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Miller Kopp to IU


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1 minute ago, btownqb said:

I didn't mean it like its the end all be all stat. I was just saying... that's a really consistent stretch for him. 14 of 15 and I think like 17 of 19. We haven't had too many players that consistent recently. 

That's a great stretch.  In your op that started my confusion, I didn't see the little word "in" his sophomore season.  I reread it and see how you were presenting it now.  

I was stuck on thinking you were saying he played 15 games total.  Then got even more confused when you doubled down and sent me the same stat page I was already looking at lol.  

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9 hours ago, IU_Realist said:

Difference is usage and where he plays. I don’t think Kopp is going to be running around doing what he did at NW. Watch some videos.  Don’t think he will be running around shooting to shoot.  He is more a four than a two or three no matter what people are saying.  

I’m not sure... In this highlight video, it doesn’t seem like he was playing at the 4 much for Northwestern last year.  Also looks a fair bit smaller than the 6’7 he’s listed at.  Looks like more of a wing/3 to me.

Ironically given our discussion here, Kopp makes Hunter look silly at the 1:55 mark of the video.

 

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3 minutes ago, FW_Hoosier said:

I’m not sure... In this highlight video, it doesn’t seem like he was playing at the 4 much for Northwestern last year.  Also looks a fair bit smaller than the 6’7 he’s listed at.  Looks like more of a wing/3 to me.

Ironically given our discussion here, Kopp makes Hunter look silly at the 1:55 mark of the video.

 

What I am saying is he isn’t that and wasn’t used right at NW.  I don’t think he is a 2. I don’t think he is a 3.  I am a big believer in you are who you guard.  I think he is a stretch four at the college level and that is what he should play at.  He was used differently than what I hope he is used here for.  I don’t want him taking the same shots.  I want him taking fast break threes, corner threes and any other jumper.  I don’t want plays specifically ran for him.  I want him to be a complimentary piece when teams react.  Utilization should be different than how he was used there.  

Edited by IU_Realist
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2 minutes ago, NotIThatLives said:

That's a great stretch.  In your op that started my confusion, I didn't see the little word "in" his sophomore season.  I reread it and see how you were presenting it now.  

I was stuck on thinking you were saying he played 15 games total.  Then got even more confused when you doubled down and sent me the same stat page I was already looking at lol.  

I assumed you were confused by the way you were grouping that column. My bad. 

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5 minutes ago, btownqb said:

But where have we seen that to say that? All I'm asking. I have not seen that. 

I'm just saying that Hunter has had stretches where he's shown that he is a good player with nice athleticism; he just needs to be more consistent. You don't agree with that? Are you saying that he's bad or below average?

Perhaps a more 'care-free' offense will pull this out of him. Constantly having to slow it down/wait for a shot later in the possession seemed to go against his natural instincts. At least that's how it seemed to me. 

I do agree with you that Kopp is the better player right now if we're pitting them up against each other, but I still think Jerome has a higher ceiling. If CAM stayed, Jerome would be that player that I could see transferring to another school and being a major contributor (ala Justin Smith). I really think he has it in him and I think competing against Kopp will be really good for him. 

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4 minutes ago, tdhoosier said:

I'm just saying that Hunter has had stretches where he's shown that he is a good player with nice athleticism; he just needs to be more consistent. You don't agree with that? Are you saying that he's bad or below average?

Perhaps a more 'care-free' offense will pull this out of him. Constantly having to slow it down/wait for a shot later in the possession seemed to go against his natural instincts. At least that's how it seemed to me. 

I do agree with you that Kopp is the better player right now if we're pitting them up against each other, but I still think Jerome has a higher ceiling. If CAM stayed, Jerome would be that player that I could see transferring to another school and being a major contributor (ala Justin Smith). I really think he has it in him and I think competing against Kopp will be really good for him. 

I do think he is below average. I agree a more open style should benefit him. Very happy to have both though.. technically Hunter still has 3 years of eligibility. 

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1 hour ago, IUFLA said:

His sophomore season you might have been able to make that case, but last year? I'm not sure how many Northwestern games you watched last year (I watched probably 12-15), but he had more bad games than he had good...No way he was one of the best players in the B1G...

And, as I said, maybe the offensive woes had to do with the hand...and as @ledies22 mentioned, he's not even a good rebounder or defender...

I didn't say he was one of the best players in the Big Ten...

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1 hour ago, ledies22 said:

This is the third time someone is arguing a point that i never made. I never said that leal or galloway were better than Kopp. and i said overall Kopp was probably a lateral move for Hunter if you we were to compare them at the 4. 

I dont want to give up leal or galloway for someone who has 2 less years of eligibility that is going to come in as a role player. I guess i dont know everyone else's expectations. I see Kopp playing +/- 10 minutes a game averaging 6 points. 

I guess i have a little more sentiment for Hunter than others do. For someone who came in a year early to red shirt, then get hurt. on the bench for 2+ seasons before seeing the court and gutting it out in an IU uniform. 

To say Kopp has been one of the best B1G players last few seasons? I dont recall seeing his name on the award lists. not first team. not second team. not third team. not even honorable mention. according to the media and coaches of the B1G Kopp isnt even a top 25 player in the B1G.

I like Hunter a lot, but there's no data to show he can be a consistent Big Ten starter. 

Your entire sob story about Jerome is Race's story, not Jerome's. 

I never said he is a top player on the Big Ten, I said he was one of the best players on a Big Ten team. Are you saying he wasn't one of the best players on Northwestern?

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4 minutes ago, KoB2011 said:

I didn't say he was one of the best players in the Big Ten...

As you said, he was a good player and he did a lot of little things on the court.  Coach Woodson watched a ton of film on him and sees someone that is going to help.  NW had an interesting team last year and Miller is going to benifit by the new style and the athleticism around him.  With that being said, he is a good athlete who is getting better.  

Hope he is going to surprise some.

 

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One thing about Hunter that I noticed in my (admittedly) limited viewing of games last year: he has a little bit of 'dawg' in him, which I love. He had moments where he would get into people's faces and protect his teammates. I want more of that.

Being comfortable will bring confidence, and I think that's where Hunter has been lacking. He's a bit streaky, and CAM's irregular and self-inflicting substitution patterns did nothing to help Jerome get into a rhythm and play with a cockiness that probably benefits him more than any other player on the roster.

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Before the last three games of the season... Kopp was 31/82 from 3. 37.8%

He shot horribly the last 3 games.. including an 0-8 performance and a 1-6 performance. Certainly something to take with a grain of salt, but worth noting. 

Edited by btownqb
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3 minutes ago, btownqb said:

Before the last three games on the season... Kopp was 31/82 from 3. 37.8%

He shot horribly the last 3 games.. including an 0-8 performance and a 1-6 performance. Certainly something to take with a grain of salt, but worth noting. 

@IUFLA flashed a photo of Kopp with what looked like a splint on his off hand.  I don’t recall the exact timing but it might have wreaked havoc on his shooting.  That off hand is important to stabilizing your shot as well all know.  

Edited by BobSaccamanno
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Did I just dream about the last 4-6 years of IU basketball where we lamented on game days about not having enough shooters?? So we add one of the better shooters in the league to our team (a career 85% free throw shooter by the way!) and we complain?? If you take his career numbers we have no wings on our team shoot that...and last year was a down year for him because he got in a horrible slump and tried to shoot his way out of it on a bad team. Instead of getting him good/easy looks he was forced to take even more contested shots to try to bring his team back. If you look at the year before in a healthier situation he was a 40% shooter. Kid also likes shooting at AH.... scored 13 on 5-6 shooting with 3-4 threes last year, 12 pts on 3-4 from three sophomore year, and 6pts with 1-2 from three as a freshman....kid likes the sight lines at AH. Like some have stated. He isn't the end all savior of this team...but step back and look at the role this kid will be asked to play with guards like Johnson, Stewart, Bates, Lander, and Rob creating for him. It's about the sum of the parts here guys. There is a painting being done here and I like what he brings...even if he won't be the best player in the portal...he gives us much needed depth to back up or start for a guy that has been inconsistent at IU in Jerome Hunter. I'm glad to have depth...and very glad to have shooting options...and super happy to have an 85-90% free throw shooter!!!

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1 hour ago, ledies22 said:

That's fair. I mean i guess im a little eh on this. Kinda like you were with the coaching hire. Thought we could get someone better maybe? Im willing to eat crow on this.

Im fairly confident he reclassified and came a year early to redshirt. I could be wrong. 

I say this with all respect because I enjoy your posts and think you bring good insight.  But aren’t you the one who was saying the board had a bunch of “old guys” who got too negative?  

Now for some reason you want to die on this hill of negativity?  

Come on, Kopp is a good addition.  And the best part is we are no longer a program that’s going to sit around hoping guys get better.  We are going to get competition at all times.  That’s the way it should be.  We’ve gotten way too patient.   I’ve said since the day Woody started that I liked the urgency to win every year and not wait for guys to bloom.  We’ve wasted way too many years.  That may be over now.  
 

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15 minutes ago, MoyeCowbell said:

One thing about Hunter that I noticed in my (admittedly) limited viewing of games last year: he has a little bit of 'dawg' in him, which I love. He had moments where he would get into people's faces and protect his teammates. I want more of that.

Being comfortable will bring confidence, and I think that's where Hunter has been lacking. He's a bit streaky, and CAM's irregular and self-inflicting substitution patterns did nothing to help Jerome get into a rhythm and play with a cockiness that probably benefits him more than any other player on the roster.

Remove the last 6 games from last year because the whole of IU was poo poo. JH shot 21/51 (41%) from 3. Last 6 he was 4/22

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3 minutes ago, BobSaccamanno said:

@IUFLA flashed a photo of Kopp with what looked like a splint on his off hand.  I don’t recall the exact timing but it might have wreaked havoc on his shooting.  That off hand is important to stabilizing your shot as well all know.  

It can also make it uncomfortable to put the ball on the floor limiting your shot selection forcing you to settle for catch and shoot type attempts. Not sure if it played a part but I will trust this....Hunter and Fife both game planned for Kopp last year....both know what he is capable of and where his strengths lie. Woody wouldn't have signed on without a vision for him....Kopp has satisfied our coaches...why not us??

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1 minute ago, BobSaccamanno said:

I say this with all respect because I enjoy your posts and think you bring good insight.  But aren’t you the one who was saying the board had a bunch of “old guys” who got too negative?  

Now for some reason you want to die on this hill of negativity?  

Come on, Kopp is a good addition.  And the best part is we are no longer a program that’s going to sit around hoping guys get better.  We are going to get competition at all times.  That’s the way it should be.  We’ve gotten way too patient.   I’ve said since the day Woody started that I liked the urgency to win every year and not wait for guys to bloom.  We’ve wasted way too many years.  That may be over now.  
 

lol i might have said that. 

But i am not necessarily being negative. I dont hate this move. I just cant help to think there is someone better out there to fill the last spot. Im probably wrong. I was just hoping for a clear cut starter to fill the last spot. 

This would be a FANTASTIC get for Archie. With the last month maybe i am spoiled with the results, but i think with what the coaching staff has done thus far, there are bigger fish to fry.

Again i mentioned it twice. The coaching staff hasnt done anything up to this point for me to question them. They know what they want. they know what they are doing. 

Just was throwing this out there to ease my concerns and see if anyone else had the same opinion.

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13 minutes ago, dgambill said:

Did I just dream about the last 4-6 years of IU basketball where we lamented on game days about not having enough shooters?? So we add one of the better shooters in the league to our team (a career 85% free throw shooter by the way!) and we complain?? If you take his career numbers we have no wings on our team shoot that...and last year was a down year for him because he got in a horrible slump and tried to shoot his way out of it on a bad team. Instead of getting him good/easy looks he was forced to take even more contested shots to try to bring his team back. If you look at the year before in a healthier situation he was a 40% shooter. Kid also likes shooting at AH.... scored 13 on 5-6 shooting with 3-4 threes last year, 12 pts on 3-4 from three sophomore year, and 6pts with 1-2 from three as a freshman....kid likes the sight lines at AH. Like some have stated. He isn't the end all savior of this team...but step back and look at the role this kid will be asked to play with guards like Johnson, Stewart, Bates, Lander, and Rob creating for him. It's about the sum of the parts here guys. There is a painting being done here and I like what he brings...even if he won't be the best player in the portal...he gives us much needed depth to back up or start for a guy that has been inconsistent at IU in Jerome Hunter. I'm glad to have depth...and very glad to have shooting options...and super happy to have an 85-90% free throw shooter!!!

I have no issues with adding Kopp, but shooting isn't everything in this situation - Todd Leary could shoot but there were legit reasons why he didn't play much. There are some concerns about what else Kopp brings to the table, and he gets to the line less than 3x/game on a team where he was a primary scorer so, while it's great that he shoots a high percentage when he gets there, he just doesn't get there that frequently.

I do like having the option of him combined with JH - they have different skill sets and abilities that will allow us to match up with different lineups, or to create match up problems for opponents. 

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2 minutes ago, ledies22 said:

lol i might have said that. 

But i am not necessarily being negative. I dont hate this move. I just cant help to think there is someone better out there to fill the last spot. Im probably wrong. I was just hoping for a clear cut starter to fill the last spot. 

This would be a FANTASTIC get for Archie. With the last month maybe i am spoiled with the results, but i think with what the coaching staff has done thus far, there are bigger fish to fry.

Again i mentioned it twice. The coaching staff hasnt done anything up to this point for me to question them. They know what they want. they know what they are doing. 

Just was throwing this out there to ease my concerns and see if anyone else had the same opinion.

I am so high on it because on paper it seems like a perfect fit. After XJ committed and some of the dust settled... I said in PMs we needed a Zeisloft and Hartman to fill out this roster. We got Bates and Kopp.. I'm thrilled. I don't think a Tre Mitchell type player was really an option for this spot, I really don't. There are only some many balls to go around and we have 3 guys on our roster have averaged over 14ppg at the college level and will demand shots. We should have excellent spacing, we should be able to play at a tremendous pace, as well.. which I think is underrated. 

Do I think Miller Kopp is all world, absolutely not.. but he fits a need big time. I will honestly be very, very surprised if he doesn't shoot 38% from 3 or higher because of the quality of shot he is going to get. 

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16 minutes ago, dgambill said:

Did I just dream about the last 4-6 years of IU basketball where we lamented on game days about not having enough shooters?? So we add one of the better shooters in the league to our team (a career 85% free throw shooter by the way!) and we complain?? If you take his career numbers we have no wings on our team shoot that...and last year was a down year for him because he got in a horrible slump and tried to shoot his way out of it on a bad team. Instead of getting him good/easy looks he was forced to take even more contested shots to try to bring his team back. If you look at the year before in a healthier situation he was a 40% shooter. Kid also likes shooting at AH.... scored 13 on 5-6 shooting with 3-4 threes last year, 12 pts on 3-4 from three sophomore year, and 6pts with 1-2 from three as a freshman....kid likes the sight lines at AH. Like some have stated. He isn't the end all savior of this team...but step back and look at the role this kid will be asked to play with guards like Johnson, Stewart, Bates, Lander, and Rob creating for him. It's about the sum of the parts here guys. There is a painting being done here and I like what he brings...even if he won't be the best player in the portal...he gives us much needed depth to back up or start for a guy that has been inconsistent at IU in Jerome Hunter. I'm glad to have depth...and very glad to have shooting options...and super happy to have an 85-90% free throw shooter!!!

Well said, we had guys not shoot 85% on uncontested layups. Great discussion to be had and I feel that this offseason has really helped with us in the apathetic crowd

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