Nebraska Post Game Thread

[IU878176]

Just now, IUCrazy2 said:

Can be.  Geronimo has seen a reduction in minutes.   I did not get to watch the Syracuse game, was he egregiously bad in that game?  Felt like he had some ok minutes the few games before that.

He was really bad in the Cuse game. Got the hook after 4 minutes and never got back in. 

[Bushmage]

10 minutes ago, btownqb said:

We don't want him to have to play long stretches. 

He actually had 5p 3r 3a and I would say a very solid +/-

I'm wondering why this is any sort of talking point?

We cannot have a guard go 4 years through our program and say 5/3/3 shooting 3 for 7 and 2 turnovers/dumb fouls is a solid game. That's the talking point. We have younger guys who make a much better offensive impact, and while Rob does play great defense we have a great defensive team at large that could handle a lesser defensive player getting minutes like Lander or Leal. And both of those young guys are showing me they aren't total sieves either.

[btownqb]

4 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

I certainly wasn't laughing at you...I just think we need to see Lander get some minutes. We know what we have in Rob, both good and bad...maybe we should try to see the future...

 

Nope, wasn't you. I didn't mean it like it bothered me. Sorry for that. 

But we have seen Lander this year. Right? I don't think the B1G games need to be used for development purposes. 

[btownqb]

1 minute ago, Bushmage said:

We cannot have a guard go 4 years through our program and say 5/3/3 shooting 3 for 7 and 2 turnovers/dumb fouls is a solid game. That's the talking point. We have younger guys who make a much better offensive impact, and while Rob does play great defense we have a great defensive team at large that could handle a lesser defensive player getting minutes like Lander or Leal. And both of those young guys are showing me they aren't total sieves either.

Hey take it up with Woodson. Idc who he plays. 

[btownqb]

4 minutes ago, IU878176 said:

He was really bad in the Cuse game. Got the hook after 4 minutes and never got back in. 

Yes, so bad. 

[Bushmage]

Just now, btownqb said:

Hey take it up with Woodson. Idc who he plays. 

I am curious why Lander didn't get minutes. But the aggressive defense for Rob just puzzles me sometimes. I'm not saying he should get zero minutes, but he should not be eclipsing some of these other guys.

[btownqb]

Just now, Bushmage said:

I am curious why Lander didn't get minutes. But the aggressive defense for Rob just puzzles me sometimes. I'm not saying he should get zero minutes, but he should not be eclipsing some of these other guys.

The only reason he played as much as he did today was because of XJs ineffectiveness plus his foul trouble. 

[IU878176]

Got the W. In order to finish in the top half of the league we absolutely had to get a home win against the 12th/13th best team in the league.

11 turnovers at the half but finished with 14 for the game (3 in the second half, call Ripleys).

Race and the bench gave a lot of effort today. Leal and Bates provided some really good minutes 

TJD was really “flat”.

Kopp (who will do some good things for us this year) had a terrible game. Not sure why he played as much as he did in the second half.

Good to see Stewart hit some second half 3’s. Will be big if he and Bates (and Kopp) can be a threat through the conference season.

On to Wiscy. They will shoot a lot better than Nebraska. Hope we can keep Davison in check but I’m willing to bet he will draw 3 fouls on  X in less than 10 minutes.

 

[ephul]

1 minute ago, Bushmage said:

We cannot have a guard go 4 years through our program and say 5/3/3 shooting 3 for 7 and 2 turnovers/dumb fouls is a solid game. That's the talking point. We have younger guys who make a much better offensive impact, and while Rob does play great defense we have a great defensive team at large that could handle a lesser defensive player getting minutes like Lander or Leal. And both of those young guys are showing me they aren't total sieves either.

You still have the same expectations for Phinisee as you did 3 years ago. We all thought Phinisee was going to be much better than he is. That hasn't been the case. What we've learned over the last few years is that he's a great defender, and a backup point guard. Not a great shooter. That doesn't mean he failed and serves no purpose. We simply have to put him in a role that fits his game.

Lander was, like, the #1 PG in his class. If we base our expectations on his rating 3 years ago, anything less than 14 points, 7 assists, and 1 turnover per game is a failure. But guess what? We learned the rankings were wrong. He has skill, but hasn't put it together. He's undersized, not a great shooter, average defender, and turns it over a bit. Does that mean he's a failure? No, it just means a different role. And right now, Woody didn't see a fit for him in today's game.

We can argue all we want about Phinisee. Right now, Woody trusts him more than Lander. I don't think Woody cares much about "potential" and what could be. Who is best for the spot we are in. Right now. At this moment in this game. And it's Phinisee right now.

[Bushmage]

3 minutes ago, ephul said:

You still have the same expectations for Phinisee as you did 3 years ago. We all thought Phinisee was going to be much better than he is. That hasn't been the case. What we've learned over the last few years is that he's a great defender, and a backup point guard. Not a great shooter. That doesn't mean he failed and serves no purpose. We simply have to put him in a role that fits his game.

Lander was, like, the #1 PG in his class. If we base our expectations on his rating 3 years ago, anything less than 14 points, 7 assists, and 1 turnover per game is a failure. But guess what? We learned the rankings were wrong. He has skill, but hasn't put it together. He's undersized, not a great shooter, average defender, and turns it over a bit. Does that mean he's a failure? No, it just means a different role. And right now, Woody didn't see a fit for him in today's game.

We can argue all we want about Phinisee. Right now, Woody trusts him more than Lander. I don't think Woody cares much about "potential" and what could be. Who is best for the spot we are in. Right now. At this moment in this game. And it's Phinisee right now.

Problem is I have seen more of a jump from Lander from last season to now than I have with Rob in 4 years. Rob is essentially the same player as a freshman. It's baffling. It's frustrating to see people not hold accountability for that.

[btownqb]

4 minutes ago, ephul said:

You still have the same expectations for Phinisee as you did 3 years ago. We all thought Phinisee was going to be much better than he is. That hasn't been the case. What we've learned over the last few years is that he's a great defender, and a backup point guard. Not a great shooter. That doesn't mean he failed and serves no purpose. We simply have to put him in a role that fits his game.

Lander was, like, the #1 PG in his class. If we base our expectations on his rating 3 years ago, anything less than 14 points, 7 assists, and 1 turnover per game is a failure. But guess what? We learned the rankings were wrong. He has skill, but hasn't put it together. He's undersized, not a great shooter, average defender, and turns it over a bit. Does that mean he's a failure? No, it just means a different role. And right now, Woody didn't see a fit for him in today's game.

We can argue all we want about Phinisee. Right now, Woody trusts him more than Lander. I don't think Woody cares much about "potential" and what could be. Who is best for the spot we are in. Right now. At this moment in this game. And it's Phinisee right now.

Wow, best post I've read in awhile. Good stuff. 

[Inequality]

19 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

Just a comment on Leal's play...

He definitely made a difference...I love his court vision and the fact that he doesn't force the issue... And he stayed in front of his man...

I hope he gets more time as the season goes on... someone else said it..."he's a winning player." 

You all have seen the childhood videos shared by his Mother. Leal has long dreamed about his chance to be on the floor as a Hoosier. You bet he is going to give his all every chance he gets. The way he shoots the rock, I personally would get him in the game a whole lot more.

[btownqb]

Just now, Bushmage said:

Problem is I have seen more of a jump from Lander from last season to now than I have with Rob in 4 years. Rob is essentially the same player as a freshman. It's baffling. It's frustrating to see people not hold accountability for that.

We went and grabbed a PG to take basically all of Robs mintues!!!!!!! How is that not holding him accountable!?!?!

[Rogermci]

21 minutes ago, Bushmage said:

Sloppy game but a win is a win. Had some good moments but these turnovers are awful.

Also wondering why lander didn't play? Rob got a lot of minutes to ultimately score 5 points and 2 rebounds. I do not understand the defense of him. He just doesn't play well in long stretches. Guard play has to be tightened up all around for conference season. 

Rob seems to play badly in cupcake games.  I think generally speaking he plays well against tougher teams and B1G competition.  In my book, he played good but not great today.  Let's see what he does against Wisconsin.   

[btownqb]

1 minute ago, Inequality said:

You all have seen the childhood videos shared by his Mother. Leal has long dreamed about his chance to be on the floor as a Hoosier. You bet he is going to give his all every chance he gets. The way he shoots the rock, I personally would get him in the game a whole lot more.

Now.. with his solid play and evidently he's showing it in practice, as well... he pushes the top 3 wings to play better, consistently, or they're sitting. 

Competition breeds success.  

[IU878176]

2 minutes ago, btownqb said:

We went and grabbed a PG to take basically all of Robs mintues!!!!!!! How is that not holding him accountable!?!?!

Yep, 

I’d guess that at least 1/2 of Robs minutes have simply been because X can’t stay out of foul trouble.

[Bushmage]

8 minutes ago, btownqb said:

We went and grabbed a PG to take basically all of Robs mintues!!!!!!! How is that not holding him accountable!?!?!

I'm talking about on here. Clearly we started to recruit over him. But it feels like it angers people to hear criticism of Rob. 5/3/3 is not a good statline from him when he gets the chance to essentially play starter minutes. And today was arguably one of his better games this season. He's not gonna be playing next year while we have other guys who clearly show promise and a trajectory in growth that will be. I don't assume I know more than Woodson, but it just feels like Rob eats some of their opportunities up and I don't see the return.

Edited December 4, 2021 by Bushmage

[Zlinedavid]

B10 win #1 for Coach, and one that was and should have been comfortable. Defense was good, offense still needs work. 
 

Nothing to complain about, nothing to brag about. On to the next one. 

[btownqb]

6 minutes ago, Bushmage said:

I'm talking about on here. Clearly we started to recruit over him. But it feels like it angers people to hear criticism of Rob. 5/3/3 is not a good statline from him when he gets the chance to essentially play starter minutes. And today was arguably one of his better games this season. He's not gonna be playing next year while we have other guys who clearly show promise and a trajectory in growth that will be. I don't assume I know more than Woodson, but it just feels like Rob eats some of their opportunities up and I don't see the return.

Then Lander needs to play better!!!!

[IUFLA]

I'm submitting this simply for perusal and to clarify what I'm saying...Stat totals for this year in a like amount of minutes

 

I've said, I think you get more from Lander on the offensive end...And if he could cut down on his turnovers it would be very clear...

We all know Rob's a superior defender when he's healthy...

I know Coach Woody values the ball and defense, so I understand why he relies on Rob, but boy, I think KL has a ton of potential...

[Bushmage]

8 minutes ago, btownqb said:

Then Lander needs to play better!!!!

The stats show lander is clearly better than rob on offense. And we are a good defensive team whether rob is in or not. 

[btownqb]

5 minutes ago, Bushmage said:

The stats show lander is clearly better than rob on offense. And we are a good defensive team whether rob is in or not. 

Lander has made some bad TOs vs bad teams. 

I can't make you see what Woodson and staff see. I can't. 

[btownqb]

9 minutes ago, IUFLA said:

I'm submitting this simply for perusal and to clarify what I'm saying...Stat totals for this year in a like amount of minutes

 

I've said, I think you get more from Lander on the offensive end...And if he could cut down on his turnovers it would be very clear...

We all know Rob's a superior defender when he's healthy...

I know Coach Woody values the ball and defense, so I understand why he relies on Rob, but boy, I think KL has a ton of potential...

2 of Robs 4 games were vs P5 teams, we should note. 

Rob vs 2 other poor teams and those stats could for sure favor RP. 

Either way.. 4 more turnovers in the same amount of minutes vs lesser competition along with not being as experienced or nearly as good of a defender. 

🤷‍♂️ Lander hasn't shown he is a better option. He hasn't. 

[Bushmage]

Just now, btownqb said:

2 of Robs 4 games were vs P5 teams, we should note. 

Rob vs 2 other poor teams and those stats could for sure favor RP. 

Either way.. 4 more turnovers in the same amount of minutes vs lesser competition along with not being as experienced or nearly as good of a defender. 

🤷‍♂️ Lander hasn't shown he is a better option. He hasn't. 

Lander was arguably one of the worst players in D1 last year while Rob is a senior and lander is better in all offensive categories. Never claimed I know more than Woodson, but you just said Lander needs to play better and the truth is he is outperforming rob

[kyhoosier29]

15 minutes ago, Bushmage said:

The stats show lander is clearly better than rob on offense. And we are a good defensive team whether rob is in or not. 

Good grief man, just stop. Take up your argument with CMW. Lander’s foul at the end of the Syracuse game was enough for me to sit him on the bench the whole game today. Completely idiotic. Obviously CMW wasn’t happy about KL’s performance Wed. Or he felt Nebraska wasn’t a good matchup for him. 

Edited December 4, 2021 by kyhoosier29