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Good interview with Devonte Green on Assembly Call that I recommend. 

Very interesting how he talks about the differences between Archie and Crean. He said that Crean pretty much only focused practices around development and drills while CAM mainly did 5 on 5 scrimmages. He also talked about Archie’s tight leash (my words) and how he didn’t like the packline because he believed it was ineffective against good shooting teams who stretched the floor. 

None of those statements are the least bit surprising as much they are a confirmation of many fans’ thoughts about the last 5 years. 

When I look back it’s really surprising that he stayed because his style of play and CAM’s system were like oil and water. 

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23 minutes ago, Madison22 said:

Here are the final stats / national ranking, in Archie's fourth year:

2P FG%: 225th

3P FG%: 236th

FT%: 300th

His only solutions were to practice more defense and lift more weights.  He was 100% clueless about shooting.  As if that little detail would magically work itself out.

 

archie magazine.JPG

Beating A Dead Horse - South Park GIF - Southpark Beat Horse GIFs

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46 minutes ago, ledies22 said:

Beating A Dead Horse - South Park GIF - Southpark Beat Horse GIFs

You have to admit. Those numbers are pretty staggering!! Hits me every time I see them. It also tied in perfectly with the article. Hopefully in a couple years we will be able to look back and wonder how we all survived the Archie era.

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On 5/6/2021 at 1:50 PM, tdhoosier said:

Good interview with Devonte Green on Assembly Call that I recommend. 

Very interesting how he talks about the differences between Archie and Crean. He said that Crean pretty much only focused practices around development and drills while CAM mainly did 5 on 5 scrimmages. He also talked about Archie’s tight leash (my words) and how he didn’t like the packline because he believed it was ineffective against good shooting teams who stretched the floor. 

None of those statements are the least bit surprising as much they are a confirmation of many fans’ thoughts about the last 5 years. 

When I look back it’s really surprising that he stayed because his style of play and CAM’s system were like oil and water. 

Evident. Say whatever you want about Crean, he flat out developed people. Oladipo, Troy, DWade, Thomas Bryant... there are others, as well.

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8 minutes ago, btownqb said:

Evident. Say whatever you want about Crean, he flat out developed people. Oladipo, Troy, DWade, Thomas Bryant... there are others, as well.

I just find it hilarious how we went from one extreme to the other. These guys are polar opposites in their approach to the game and their personalities. If you could just merge the 2...you might get a pretty outstanding coach. haha. 

Crean teams: sloppy, reckless, bad defense, mentally ready but lacked game preparation, sometimes needed to slow down, every shot was a good shot.
CAM teams: too cautious, bad offense, lacked confidence, good game prep but not mentally prepared, sometimes needed to speed up, few shots seemed to be a good shot.  

😆

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3 hours ago, tdhoosier said:

I just find it hilarious how we went from one extreme to the other. These guys are polar opposites in their approach to the game and their personalities. If you could just merge the 2...you might get a pretty outstanding coach. haha. 

Crean teams: sloppy, reckless, bad defense, mentally ready but lacked game preparation, sometimes needed to slow down, every shot was a good shot.
CAM teams: too cautious, bad offense, lacked confidence, good game prep but not mentally prepared, sometimes needed to speed up, few shots seemed to be a good shot.  

😆

I disagree with some of your opinion on Crean, but I do think a combo of the two would have been nice, yes. I didn't have much of a problem at all with the way Crean's teams played, at least we were aggressive. I think Crean also had A LOT of unforeseen circumstances go against him. I was completely fine with letting him go though.

Biggest problem I had was him alienating himself against the HS coaches in this state. I'm not sure how that happened. Not recruiting Kyle Guy is just the most disturbing thing to me.

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On 5/6/2021 at 1:50 PM, tdhoosier said:

Good interview with Devonte Green on Assembly Call that I recommend. 

Very interesting how he talks about the differences between Archie and Crean. He said that Crean pretty much only focused practices around development and drills while CAM mainly did 5 on 5 scrimmages. He also talked about Archie’s tight leash (my words) and how he didn’t like the packline because he believed it was ineffective against good shooting teams who stretched the floor. 

None of those statements are the least bit surprising as much they are a confirmation of many fans’ thoughts about the last 5 years. 

When I look back it’s really surprising that he stayed because his style of play and CAM’s system were like oil and water. 

Didn't want to start a new thread but has anyone actually heard from Archie? I mean the day after Crean was let go he was still at AH supporting women's team I believe. I haven't heard one thing about where Archie is at.

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11 minutes ago, Seeking6 said:

Didn't want to start a new thread but has anyone actually heard from Archie? I mean the day after Crean was let go he was still at AH supporting women's team I believe. I haven't heard one thing about where Archie is at.

There was some convo about that on another thread that included the image of a page from a Where's Waldo book. haha. That said, I still think he still hasn't been heard from. 

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20 hours ago, btownqb said:

but I do think a combo of the two would have been nice,

Crean's defense and Archie's offense?  

See the source image

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20 hours ago, btownqb said:

 

Biggest problem I had was him alienating himself against the HS coaches in this state. I'm not sure how that happened. 

Yeah, how did that happen?

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1 hour ago, rico said:

Yeah, how did that happen?

 

21 minutes ago, btownqb said:

Lol dude... I have no clue.

IIRC, the story goes that Crean came off as pretty arrogant and  like he was always the smartest guy in the room when he met with high school coaches. I believe there was also some sentiment that he was more salesman that coach.

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2 minutes ago, Steubenhoosier said:

 

IIRC, the story goes that Crean came off as pretty arrogant and  like he was always the smartest guy in the room when he met with high school coaches. I believe there was also some sentiment that he was more salesman that coach.

I don't believe that, at all.

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18 minutes ago, Steubenhoosier said:

 

IIRC, the story goes that Crean came off as pretty arrogant and  like he was always the smartest guy in the room when he met with high school coaches. I believe there was also some sentiment that he was more salesman that coach.

Whose story?

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Yeah.  I can see Crean coming off as arrogant.  The fact is, I don't think Crean nor Archie, are the type of person a High School coach, or any regular person for that matter, would want to pull up a chair and swap stories with.  They just don't seem to be all that personable.  Is Crean a nice guy?  Yeah, probably.  But, he has enough quirks that would cause many people to shy away.  

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I think, and have heard, that Archie is actually funny and engaging away from the court. Very personable.

Devonte even alluded to it in that podcast. He said him and Archie got along great off the court, and he liked him alot. The friction was simply about the game and style of play.

Crean seems like a really good person, just socially awkward.

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15 minutes ago, 5fouls said:

Yeah.  I can see Crean coming off as arrogant.  The fact is, I don't think Crean nor Archie, are the type of person a High School coach, or any regular person for that matter, would want to pull up a chair and swap stories with.  They just don't seem to be all that personable.  Is Crean a nice guy?  Yeah, probably.  But, he has enough quirks that would cause many people to shy away.  

My 3 encounters with Coach Crean couldn't have been more the opposite than that. He treated me as well as Coach Allen has the times I've been fortunate enough to speak with him.

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Of course we can't access threads that were on the old site, but I know that I remember conversations where it was discussed that Crean talked down at some of the high school coaches. 

I have never said Crean was a bad guy, he had idiosyncracies and character traits that imo, were off-putting.

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11 minutes ago, bluegrassIU said:

I think, and have heard, that Archie is actually funny and engaging away from the court. Very personable.

Devonte even alluded to it in that podcast. He said him and Archie got along great off the court, and he liked him alot. The friction was simply about the game and style of play.

Crean seems like a really good person, just socially awkward.

Completely agree on Archie. I think sometimes people confuse his dislike or more closed personality with the media as meaning that is what his personality really is. I'm not trying to act like I know Archie or have interacted with him in any way, but the guy has spent his entire life in the gym. He grew up in the gym around his father and brother, he played high level high school and college basketball, and has now been a high level college assistant and head coach for going on two decades. 

I guarantee that if you put Archie in a locker room or in a gym with a bunch of basketball players or high school/college coaches that his personality is completely different. The gym and talking basketball is his comfort zone, that's where he lives. 

Just because he doesn't like doing media or having the spotlight on him at fundraising events/cocktail parties doesn't mean he isn't super comfortable, funny, and engaging in the gym and on the recruiting trail speaking with players, coaches and parents. 

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I think Crean 'got it' (for the most part) about the PR aspect of the job. He also really pushed for the new facilities, the fund raising that came along with that, and seemed to understand the importance of embracing the fan base (at least more so than CAM). He also brought in some IU legends: Vic, Cody, Yogi, etc. 

Crean did do a lot of good for the program and had successes, albeit, unsustained. 

From what I gather, his downfall was that he just rubbed people the wrong way; in the program and out. From the outside (and I may be completely wrong) he seemed to be one of those people who are scatter-brained, have an insane amount of energy and expect people to fall in line with their methods. Of course people who don't go through life that way need structure and can't adapt to changes on a dime. His recruiting strategy was all over the board and spontaneous. Alienating good in-state recruits for guys like Tim Priller probably didn't sit right with Indiana HS coaches. 

AND we're talking about a guy who didn't have scheduled practice times - he'd just text the players and staff 2 hours before he wanted them to show up.

Imagine working for somebody like that. It had to be exhausting on many fronts.

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I’ve never spoken to any of these coaches so who knows. For whatever reason it just didn’t mesh. Was it Crean prioritizing kids outside the state? Did he not make the right connections to the power programs in the state? Arrogant?? Didn’t see that...at least not intentionally. It isn’t like he speaks about himself in the 3rd person or anything...lol I mean everyone could take things their own way so hard to say how people will mesh. Probably not worth hashing it out all over again. The only relationships that matter now are with the new staff...and I think we have a good mix of Midwest-Fife, East-Hunter, and South-Yasir. With Woodys charisma we will see if it wins kids and coaches over.

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