Olympics

[kyhoosier29]

3 hours ago, bluegrassIU said:

Poor performance is way out of context. She was the top performer in the world on day 1.

Hard to describe that as poor.

In comparison no, but for her it was described as poor. I didn’t see it, and, to be quite honest, don’t really care either way, but there was a lot of talk about it being poor. Appears as if people were talking in comparison to her typical. 

[Drroogh]

Don’t underestimate the potential injury issue either. I know if I jumped off a wall from 20’ in the air and stuck the landing I would be going to the hospital. If she’s not sticking her landings with all she is doing I’d be concerned also!

[BGleas]

Biles just announced she is also not participating in the individual all-around. 

[ephul]

11 hours ago, BGleas said:

I'm watching the gymnastics right now, and this honestly might be the weirdest thing I've ever seen at a sporting event. 

It was weird how she left after actually competing and then weird how she came back and stayed in the arena. Not criticizing, just saying it was a really odd scene. 

I don't know that the starting pitcher telling the skipper he's done is a good analogy. This is more like if LeBron James opted out of Game 7 of the NBA Finals after a poor first quarter. 

What disappoints me with the whole Simone thing is calling yourself the "GOAT", having a literal Goat embroidered in your shirt, etc. and then saying it's a mental thing.

You added pressure and attention to yourself by doing so. She certainly can't avoid all attention and pressure; I get it comes with being one of the best athletes in the world. But adding to it by claiming yourself to be the GOAT? 

At the end of the day, she's a talented, decorated athlete for Team USA. She has to do what's best for herself. I wish nothing but the best. But if you're going to call yourself the GOAT, it's going to come at a cost.

[Artesian_86]

6 minutes ago, ephul said:

What disappoints me with the whole Simone thing is calling yourself the "GOAT", having a literal Goat embroidered in your shirt, etc. and then saying it's a mental thing.

You added pressure and attention to yourself by doing so. She certainly can't avoid all attention and pressure; I get it comes with being one of the best athletes in the world. But adding to it by claiming yourself to be the GOAT? 

At the end of the day, she's a talented, decorated athlete for Team USA. She has to do what's best for herself. I wish nothing but the best. But if you're going to call yourself the GOAT, it's going to come at a cost.

….Very well written and you took the words right out of my mouth. 
In my opinion, being labeled “G.O.A.T.” is earned and acquired in the rarest of company. 
IMO, saying you’re the “GOAT” only means you’re trying to convince others you are. A true, “GOAT” labeled athlete is always humble and often turns attention away from themselves.

[NotIThatLives]

5 minutes ago, Artesian_86 said:

….Very well written and you took the words right out of my mouth. 
In my opinion, being labeled “G.O.A.T.” is earned and acquired in the rarest of company. 
IMO, saying you’re the “GOAT” only means you’re trying to convince others you are. A true, “GOAT” labeled athlete is always humble and often turns attention away from themselves.

Like I said yesterday, her head finally popped.  She is unarguably the best gymnast ever but you wait until your career is over.  The rhinestone goat was a curse.  

[Artesian_86]

Just now, NotIThatLives said:

Like I said yesterday, her head finally popped.  She is unarguably the best gymnast ever but you wait until your career is over.  The rhinestone goat was a curse.  

That’s what I was getting at…… Stay humble and you will be evaluated when your career is over.

[rico]

1 hour ago, BGleas said:

Biles just announced she is also not participating in the individual all-around. 

Heard that this morning...I expected it.  Hope and pray she gets it all worked out.

[13th&Jackson]

1 hour ago, Artesian_86 said:

That’s what I was getting at…… Stay humble and you will be evaluated when your career is over.

It's all in how you use it. Muhammed Ali created a persona of being "The Greatest". He used it to become a global phenomenon and to intimidate opponents. But he truly believed it and backed it up. 

My suspicion is that Simone and her handlers were setting things up for a GOAT logo apparel line post-olympics, but it all blew up 

 

Edited July 28, 2021 by 13th&Jackson

[dgambill]

14 hours ago, Steubenhoosier said:

Someone commented that in the qualifying round she had a “poor performance.” For her standards it was poor. But she still outperformed every other athlete in the competition 

She was actually in second place at least in the floor exercise in the prelims when I watched. She was not at her best. She was very much still capable of winning with much less then her best. I really feel for her that the moment became to big for her.

 

I've seen first hand how severe anxiety can effect someone. It was clear she was struggling and it was having an effect on her performance. At the rate she was going I think it was safe to say it was going to effect the outcome of her performance and likely was going to cost her the gold unless she was to find a way to overcome the mental side. Perhaps she could have lowered the difficulty in her routines and still won as she does perform very high difficulty routines. So instead of take the chance of losing she dropped out. It's really sad and I feel for her. I honestly worry about her long term mental health of not finishing....not competing and letting the chips fall where they may. She will have to live a life knowing she was physically capable of just laying it all out there and even if she wasn't at her best win, lose, or draw finishing the race (event) and being proud of competing and completing the event. There is a lot to be said for those that know they aren't at their best and still fighting it out to finish even when they know they might not win. Not to fear losing. Sure she did what was expediently best in her mind in stopping and not finishing...but long term...how will giving up and living with the regret that she let her emotions get the best of her and ruined her last shot at her dreams. I think one can make a case that it could be better for her mental health to finish the fight and know she did not let her emotions get the best of her and overcame adversity as opposed to giving in. As far as Simone goes I haven't seen any ill will or any negativity thrown at her.....but that said I don't think she is a "hero" either the way many in the media are trying to paint this. I think people can separate the issues of what has happened and discuss both sides of the arguement for the good and the bad of her decision without either necessarily being wrong. The situation is infinitely complex and can have both good and bad implications to either decision. I would say though that creating narratives on either side that mental health isn't important or isn't a problem in our society is pretty bad to say and that we should care and support those but it is equally a problem to praise and make virtuous the idea that it should be applauded to quit if you are under extreme stress or face intense adversity and to walk away. 

I really wish she would have competed in the all-around individuals. To me it is very important to face adversity head on. Conquer you fear and prove to yourself that no matter the outcome you won't let it get the best of you. I think not only for herself it would have been good but also to all those others out there that face mental challenges that sometimes winning and losing is secondary to overcoming fear. I know that probably for optics and a lot of other reasons that may not have been possible but I think it would be beneficial to her and to those out there inspirationally that look up to her to see her finish her competition.

[Steubenhoosier]

4 minutes ago, dgambill said:

She was actually in second place at least in the floor exercise in the prelims when I watched. She was not at her best. She was very much still capable of winning with much less then her best. I really feel for her that the moment became to big for her.

 

I've seen first hand how severe anxiety can effect someone. It was clear she was struggling and it was having an effect on her performance. At the rate she was going I think it was safe to say it was going to effect the outcome of her performance and likely was going to cost her the gold unless she was to find a way to overcome the mental side. Perhaps she could have lowered the difficulty in her routines and still won as she does perform very high difficulty routines. So instead of take the chance of losing she dropped out. It's really sad and I feel for her. I honestly worry about her long term mental health of not finishing....not competing and letting the chips fall where they may. She will have to live a life knowing she was physically capable of just laying it all out there and even if she wasn't at her best win, lose, or draw finishing the race (event) and being proud of competing and completing the event. There is a lot to be said for those that know they aren't at their best and still fighting it out to finish even when they know they might not win. Not to fear losing. Sure she did what was expediently best in her mind in stopping and not finishing...but long term...how will giving up and living with the regret that she let her emotions get the best of her and ruined her last shot at her dreams. I think one can make a case that it could be better for her mental health to finish the fight and know she did not let her emotions get the best of her and overcame adversity as opposed to giving in. As far as Simone goes I haven't seen any ill will or any negativity thrown at her.....but that said I don't think she is a "hero" either the way many in the media are trying to paint this. I think people can separate the issues of what has happened and discuss both sides of the arguement for the good and the bad of her decision without either necessarily being wrong. The situation is infinitely complex and can have both good and bad implications to either decision. I would say though that creating narratives on either side that mental health isn't important or isn't a problem in our society is pretty bad to say and that we should care and support those but it is equally a problem to praise and make virtuous the idea that it should be applauded to quit if you are under extreme stress or face intense adversity and to walk away. 

I really wish she would have competed in the all-around individuals. To me it is very important to face adversity head on. Conquer you fear and prove to yourself that no matter the outcome you won't let it get the best of you. I think not only for herself it would have been good but also to all those others out there that face mental challenges that sometimes winning and losing is secondary to overcoming fear. I know that probably for optics and a lot of other reasons that may not have been possible but I think it would be beneficial to her and to those out there inspirationally that look up to her to see her finish her competition.

I agree with the idea of fighting to overcome your fears. Every person, athlete or not needs to stand up to adversity and face it head on.

In saying that, the routines and moves that she performs are at such a high level of difficulty, that undoubtedly she endangers her health each time she steps onto the mat. If her head was not right, she put herself at risk of doing physical harm to herself, quite possibly significant and serious harm. If she was doubting herself and her capabilities at that point, soaring 15-20 feet above the mat on the uneven bars, or trying to land a vault could have resulted in a major injury. Without getting into the whole GOAT thing, she has accomplished pretty much all there is to accomplish in the sport. Risking serious injury may not have been worth it to her.

[ephul]

41 minutes ago, 13th&Jackson said:

It's all in how you use it. Muhammed Ali created a persona of being "The Greatest". He used it to become a global phenomenon and to intimidate opponents. But he truly believed it and backed it up. 

My suspicion is that Simone and her handlers were setting things up for a GOAT logo apparel line post-olympics, but it all blew up 

 

No doubt it was an attempt to pump up her brand. I don't blame her, all the greats do/did it. Air Jordan's, TB12, endorsement deals, etc.

But it comes at a price. And I'm sure the handlers were looking more for the $$$ and not her mental well being.

[dgambill]

14 hours ago, dbmhoosier said:

She's officially in the Scottie Pippen category to me.

Not sure that is the best analogy. Scottie Pippen was just selfish and wanted the glory and if he couldn't have the shot he didn't care about his teammates. Simone simply broke under the pressure. I'm sure there are other people that can be compared and would make a better analogy. She might have even been the better teammate by quiting and giving someone else a better chance to help her team win (they did get the silver and I thought the girl that stepped in did fabulous). To me she just couldn't overcome the stress and pressure of the situation and knowing she wasn't at her best.

[dgambill]

19 minutes ago, Steubenhoosier said:

I agree with the idea of fighting to overcome your fears. Every person, athlete or not needs to stand up to adversity and face it head on.

In saying that, the routines and moves that she performs are at such a high level of difficulty, that undoubtedly she endangers her health each time she steps onto the mat. If her head was not right, she put herself at risk of doing physical harm to herself, quite possibly significant and serious harm. If she was doubting herself and her capabilities at that point, soaring 15-20 feet above the mat on the uneven bars, or trying to land a vault could have resulted in a major injury. Without getting into the whole GOAT thing, she has accomplished pretty much all there is to accomplish in the sport. Risking serious injury may not have been worth it to her.

Possibly. The body will protect itself. Just like in her vault she was able to adjust midair and still land a much less difficult move. Which is why perhaps she might should have modified her routine. Adjusted to some lesser difficulty tumbles etc. Heck she probably could still have a shot to win even. If she is in there afraid she is going to hurt herself well that is something way well and beyond perhaps what I was seeing and how she was presenting it in the media when answering questions. It came off very much that I just didn't have it. I feared messing up and it was causing me to not perform well. So I quit. Would it might cost her a gold medal...very likely. In the team competition I could see she was in fear of letting them down because of her own limitations. It's why I think however she shouldn't pull out of the individuals even if it means running very simplistic (for her) routines and finishing. The pressure of being the best and winning is what got to her...but by allowing herself to take the pressure off and finish she could have come out the other side proud of overcoming and at the same time perhaps be seen as a bigger winner for showing even if you know you may lose, to fight and overcome fear can be the greatest personal accomplishment. Anyways...I guess I was getting at is doing what is expediately beneficial to your mental health doesn't mean you aren't causing long term consequences to your mental health. In reality...it is extremely possible that she just added to her long term mental health problems by not facing the short term problem/situation that is causing her distress.

Edited July 28, 2021 by dgambill

[TheWatShot]

I know the rules of the game are different, but how did we not even get a 3x3 men's basketball team into the Olympics? 

Edited July 28, 2021 by TheWatShot

[dgambill]

3 minutes ago, TheWatShot said:

I know the rules of the game are different, but how did we not even get a 3x3 men's basketball team into the Olympics? 

We were led by a Purdue grad and we failed to qualify....no I like Robbie but come on...how could we not put together a better team than that?? Just take the winning team from Ice Cube's league at worst lol.

Just also for reference the women team didn't make the medal rounds either....pretty sad we havent' taken it more serious. I should get my old Gus Macker team together from 97!

Edited July 28, 2021 by dgambill

[IUskim]

3 minutes ago, TheWatShot said:

I know the rules of the game are different, but how did we not even get a 3x3 men's basketball team into the Olympics? 

Because this is the roster we had for that. 
 

https://www.usab.com/3x3/3x3-national-teams-men/roster.aspx

[Hoosierfan1901]

Florida(6) and IU(6) lead in medals amongst colleges 

[TheWatShot]

12 minutes ago, dgambill said:

We were led by a Purdue grad and we failed to qualify....no I like Robbie but come on...how could we not put together a better team than that?? Just take the winning team from Ice Cube's league at worst lol.

Just also for reference the women team didn't make the medal rounds either....pretty sad we havent' taken it more serious. I should get my old Gus Macker team together from 97!

The women's team won gold in the event. It's why I wondered about the absence of a men's team. 

[tdhoosier]

6 minutes ago, Steubenhoosier said:

I agree with the idea of fighting to overcome your fears. Every person, athlete or not needs to stand up to adversity and face it head on.

In saying that, the routines and moves that she performs are at such a high level of difficulty, that undoubtedly she endangers her health each time she steps onto the mat. If her head was not right, she put herself at risk of doing physical harm to herself, quite possibly significant and serious harm. If she was doubting herself and her capabilities at that point, soaring 15-20 feet above the mat on the uneven bars, or trying to land a vault could have resulted in a major injury. Without getting into the whole GOAT thing, she has accomplished pretty much all there is to accomplish in the sport. Risking serious injury may not have been worth it to her.

Exactly.

While registering for high school my Freshman year for a gym I could take regular PE and run all hour or power gymnastics. It was an easy decision because I hate running - I loved the class and ended up competing for all 4 years. And it was great cross-training for my main sport, which was swimming. 

That said, the sport scared the s*** out of me. When you're doing giants around the high bar you can do a number of things: ping (slip off), release the bar a split second too early which will cause you to go right into the ground, release the bar too late and over-rotate, etc. My senior year, i'd do this thing on the high bar where you'd roll both of your hands into an eagle grip at the top of a giant. One time in practice slipped off and had a scary fall. I didn't even hurt myself, but couldn't do that move  again...ever. I was petrified of releasing the bar. Of course, i'm the furthest thing from an olympic caliber athlete and am a wimp, but getting the yips is no joke. The best gymnasts are fearless. The second fear creeps in...you're done. I assure you that every high level gymnast shares the same loose screw as the slot receivers who run routes through the middle of the field knowing they are going to get smashed when they catch the ball. The second they develop t-rex arms their effectiveness takes a hit. 

This is not like Scottie Pippen benching himself over a financial dispute. Based on Biles' previous interviews, it seeming like the yips have been slipping in as she's gotten older. If one thinks that diminishes her legacy that's fine, but she's gotta do what she's gotta do. I personally am not holding it against her. 

 

[dgambill]

36 minutes ago, TheWatShot said:

The women's team won gold in the event. It's why I wondered about the absence of a men's team. 

Oh...I saw they lost the other day so I thought they were out. Nevermind!

[IUALUM03]

Let's not minimize the toll this is taking on all athletes without their full support system there and being a year later than their schedule had built them up to.  I would argue Lily King would have been still at her peak last year, but the extra year put her out of her window.  The teenage phenom from Alaska wouldn't have even qualified had the Olympics happened last year.

Also, I would add Biles has dealt with her brother being at trial for murder along with all of the circus around Larry Nasser.  This has not been ideal circumstances by any stretch of the imagination.  To some degree, I am glad she did not try to push through knowing she was not mentally there and end up with a catastrophic injury because of it.  I would argue the easy decision would have been to push through because it is the Olympics.  

Edited July 28, 2021 by IUALUM03

[kyhoosier29]

9 minutes ago, IUALUM03 said:

Let's not minimize the toll this is taking on all athletes without their full support system there and being a year later than their schedule had built them up to.  I would argue Lily King would have been still at her peak last year, but the extra year put her out of her window.  The teenage phenom from Alaska wouldn't have even qualified had the Olympics happened last year.

Also, I would add Biles has dealt with her brother being at trial for murder along with all of the circus around Larry Nasser.  This has not been ideal circumstances by any stretch of the imagination.  To some degree, I am glad she did not try to push through knowing she was not mentally there and end up with a catastrophic injury because of it.

I’m not judging her experiences and the toll it could take. I’m simply confused at all of the timing. IMO if she wasn’t 100% going into the olympics then she should have dropped out then. I don’t understand how her mental health could have changed within days. That’s all I’m getting at, and why I wondered if her “less than herself” performance in the preliminaries or whatever it was led to this decision more so than the issues surrounding her. I also have a hard time, like others have said, being more accepting of it (not that any of our feelings matter) when she’s calling herself the GOAT, then pulling out of the Olympics the day before the team event.  Again, can understand dealing with life happenings, but it was the whole timing for me that didn’t make sense. A physical injury causing her to remove herself is different, and completely understandable in my book. Again, all JMO. 

[go_iu_bb]

This article explains more of what her anxiety is. Like the yips for gymnastics but combined with the anxiety of getting injured.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/olympics/2021/07/28/twisties-gymnastics-simone-biles-tokyo-olympics/

[Leathernecks]

I'm still counting it as gold for women's gymnastics. Russia never should have been invited back after 2014.