The “What are we selling to recruits” thread…

[Drroogh]

19 hours ago, 5fouls said:

If I was younger and picking out sports to love, college basketball would not be one of them I would choose.

Women’s volleyball!!

[Steubenhoosier]

14 minutes ago, Drroogh said:

Women’s beach volleyball!!

Fixed it for you

[MoyeCowbell]

19 hours ago, 5fouls said:

If I was younger and picking out sports to love, college basketball would not be one of them I would choose.

Apologies in advance for the long post.

I've been thinking about this for awhile, trying to internally articulate why I like the sports/teams/leagues that I do, and why I don't care as much for others. It always comes back to storytelling and the effectiveness of the marketing to present those stories.

By default, I love sports (and could give Hershey Steelpecker a run for his money on an essay why) and the entertainment they provide. There are infinite possibilities and outcomes; high drama and amazing feats of athleticism, mental toughness, emotional tension and anxiety... its pure and raw, which makes it awesome... so long as you're invested.

I love Cubs baseball. The fall of '16 was about as much joy as I've experienced. I was on the ride and felt every twist and turn of their World Series run. I was invested because of the story. There were great players with big personalities, playing with a purpose to change a centuries-old narrative. It was tangible. That Cubs team is/was/will be memorable because of the story they're forever intertwined with.

As far as my interest in the MLB at large? Meh. It's just not that interesting to me. And I say this knowing full well that there are some amazing players, doing amazing things. Judge, Trout, Ohtani, etc. are generational players that are no less than absolutely incredible at what they do. But the stories around them are being presented without any real or tangible (there's that word again) elements that stick. How is Mike Trout not a bigger sports figure? The overall marketing around him is non-existent.

College Basketball is similar. I LOVE IU Basketball. LOVE, LOVE, LOVE it. I'm not an irrational fanatic, but the program is something I've given a lot of time and energy to follow. I will watch any and every game because I'm invested. We have our own internal narrative that we've followed and discussed ad nauseum here. (And I absolutely love that we're on our way back up to the top of the mountain!)

Bus far as the college basketball landscape at large, there aren't big names or storylines that dominate the sports zeitgeist. As much as we love TJD, he wasn't some transcendent entity. He was/is just a very, very good college basketball player. But there are very, very good college basketball players all the time.

When I think about why the sport isn't as big as it once was, I ultimately think about what has stuck out in my mind from years past: Storytelling and marketing. A few examples:

Start with '79 Bird v Magic. Two rivals and opposing personalities destined to face each other in the biggest game possible. It was a Hollywood-made collision of different styles that couldn't have been better.

'83 NC State - ultimate underdogs beating Phi Slama Jama, a team itself that had flair, supreme style and appeared to be a juggernaut (and to be fair, this has only gained popularity after the fact. Doubtful that many people cared for NC State prior to the win.)

'90/'91 UNLV / Duke - Tark's Runnin' Rebels could dunk over anyone at any time. They felt like sin city on the court. They had massive presence because of their brashness. They were a force. Duke beating them skyrocketed Coach K and set the stage for the program they became.

'92/'93 Michigan - As much as I enjoyed and was proud of us taking them down, they had the big shorts and black socks. While not for everybody, it was a HUGE deal that made the Fab 5 stand out amongst the crowd. (Textbook A+ marketing)

Arkansas' 40 Minutes of Hell under Nolan Richardson -- a gimmick, but one that stood out.

The '96 UK team was an absolute monster. They were just an insanely loaded team and Pitino's clout was at an all-time high. Their profile made the '97 Arizona win even that much more impactful (although I would say Nike helped with Arizona's uniforms and shoes).

Indiana's '02 run -- another group of underachievers with a new coach taking down a behemoth in Duke, charging towards an improbable title after Coach Knight was fired

Butler's two title trips - the story behind Brad Stevens and his ascension through the ranks with Gordon Hayward

...

While there are still interesting stories (and many that I'm simply missing), there have been a lot that simply haven't been marketed properly. Florida won back to back titles -- an impressive feat, but does anyone really care? UCONN and Duke's most recent titles, again, what are the global take aways? How have they differentiated themselves? They all sort of blend together.

The teams are good. Not taking anything away from their talents and achievements, but Villanova and Virginia winning didn't really have the 'umph' of Champions previous. We need more color. More larger than life personalities. Something that separates and differentiates.

A lot of people despised Coach Knight's antics, but he was must see TV. 

[IUFLA]

7 hours ago, MoyeCowbell said:

I love Cubs baseball. The fall of '16 was about as much joy as I've experienced.

I do too, but 2016 only made up for 1969... They still owe me 2 more (1984, 2003) 😁

[Initial79]

On 5/15/2023 at 9:21 AM, IowaHoosierFan said:

Nope, trying to help my fellow fans see reality. There is actually a huge thread on Twitter today about this. Tons of IU students and fans responding. The general theme, we need lots of work and recruits are mentioning it. 

[IowaHoosierFan]

10 hours ago, Initial79 said:

Nope, trying to help my fellow fans see reality. There is actually a huge thread on Twitter today about this. Tons of IU students and fans responding. The general theme, we need lots of work and recruits are mentioning it. 

You made your point. Set your evidence and argued your side.  At that point, its over.  They either get what you're saying or they don't.  People don't agree with you, welcome to the internet, to the world in general.  You tried and now its time to move on.  Continuing to tell everyone you're right and stating the same thing over and over telling them they are wrong or don't know what they're talking about is at some point going to be counter productive and will make future points you make hold less value.  Just my thoughts. 

Pertaining to the Bold statement, have you considered that people might not need or want your "help them see reality".  Which is quite condescending by the way.  Maybe stick with twitter where you seem to have the audience you want/need for your way of thinking. I also read the whole thread and most people on here agreed with you to an extent or looked at it slightly different, but you seemed to want the all or nothing agreement from them.  Take your wins where you can and move on.  Not sure beating the same drum or horse is going to win you anything.

Just my thoughts. 

[Initial79]

14 hours ago, IowaHoosierFan said:

You made your point. Set your evidence and argued your side.  At that point, its over.  They either get what you're saying or they don't.  People don't agree with you, welcome to the internet, to the world in general.  You tried and now its time to move on.  Continuing to tell everyone you're right and stating the same thing over and over telling them they are wrong or don't know what they're talking about is at some point going to be counter productive and will make future points you make hold less value.  Just my thoughts. 

Pertaining to the Bold statement, have you considered that people might not need or want your "help them see reality".  Which is quite condescending by the way.  Maybe stick with twitter where you seem to have the audience you want/need for your way of thinking. I also read the whole thread and most people on here agreed with you to an extent or looked at it slightly different, but you seemed to want the all or nothing agreement from them.  Take your wins where you can and move on.  Not sure beating the same drum or horse is going to win you anything.

Just my thoughts. 

The amount of people who went at me for days on this subject. Told me I was crazy. IU has at least top 10% facilities. Recruits don’t care etc.  This discussion goes way beyond this thread and no, by far the majority believe we don’t have an issue here. 

I guess I don’t see the issue with posting more facts on it. You had to chime in and tell me, like you are my dad, that I am beating a dead horse in a thread about this very subject.  Actually, what is beating a dead horse is feeling the need to respond. 

I was not attacking anyone, I was posting it in the right thread, I was simply posting some new insight, why do I “need to move one?” Why do you care if I post facts in the correct thread? Don’t read it.  

To your bold statement, that was a response to you and why I was posting it again. Either way, condescending haha. What is condescension is your need to talk to me like I am a child. 

Look, I gave it a run. I was PMed by so many prior posters who told me they stopped posting here and only read. That they hoped I would stick around and not let the peanut gallery run me off like they have been.  The 15 guys who post daily here want your personal “god old boys club.” No worries.  I don’t think many of you realize you’re not very open to differing opinions. Most of you appear to know each other for years and it shows. 

you win, I am out. The day that Twitter is became more welcoming to debate than a message board.  

[Steubenhoosier]

7 hours ago, Initial79 said:

The amount of people who went at me for days on this subject. Told me I was crazy. IU has at least top 10% facilities. Recruits don’t care etc.  This discussion goes way beyond this thread and no, by far the majority believe we don’t have an issue here. 

I guess I don’t see the issue with posting more facts on it. You had to chime in and tell me, like you are my dad, that I am beating a dead horse in a thread about this very subject.  Actually, what is beating a dead horse is feeling the need to respond. 

I was not attacking anyone, I was posting it in the right thread, I was simply posting some new insight, why do I “need to move one?” Why do you care if I post facts in the correct thread? Don’t read it.  

To your bold statement, that was a response to you and why I was posting it again. Either way, condescending haha. What is condescension is your need to talk to me like I am a child. 

Look, I gave it a run. I was PMed by so many prior posters who told me they stopped posting here and only read. That they hoped I would stick around and not let the peanut gallery run me off like they have been.  The 15 guys who post daily here want your personal “god old boys club.” No worries.  I don’t think many of you realize you’re not very open to differing opinions. Most of you appear to know each other for years and it shows. 

you win, I am out. The day that Twitter is became more welcoming to debate than a message board.  

You have made this comment multiple times here. I get it, they are Private Messages. I am sure there are others as well wondering about the veracity of this statement. I am not saying you are fabricating this, just that there is nothing you have posted to back up your claim.

And fwiw, I am not bashing you. I think some of the information you have brought to this forum is a breath of fresh air as to how we look at our beloved university. I do think you have gone a bit overboard, and you come across as defensive too often, but you bring a valuable opinion. 

Step back if you need to , but come back when the topic of the day whets your interest. Either that, or become another of the supposed back channel posters you say are in multitudes.

[kyhoosier29]

12 hours ago, Initial79 said:

The amount of people who went at me for days on this subject. Told me I was crazy. IU has at least top 10% facilities. Recruits don’t care etc.  This discussion goes way beyond this thread and no, by far the majority believe we don’t have an issue here. 

I guess I don’t see the issue with posting more facts on it. You had to chime in and tell me, like you are my dad, that I am beating a dead horse in a thread about this very subject.  Actually, what is beating a dead horse is feeling the need to respond. 

I was not attacking anyone, I was posting it in the right thread, I was simply posting some new insight, why do I “need to move one?” Why do you care if I post facts in the correct thread? Don’t read it.  

To your bold statement, that was a response to you and why I was posting it again. Either way, condescending haha. What is condescension is your need to talk to me like I am a child. 

Look, I gave it a run. I was PMed by so many prior posters who told me they stopped posting here and only read. That they hoped I would stick around and not let the peanut gallery run me off like they have been.  The 15 guys who post daily here want your personal “god old boys club.” No worries.  I don’t think many of you realize you’re not very open to differing opinions. Most of you appear to know each other for years and it shows. 

you win, I am out. The day that Twitter is became more welcoming to debate than a message board.  

Your quote was “trying to help some fellow fans see reality”. You think that’s cordial or respectful? It’s not your info that some people are turned off by. It’s your presentation. Some have been trying to tell you that over and over. 

[FKIM01]

24 minutes ago, kyhoosier29 said:

Your quote was “trying to help some fellow fans see reality”. You think that’s cordial or respectful? It’s not your info that some people are turned off by. It’s your presentation. Some have been trying to tell you that over and over. 

Fair statement.

[IowaHoosierFan]

On 5/18/2023 at 11:43 PM, Initial79 said:

The amount of people who went at me for days on this subject. Told me I was crazy. IU has at least top 10% facilities. Recruits don’t care etc.  This discussion goes way beyond this thread and no, by far the majority believe we don’t have an issue here. 

I guess I don’t see the issue with posting more facts on it. You had to chime in and tell me, like you are my dad, that I am beating a dead horse in a thread about this very subject.  Actually, what is beating a dead horse is feeling the need to respond. 

I was not attacking anyone, I was posting it in the right thread, I was simply posting some new insight, why do I “need to move one?” Why do you care if I post facts in the correct thread? Don’t read it.  

To your bold statement, that was a response to you and why I was posting it again. Either way, condescending haha. What is condescension is your need to talk to me like I am a child. 

Look, I gave it a run. I was PMed by so many prior posters who told me they stopped posting here and only read. That they hoped I would stick around and not let the peanut gallery run me off like they have been.  The 15 guys who post daily here want your personal “god old boys club.” No worries.  I don’t think many of you realize you’re not very open to differing opinions. Most of you appear to know each other for years and it shows. 

you win, I am out. The day that Twitter is became more welcoming to debate than a message board.  

Never said i didn't appreciate your opinion or that you shouldn't post said opinion with you facts.  I actually stated you argued your point, stated your facts.  I get that you seem to be passionate about IUs facilities and how they stack up or influence a players opinion or decision to choose IU vs any other school.  Your way of stating is a bit off putting which is why i posted my message, which i though was not at all attacking you or asking you to stop posting.  My suggestion was maybe you were wasting your time on that subject.  My bad if you took it another way.  With that being said though.

I could care less if you post here or not.  If you want to leave, then leave, no need to announce your departure.  If you wan to stay, then stay, i could give two sh×^ and i am sure you give to sh#& about me and my post or my opinion.  But if you cannot take any sort of constructive criticism posted in good faith and without any malice, then maybe you should stay off the internet. 

Edited May 22, 2023 by IowaHoosierFan