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Stories That Make You Shake Your Head At The World


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2 hours ago, IUFLA said:

I said "zero" is the correct answer, and that you won't get there by banning AR-15s... And you say "but you will."

So you're under the impression that if we ban AR-15s this will stop, apparently?

I use VT because it goes to show a motivated lunatic doesn't care what tool he uses to kill.

If the grounds and/or the building had been secured, we wouldn't even be having this conversation...

I never said it will stop. I said it would reduce the damage inflicted. And because making it stop is a tremendous challenge, and overall unlikely, minimizing the damage is the next best option. 

I’m all for making schools more secure, but to use your argument: this will apparently stop mass shootings??????? A motivated criminal could find a way to duplicate a key card and get into the school undetected. Because of this hypothetical scenario should we throw the idea of making schools more secure out the window???

That rationale is silly.

In all seriousness, I am for making schools more secure if it will reduce the damage. So, it’s an option we need to look into - I am 100% behind this recommendation. I’m also for better access to mental health. 

For some reason you keep looking at this like an all or nothing scenario only when it comes to guns. "If some measure of control won't 100% stop the problem, then we can't consider it". Yet, you don't apply this same standard to the other recommendation you make (securing schools, mental health, etc.), which also aren’t 100% preventative.

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1 hour ago, IUFLA said:

What do they haul stuff with? As I said, most people buy for utility. I think moving horses around would be difficult for a Fiat 🙂 

Your father sounds like a solid guy... Us old fellas don't need to look tough 😉

 

I sent you a video to our PM thread about hauling. Strong Richard Scarry vibes. 😂

My Dad is the coolest, most solid, low key dude. I actually often use him to ground my own thinking on issues. I realize that I live in an area that is non-typical for the US. In that regard, I may seem to get a little “out there” sometimes when it comes to issues around guns, transportation, public health, etc.

But that tracks back to my own experiences that are different than many other people’s. Here SUVs are seen as death machines, b/c they kill people in crosswalks when the driver is on their phone and can’t see over their hood. Just yesterday a woman and her baby were run down in a crosswalk - baby died, woman in critical condition. That doesn’t happen where my Dad lives, but it happens MULTIPLE times per week here. It’s a constant refrain of pedestrian killed - whoops anorther accident. 

So, I often refer back to how he lives and what he does. It makes me realize that not everyone who owns a gun or a big truck is the problem. That dude wouldn’t dream of putting his own rights/beliefs above others. He realizes that everyone has their own struggle/viewpoint. 

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Foxnews is reporting a school safety bill was stopped in the Senate. There must be much more to this because it seems rather simple and common sense.

"The bill, ..., would require the Department of Homeland Security to establish a "Federal Clearinghouse on School Safety Best Practices" for use by state and local educational and law-enforcement agencies, institutions of higher education, health professionals, and the public. And it would require DHS to "collect clearinghouse data analytics, user feedback on the implementation of best practices and recommendations identified by the clearinghouse, and any evaluations conducted on these best practices and recommendations.

The clearinghouse, which is already available at SchoolSafety.gov, would be codified into law with the bill’s passage."

I guess we don't want to follow best practices and allow more children to die ?!?

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2 minutes ago, Reacher said:

Foxnews is reporting a school safety bill was stopped in the Senate. There must be much more to this because it seems rather simple and common sense.

"The bill, ..., would require the Department of Homeland Security to establish a "Federal Clearinghouse on School Safety Best Practices" for use by state and local educational and law-enforcement agencies, institutions of higher education, health professionals, and the public. And it would require DHS to "collect clearinghouse data analytics, user feedback on the implementation of best practices and recommendations identified by the clearinghouse, and any evaluations conducted on these best practices and recommendations." 

The clearinghouse, which is already available at SchoolSafety.gov, would be codified into law with the bill’s passage."

I guess we don't want to follow best practices and allow more children to die ?!?

Be interesting to see what kind of pork/pet projects were added to this bill.  The problem with alot of these bills is amendments and pork get added to the point they get torpedoed. 

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6 minutes ago, Lostin76 said:

I sent you a video to our PM thread about hauling. Strong Richard Scarry vibes. 😂

My Dad is the coolest, most solid, low key dude. I actually often use him to ground my own thinking on issues. I realize that I live in an area that is non-typical for the US. In that regard, I may seem to get a little “out there” sometimes when it comes to issues around guns, transportation, public health, etc.

But that tracks back to my own experiences that are different than many other people’s. Here SUVs are seen as death machines, b/c they kill people in crosswalks when the driver is on their phone and can’t see over their hood. Just yesterday a woman and her baby were run down in a crosswalk - baby died, woman in critical condition. That doesn’t happen where my Dad lives, but it happens MULTIPLE times per week here. It’s a constant refrain of pedestrian killed - whoops anorther accident. 

So, I often refer back to how he lives and what he does. It makes me realize that not everyone who owns a gun or a big truck is the problem. That dude wouldn’t dream of putting his own rights/beliefs above others. He realizes that everyone has their own struggle/viewpoint. 

You make a strong case for decentralized power and control. I think many can get behind that and rules and regulations should be different for NYC than in rural IN. Let CA do what they want, same with NYC and FL and whoever else. 

I think a lot of problems are created by politicians trying to nationalize something that should be more local. 

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21 hours ago, IUFLA said:

Famous last words of every subjugated man in the history of the civilized world...

 

 

20 hours ago, Joe_Hoopsier said:

Ranks right up there with... Oh, that could NEVER happen.

If no one can see the examples from Afghanistan and now Ukraine, I just don't know what to say and those are just recent. Oh heck, maybe now we can add Portland to the scenario that the US Government would just squash everyone like a bug...

Rights were not granted on the whims of... "In my opinion, you just probably don't need that, it doesn't make sense to me". 

OK carry on.  

FWIW, Elon Musk agrees with you. https://www.cnbc.com/2022/05/25/elon-musk-backs-tight-background-checks-for-all-gun-sales-in-wake-of-mass-shooting-in-texas.html

“I strongly believe that the right to bear arms is an important safeguard against potential tyranny of government. Historically, maintaining their power over the people is why those in power did not allow public ownership of guns,” Musk said in an email to CNBC.

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7 minutes ago, mrflynn03 said:

Be interesting to see what kind of pork/pet projects were added to this bill.  The problem with alot of these bills is amendments and pork get added to the point they get torpedoed. 

Anyone lawmaker that tries to add pork to a bill on school safety needs to be called out publicly and tossed out of Washington on their backside.

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1 minute ago, 5fouls said:

Anyone lawmaker that tries to add pork to a bill on school safety needs to be called out publicly and tossed out of Washington on their backside.

Agreed. Maybe we will eventually learn what happened. It sure appears that politicians are more concerned with the politics than our children. 

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16 minutes ago, Reacher said:

Foxnews is reporting a school safety bill was stopped in the Senate. There must be much more to this because it seems rather simple and common sense.

"The bill, ..., would require the Department of Homeland Security to establish a "Federal Clearinghouse on School Safety Best Practices" for use by state and local educational and law-enforcement agencies, institutions of higher education, health professionals, and the public. And it would require DHS to "collect clearinghouse data analytics, user feedback on the implementation of best practices and recommendations identified by the clearinghouse, and any evaluations conducted on these best practices and recommendations.

The clearinghouse, which is already available at SchoolSafety.gov, would be codified into law with the bill’s passage."

I guess we don't want to follow best practices and allow more children to die ?!?

I read the article... It should be signed into evidence as exhibit 1A (see what watching "Perry Mason" will do for ya?) for the term limits argument.. 

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6 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

Anyone lawmaker that tries to add pork to a bill on school safety needs to be called out publicly and tossed out of Washington on their backside.

I a 100% in favor of single topic legislation. (or what ever you call it) If they have to work 24 hrs a day voting every 20 seconds, I don't care.

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23 minutes ago, Reacher said:

You make a strong case for decentralized power and control. I think many can get behind that and rules and regulations should be different for NYC than in rural IN. Let CA do what they want, same with NYC and FL and whoever else. 

I think a lot of problems are created by politicians trying to nationalize something that should be more local. 

100%. What works or doesn’t work for NYC can seem ludicrous in rural IN. I do always try to keep that in mind, but am not always successful. 

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3 minutes ago, rico said:

Yes. Pipe bombs are bad as well.

The difference here, since you're trying to compare to AR-15's, is that there is not an industry in place that supports, manufactures and distributes pipe bombs to the public, for profit.

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2 minutes ago, MoyeCowbell said:

Yes. Pipe bombs are bad as well.

The difference here, since you're trying to compare to AR-15's, is that there is not an industry in place that supports, manufactures and distributes pipe bombs to the public, for profit.

So what in your opinion makes an AR-15 more dangerous than other firearms? That's for you as well @tdhoosier... 

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Just now, MoyeCowbell said:

Yes. Pipe bombs are bad as well.

The difference here, since you're trying to compare to AR-15's, is that there is not an industry in place that supports, manufactures and distributes pipe bombs to the public, for profit.

I am not trying to compare anything.  Just pointing out other things that are out there.  And the story I posted was just from a few hours ago.

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4 minutes ago, MoyeCowbell said:

Yes. Pipe bombs are bad as well.

The difference here, since you're trying to compare to AR-15's, is that there is not an industry in place that supports, manufactures and distributes pipe bombs to the public, for profit.

Yes there is, your local hardware store. They are like the supposed Ghost gun, some assembly required.

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5 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

So what in your opinion makes an AR-15 more dangerous than other firearms? That's for you as well @tdhoosier... 

The power, speed and ballistics of a lighter bullet expelled from a firearm that was built not to jam, aka continue to shoot large quantities of rounds in a short period of time. This enhances the opportunity to kill more, quicker.

5 minutes ago, Joe_Hoopsier said:

Yes there is, your local hardware store. They are like the supposed Ghost gun, some assembly required.

Really? Ok sure, but we both know hardware stores are not created and supported to manufacture, support and distribute weapons for the purpose of killing.

2 minutes ago, mrflynn03 said:

I don't care about drywall. All of these things tear through human flesh. Having weapons that produce this carnage at high volume in short bursts is what I'm talking about. It's all devastating.

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3 minutes ago, MoyeCowbell said:

The power, speed and ballistics of a lighter bullet expelled from a firearm that was built not to jam, aka continue to shoot large quantities of rounds in a short period of time. This enhances the opportunity to kill more, quicker.

Really? Ok sure, but we both know hardware stores are not created and supported to manufacture, support and distribute weapons for the purpose of killing.

I don't care about drywall. All of these things tear through human flesh. Having weapons that produce this carnage at high volume in short bursts is what I'm talking about. It's all devastating.

Gun manufacturers are not designed to kill people. They are designed to expel an object from a device and accurately place it where the user intends. There is no "gun" mfg'r that markets.... This puppy will kill 7000 humans. Just like Black pipe mfg'rs don't market, put two pipe caps on this and 4 ounces of powder and it will kill 55 ppl. Dodge doesn't market their Durango.. This thing will kill 10% of lower manhatten in the cross walk. Stanley tools doesn't market their hammer..

Fix the people.

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As an aside, I do want to say and stress that I'm grateful and thankful that we can have this debate in the manner that we are currently doing. There are obviously multiple (and differing) viewpoints on this topic, yet our ability to voice our opinions through words rather than violence is a testament to all parties.

If more people were willing to do this, maybe just maybe we wouldn't have a topic like this to be so heated about.

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12 minutes ago, MoyeCowbell said:

The power, speed and ballistics of a lighter bullet expelled from a firearm that was built not to jam, aka continue to shoot large quantities of rounds in a short period of time. This enhances the opportunity to kill more, quicker.

Really? Ok sure, but we both know hardware stores are not created and supported to manufacture, support and distribute weapons for the purpose of killing.

I don't care about drywall. All of these things tear through human flesh. Having weapons that produce this carnage at high volume in short bursts is what I'm talking about. It's all devastating.

Developing an opinion on a subject when one has a relative lack of knowledge on a subject is why it's difficult for anything to get done. 

Nothing you can typically own fires short bursts, volume of fire is limited by the speed of the user.  Guns aren't magical killing machines that defy the laws of physics 

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2 minutes ago, Joe_Hoopsier said:

Gun manufacturers are not designed to kill people. They are designed to expel an object from a device and accurately place it where the user intends. There is no "gun" mfg'r that markets.... This puppy will kill 7000 humans. Just like Black pipe mfg'rs don't market, put two pipe caps on this and 4 ounces of powder and it will kill 55 ppl. Dodge doesn't market their Durango.. This thing will kill 10% of lower manhatten in the cross walk. Stanley tools doesn't market their hammer..

Fix the people.

A hammer was invented, and now used, for very specific reasons. Can it be used to kill someone? Of course. You could kill someone with a broom, pillow, Hello Kitty doll... but those items are not manufactured for the purposes of killing.

You're slipping in marketing, which is not the same thing.

And yes, I agree with you... lets work on the people. Let's spend more on public health, mental health, civic projects that provide light and levity to a sometimes cruel world. 

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3 minutes ago, MoyeCowbell said:

 

And yes, I agree with you... lets work on the people. Let's spend more on public health, mental health, civic projects that provide light and levity to a sometimes cruel world. 

There are also evil people out there.

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