going to be as crucial as they've ever been. And Woody has them. If he can get off to a hot start, I have very little doubt he can keep thr momentum going.

Appreciate your thoughts. There is a lot there, so I'm just going to respond to a few points quickly. 

On Archie, yes I do think high school players, high school coaches and AAU coaches knew who he was before he came to IU. Archie had spent over a decade recruiting and coaching in the ACC, Big Ten, Pac-12, A-10, etc. He was a known commodity on the recruiting trail. 

I think Woodson will do well on the court as well, he's clearly a strong basketball mind and I really like the NBA experience he brings to the game and the development on players. I think it remains to be seen how well he can recruit, his energy level for recruiting, and his energy for motivating college players (which is different than in the NBA). 

I love the Matta addition, potentially adding Larry Brown, as well as the staff he has the potential to bring in. I think this has the potential to be a grand slam, but it is riskier than bring in a proven Power 5 coach. Again, the key word is "proven". Not another Archie, but a coach that has a proven, successful track record at a Power 5 school. 

That would have been safer and potentially better. But, I am excited about the upside and the potential strategic approach of building an NBA-style organization at a college. I think that has the chance to be a genius move. 

[IU Scott]

1 minute ago, dgambill said:

Again...comes back to his ability to convey and build trust. No one has seen what his offense will look like in a college setting. Will those nba sets work with college talent? You got guys with one year left to make it...do you trust an unproven commodity on the college level or do you trust Cal...do you trust Izzo...do you trust Drew guys that have proven to put guys into the nba and a proven system that works and has taken transfers before. Your right it only takes 1 or 2....I’m praying for good results....he needs to hit the ground running because just as easy as I can see it taking off...it could snowball into negativity too if he has a rough first year.

Most college offense are based off of the NBA sets

[Max]

@ephul great post. Completely agree with you. Same with you @IU Scott
 

Been laughing off the whole “can he recruit” question. Also have been thinking about musselman. 
 

Honestly, I’d bet on Woodson going into a recruit’s home and landing the kid vs many if not all of the guys we were looking at. Musselman, drew, oats? Sure I’m drinking the kool aid but in all serious, I’d challenge everyone to look at this decision closely and ask if these other supposed candidates(drew/muss/beard/Altman) are really THAT much better than Woodson?

When it comes down to it I think we did pretty damn well and I’d take Woodson over musselman/beard. (Seemed like the most realistic candidates for us to land, oats buyout too large and Altman is comfy in Nike land and kinda dirty)

It’s pretty funny that we’re comparing him against these guys that really have NOT accomplished that much at ANY lev period. Not at a big program. And if they did, it was once and inconsistent.

Edited March 31, 2021 by Max

[John S]

1 hour ago, BobSaccamanno said:

That’s mesmerizing.  I love the IU fan base.  For anyone who’s become self loathing about IU basketball, that shows you who we can be.   

PS I assume the Fire Marshall looked the other way, lol.  The number of random, unaccounted humans sitting Indian style in random spots or standing around is mind boggling.   I will defend this fan base to death.  By the way, those were two stacked teams.  

Awesome to remember.  And, they could sink their FTs back then.  

[dgambill]

8 minutes ago, rico said:

An IU basketball player that has never heard of Mike Woodson is like a Notre Dame football player that has never heard of Tim Brown.

sort of...

I’d bet there might be more than a couple. Just my guess. I know IU fans that didn’t know him. A lot of kids came to play for Archie. I don’t think it’s a secret that history is not a strength of today’s youth.