Hoosierhoopster Posted January 30, 2018 Report Share Posted January 30, 2018 It's possible that CAM's style of play -- hard-nosed D, pack line, half-court game over outside shooting, etc., factors into his teams' not shooting FTs as well. The more grind during the game the less well you're going to shoot from the line. If your game is outside shooting and not as much contact, you're generally going to shoot from the stripe better. In that regard, if players are shooting worse from the stripe now than last year, you can't just sit back and say work harder at FT shooting, it's just not that simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IowaHoosierFan Posted January 30, 2018 Author Report Share Posted January 30, 2018 26 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said: It's possible that CAM's style of play -- hard-nosed D, pack line, half-court game over outside shooting, etc., factors into his teams' not shooting FTs as well. The more grind during the game the less well you're going to shoot from the line. If your game is outside shooting and not as much contact, you're generally going to shoot from the stripe better. In that regard, if players are shooting worse from the stripe now than last year, you can't just sit back and say work harder at FT shooting, it's just not that simple. maybe but then i think you would see these issues with schools who do this like WVU, Texas, Arizona, and Virginia but i think they shoot better. Now, they could also have higher level of talent too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted January 30, 2018 Report Share Posted January 30, 2018 IU is a bad free throw shooting team, which has cost us games and is not being overstated, but I think the difference being attributed to Miller is being overstated. RoJo is basically shooting the same percentage as last year. Newkirk is up about 8%, Green is about the same, Hartman has always been a streaky free throw shooter (he did well two years ago, but was in the 60's three years ago), etc. The culprits are basically Morgan and Davis. Morgan is down about 9% but I think that can largely be attributed to an expanded role and the energy he's expending, and then with Davis is clearly had a mental issue with the free throw line early in the season. My point is that the idea that this is some systematic issue due to the staff is unlikely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FKIM01 Posted January 30, 2018 Report Share Posted January 30, 2018 34 minutes ago, Hoosierhoopster said: It's possible that CAM's style of play -- hard-nosed D, pack line, half-court game over outside shooting, etc., factors into his teams' not shooting FTs as well. The more grind during the game the less well you're going to shoot from the line. If your game is outside shooting and not as much contact, you're generally going to shoot from the stripe better. In that regard, if players are shooting worse from the stripe now than last year, you can't just sit back and say work harder at FT shooting, it's just not that simple. Again...Not saying that's the entire solution. I'm just having a hard time believing that free throw shooting is getting the attention it deserves with this team. It seems like there is zero improvement there as the season progresses and I can't believe that more practice reps wouldn't help muscle memory at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosierhoopster Posted January 30, 2018 Report Share Posted January 30, 2018 14 minutes ago, BGleas said: IU is a bad free throw shooting team, which has cost us games and is not being overstated, but I think the difference being attributed to Miller is being overstated. RoJo is basically shooting the same percentage as last year. Newkirk is up about 8%, Green is about the same, Hartman has always been a streaky free throw shooter (he did well two years ago, but was in the 60's three years ago), etc. The culprits are basically Morgan and Davis. Morgan is down about 9% but I think that can largely be attributed to an expanded role and the energy he's expending, and then with Davis is clearly had a mental issue with the free throw line early in the season. My point is that the idea that this is some systematic issue due to the staff is unlikely. I don't know -- really haven't "studied" the question just throwing out a possibility, but it's hard to ignore how poorly CAM's teams have shot free throws, over several years. On stats for IU, Rob is shooting 75% at the line, that's not bad in anyone's book. But Morgan is at 65%. Last season he shot 74%. He's clearly getting more grind this season. He's taken more this season (last season took 88 total FTs), but 88 is plenty to base a percentage on. Davis went from 76% last season (on 90 FTs), to 62% on 64 FTs. He was emphasized in the post more, more banging, his FT percentage dropped significantly. Mental? Definitely possible, but that's a huge drop off, and it seems possible to me that the change in game style, emphasizing more of a grind game, is a factor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tdhoosier Posted January 30, 2018 Report Share Posted January 30, 2018 Archie, by his numerous statements, says his goal on offense is to drive the lane and shoot a lot of fouls. Based on this strategy alone I'd think that over his career his teams would shoot better from the line. I mean, if your offense revolves around getting to the line; you think he'd work on free throws. Again, I feel like I have to preface that I love Archie, but all coaches are going to have their weaknesses. Just like players...they need to work on them. I can accept the poor numbers now, but I hope, like Crean's turnovers, we are not talking about this in 3 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoosiertildeath Posted January 30, 2018 Report Share Posted January 30, 2018 IU wins the last 2 games IF THEY JUST MAKE THOSE DARN FREE THROWS !! Free throws are the easiest shot to make because no one is guarding the shooter !! IU needs to HIRE a FREE THROW SHOOTING COACH , IMHO !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zuckerkorn Posted January 30, 2018 Report Share Posted January 30, 2018 There has to be someone in this basketball loving state that could come in and fix the poor FT shooting. Not sure if it's mechanics, psychology, or motivation but a guy like Sam Alford seemed to have good FT shooters on his teams (Sichting at Martinsville and obviously Steve at New Castle were outstanding). Heck, we've seen H.S. girls teams that shoot close to 80% (or higher) - and some of those players have to jump to get the ball to the bucket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoosiertildeath Posted January 30, 2018 Report Share Posted January 30, 2018 Agree with Zuckerkorn that IU could hire someone to coach better free throw shooting !! However , the only thing that will make me happier about IU's chances in 2018-2019 would be for Archie to Land Romeo Langford !! As it is , I am really enthusiastic about the Recruiting class that Archie AND HIS STAFF have already landed for 2018-2019 !! Go Hoosiers !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 30, 2018 Report Share Posted January 30, 2018 1 hour ago, Zuckerkorn said: There has to be someone in this basketball loving state that could come in and fix the poor FT shooting. Not sure if it's mechanics, psychology, or motivation but a guy like Sam Alford seemed to have good FT shooters on his teams (Sichting at Martinsville and obviously Steve at New Castle were outstanding). Heck, we've seen H.S. girls teams that shoot close to 80% (or higher) - and some of those players have to jump to get the ball to the bucket. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotIThatLives Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 I think it was the first half of the Purdue game but Robert missed the first one and it actually looked good. Then he steps up and clanked the second one and his form at the release looked totally different. That is part mental and part muscle memory. At 21/22 years old I'm leaning more towards mental. My old high school coach could get most of our mothers to shoot 65% and most of us shooting above 80. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCHoosier32 Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 some of this can be attributed to lack of fundamentals in today's bball society. i was amazed at how bad of a FT shooting team Duke is this year! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leathernecks Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 37 minutes ago, NCHoosier32 said: some of this can be attributed to lack of fundamentals in today's bball society. i was amazed at how bad of a FT shooting team Duke is this year! This article is a few years old, but it is actually quite staggering how consistent free throw percentage has been over the years. From the mid 60s to 2009, the college average was never above 70% and never below 67% Some quick calculations on the NCAA website, and I got 70.98% for this year's average, so it would actually be up compared to in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milehiiu Posted January 31, 2018 Report Share Posted January 31, 2018 On 1/26/2018 at 7:34 PM, 5fouls said: Getting Romeo is critical. We desperately need a 3 point shooting threat. I don't think any of the returning players will fit that bill. I've heard Anderson is supposed to be a good shooter, but is the rest of his game good enough to where he would play 25-30 minutes a night. Romeo is so important. Just passing this along IU is in as good or better position with Romeo, than they have ever been. Not saying he is a lock. Far from it. However, word keeps coming to me that IU's star continues to get brighter and brighter in terms of Romeo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCHoosier32 Posted February 1, 2018 Report Share Posted February 1, 2018 as a coach, i have always thought the different theories on how to treat free throws in practice was a tough call. do you spend a ton of time in practice on them? that's hard to prioritize. seems like college players who aren't shooting well there should be working on their own outside of practice. of course you practice them some in practice. so how do you do it to simulate game pressure? we of course did it with the team watching some times with the punishment of the whole team running for misses. we also practiced it lineup up and boxing out like games, but how much can that really simulate? it's tough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rico Posted February 1, 2018 Report Share Posted February 1, 2018 2 hours ago, NCHoosier32 said: as a coach, i have always thought the different theories on how to treat free throws in practice was a tough call. do you spend a ton of time in practice on them? that's hard to prioritize. seems like college players who aren't shooting well there should be working on their own outside of practice. of course you practice them some in practice. so how do you do it to simulate game pressure? we of course did it with the team watching some times with the punishment of the whole team running for misses. we also practiced it lineup up and boxing out like games, but how much can that really simulate? it's tough. In high school, we had to shoot 50 free throws in the morning before school. In practice the coach would all of the sudden stop what we were doing and single out one guy to go to the line to shoot a "pressure FT". If he missed the whole team ran. When done running the coach would pick out another guy for a "pressure FT". If he missed the cycle would continue. But if the "pressure FT" was made it was back to practice as usual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted February 1, 2018 Report Share Posted February 1, 2018 14 hours ago, milehiiu said: Just passing this along IU is in as good or better position with Romeo, than they have ever been. Not saying he is a lock. Far from it. However, word keeps coming to me that IU's star continues to get brighter and brighter in terms of Romeo. Is your sources telling what has happened lately to put IU in a better spot with Romeo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milehiiu Posted February 1, 2018 Report Share Posted February 1, 2018 37 minutes ago, IU Scott said: Is your sources telling what has happened lately to put IU in a better spot with Romeo. No details. Just that things continue to improve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted February 1, 2018 Report Share Posted February 1, 2018 Just now, milehiiu said: No details. Just that things continue to improve. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 1, 2018 Report Share Posted February 1, 2018 On 1/29/2018 at 6:00 PM, bstall76 said: How good is the youngest Blackmon? I know Vijay is not D1 material hence NAIA out of high school, but what about the baby of the family. I am not that guy who is connected with Bloomington, or has any inside scoop. I do work with someone from Marion, who is well connected with their high school program. The youngest brother, Jalen, is a freshman averaging 24 ppg and supposedly the real deal. According to my co-worker, Vijay was brought to Bloomington under the agreement that Jalen would follow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FKIM01 Posted February 1, 2018 Report Share Posted February 1, 2018 26 minutes ago, Jerry Lundergaard said: I am not that guy who is connected with Bloomington, or has any inside scoop. I do work with someone from Marion, who is well connected with their high school program. The youngest brother, Jalen, is a freshman averaging 24 ppg and supposedly the real deal. According to my co-worker, Vijay was brought to Bloomington under the agreement that Jalen would follow. That sounds good, but I don't put much faith in deals like that. We see how the Ball family ended up. (and yes, I understand they are different families.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCHoosier32 Posted February 2, 2018 Report Share Posted February 2, 2018 21 hours ago, rico said: In high school, we had to shoot 50 free throws in the morning before school. In practice the coach would all of the sudden stop what we were doing and single out one guy to go to the line to shoot a "pressure FT". If he missed the whole team ran. When done running the coach would pick out another guy for a "pressure FT". If he missed the cycle would continue. But if the "pressure FT" was made it was back to practice as usual. we certainly did that on my teams, but still not sure how much that simulates. the key thing you said here is players doing it on their own time as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoosierhoopster Posted February 2, 2018 Report Share Posted February 2, 2018 On 2/1/2018 at 5:13 AM, NCHoosier32 said: as a coach, i have always thought the different theories on how to treat free throws in practice was a tough call. do you spend a ton of time in practice on them? that's hard to prioritize. seems like college players who aren't shooting well there should be working on their own outside of practice. of course you practice them some in practice. so how do you do it to simulate game pressure? we of course did it with the team watching some times with the punishment of the whole team running for misses. we also practiced it lineup up and boxing out like games, but how much can that really simulate? it's tough. Yeah, we would separate the players into groups of 3 with each player shooting 10 FTs then switching, goal being an average of 7 and guys hitting less than than that running baselines. Emphasis on form at outset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BGleas Posted February 2, 2018 Report Share Posted February 2, 2018 I've never been a big fan of the "shoot free throws and run for every miss" model. I don't think it's all that effective. What I also liked that my coach did was practicing situational basketball. When we inter-squad scrimmaged at the end of practice it was rarely "put 20 minutes on the clock" and just play. We'd do things like 1 team is up 5 with 3 minutes to go, then something like tie game 1:30 left, etc., etc. Our coach would create different situations and we'd have to navigate them. Part of that would be fouling and guys would have to go to line in the real situation (obviously no crowd or anything). I always thought that was a more effective way to not only work on real game situations, but real free throw situations as well. Edit: Of course you also need to spend time working on free throws individually, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seeking6 Posted February 2, 2018 Report Share Posted February 2, 2018 De'Ron Davis had a video out this afternoon. Maybe someone will post. Gave himself a D and an F for his first two seasons. Really pulling for this kid. Hope he finds it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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