KoB2011 Posted October 7, 2020 Report Share Posted October 7, 2020 1 minute ago, FKIM01 said: The subliminal message is, because I/we think/feel this way, you all should too. Well now you're just describing most devout religious folk in the West 🙃 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted October 7, 2020 Report Share Posted October 7, 2020 5 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: You dislike the NBA? If you hadn't mentioned it hundreds of times I'd never have guessed with the frequency you post in a thread specifically about the NBA. I have watched more this year down in the bubble since nothing else to watch. My point is that the political stuff don't effect my viewing of a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steubenhoosier Posted October 7, 2020 Report Share Posted October 7, 2020 53 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: Of course there are differences, I am just trying to understand where the line of sharing personal conviction is drawn? And, trying to understand what role agreeing with the message plays. I recognize that everyone will have different answers there; for me, I've always had to deal with personal convictions/messages/whatever I disagree with in sports and it's never impacted my fandom. It seems like some are dealing with that, at least at scale, for the first time and the result is taking their ball and going home. I just want to understand the why behind that, as I'm naturally inclined to what you engage with what I disagree with so I can understand and grow. Stopping communication is never a good thing, imo. One thing I refer back to is the criticism Tebow took throughout his career for espousing his faith, yet those who took similar actions, getting down on a knee, have been applauded. In a perfect world, which is not possible I know, neither person or people would be judged Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgambill Posted October 7, 2020 Report Share Posted October 7, 2020 41 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: Well now you're just describing most devout religious folk in the West 🙃 And we got separation of church and state out of it...can we pass separation of sport and politics lol!! I joke. I suppose if you wanted to equate the reference you would have 10 mins of the 30 minute pregame show discuss Tim Tebows Christianity or a Muslim players faith and then sprinkle it in through the telecast and then another 5 mins at halftime and 10 mins post game and yes put it on their uniforms and the floor/field and so on. Because a guy scores a td and kneels to thank God vs pretend to p!ss on the opposing teams logo and says thank God for my gifts I don’t think is equitable to what has currently been happening in sports...but if they did let that happen I would be turned off and I am a devout Christian. I think most of us Christians (maybe I shouldn’t speak for all Christians let’s say from my Christian perspective) would tell you more so than anyone messaging and how you present your message is 100% important in trying to win people to Christ. Being aware of the time and place and presenting it in a thoughtful loving manner is very important. The way this thing has been handled I could have easily told you would be divisive and not helpful to the overall discussion and the mission they want to accomplish but hey what do I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted October 7, 2020 Report Share Posted October 7, 2020 1 minute ago, dgambill said: And we got separation of church and state out of it...can we pass separation of sport and politics lol!! I joke. I suppose if you wanted to equate the reference you would have 10 mins of the 30 minute pregame show discuss Tim Tebows Christianity or a Muslim players faith and then sprinkle it in through the telecast and then another 5 mins at halftime and 10 mins post game and yes put it on their uniforms and the floor/field and so on. Because a guy scores a td and kneels to thank God vs pretend to p!ss on the opposing teams logo and says thank God for my gifts I don’t think is equitable to what has currently been happening in sports...but if they did let that happen I would be turned off and I am a devout Christian. I think most of us Christians (maybe I shouldn’t speak for all Christians let’s say from my Christian perspective) would tell you more so than anyone messaging and how you present your message is 100% important in trying to win people to Christ. Being aware of the time and place and presenting it in a thoughtful loving manner is very important. The way this thing has been handled I could have easily told you would be divisive and not helpful to the overall discussion and the mission they want to accomplish but hey what do I know. I would rather see a player kneel because of prayer over kneeling for the Anthem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgambill Posted October 7, 2020 Report Share Posted October 7, 2020 13 minutes ago, IU Scott said: I would rather see a player kneel because of prayer over kneeling for the Anthem I’m going to stop because I promised I wouldn’t jump back into this same debate because it brings to the forum what I despise about how the media and the sports leagues are dealing with this situation. So I’ll be done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 33 minutes ago, Steubenhoosier said: Stopping communication is never a good thing, imo. One thing I refer back to is the criticism Tebow took throughout his career for espousing his faith, yet those who took similar actions, getting down on a knee, have been applauded. In a perfect world, which is not possible I know, neither person or people would be judged I completely agree - I don't think it's fair to criticize Tebow for his faith. There is only one thing he has done worthy of criticism IMO, but I don't want to derail the thread with that conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 34 minutes ago, dgambill said: And we got separation of church and state out of it...can we pass separation of sport and politics lol!! I joke. I suppose if you wanted to equate the reference you would have 10 mins of the 30 minute pregame show discuss Tim Tebows Christianity or a Muslim players faith and then sprinkle it in through the telecast and then another 5 mins at halftime and 10 mins post game and yes put it on their uniforms and the floor/field and so on. Because a guy scores a td and kneels to thank God vs pretend to p!ss on the opposing teams logo and says thank God for my gifts I don’t think is equitable to what has currently been happening in sports...but if they did let that happen I would be turned off and I am a devout Christian. I think most of us Christians (maybe I shouldn’t speak for all Christians let’s say from my Christian perspective) would tell you more so than anyone messaging and how you present your message is 100% important in trying to win people to Christ. Being aware of the time and place and presenting it in a thoughtful loving manner is very important. The way this thing has been handled I could have easily told you would be divisive and not helpful to the overall discussion and the mission they want to accomplish but hey what do I know. To clarify, I was laugh at the joke in the first line, not the rest of your post. I have a pretty different perspective on the rest of your post, and I grew up in a conservative evangelical environment then studied religion in college (and continue to as an adult, it's a big interest of mine), but I don't think that this is the place for discussion. I certainly think it sounds as if you have a good, reasonable approach to things and are surrounded by others who do, so cheers to that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 35 minutes ago, IU Scott said: I would rather see a player kneel because of prayer over kneeling for the Anthem You'd rather see a Satanist pray than someone kneel for the anthem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 12 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: You'd rather see a Satanist pray than someone kneel for the anthem? Never said anything about satan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 1 minute ago, IU Scott said: Never said anything about satan No, you said pray. So would you rather watch someone pray to Satan or kneel? Or does the pray have to be to a specific deity for you to prefer that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 Just now, KoB2011 said: No, you said pray. So would you rather watch someone pray to Satan or kneel? Or does the pray have to be to a specific deity for you to prefer that? I have never seen anyone kneel and prayed to satan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 2 minutes ago, IU Scott said: I have never seen anyone kneel and prayed to satan It doesn't matter if you've seen it, there are Satanists and they do pray. Can you please answer, would you rather watch someone pray to Satan or would you rather watch a player kneel for the Anthem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 2 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: It doesn't matter if you've seen it, there are Satanists and they do pray. Can you please answer, would you rather watch someone pray to Satan or would you rather watch a player kneel for the Anthem? No Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 1 minute ago, IU Scott said: No Got it. I was hoping that you were simply okay with religious expression but not politics, but it seems it's more about you're okay with expression you agree with than you don't. You're certainly entitled to that position... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 2 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: Got it. I was hoping that you were simply okay with religious expression but not politics, but it seems it's more about you're okay with expression you agree with than you don't. You're certainly entitled to that position... I sure most on here are more comfortable seeing things you believe in and not against your beliefs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 Just now, IU Scott said: I sure most on here are more comfortable seeing things you believe in and not against your beliefs. That's what I'm trying to understand, you may be right about that. I'm typically okay with people expressing themselves regardless of what they believe, it's how I learn. I put a high value on understanding others, learning, and even changing what I believe about various things when I've been shown I'm wrong. I'd like to think that's how most people operate, but I may be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 7 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: That's what I'm trying to understand, you may be right about that. I'm typically okay with people expressing themselves regardless of what they believe, it's how I learn. I put a high value on understanding others, learning, and even changing what I believe about various things when I've been shown I'm wrong. I'd like to think that's how most people operate, but I may be wrong. I am not saying that people shouldn't express their beliefs and should be denied that right. I am against racism so I am not going to watch or listen to a bunch of white supremist. People every day makes decisions on what they watch or the things they buy with there money. For the.most part people will go with what they are comfortable with and what they like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KoB2011 Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 1 hour ago, IU Scott said: I am not saying that people shouldn't express their beliefs and should be denied that right. I am against racism so I am not going to watch or listen to a bunch of white supremist. People every day makes decisions on what they watch or the things they buy with there money. For the.most part people will go with what they are comfortable with and what they like. Oh I'm with you on the fact that how we spend our money reflects our beliefs, I guess I just look at sports and entertainment a bit differently than how I look at a cup of coffee, what type of sandwich I eat and where it's from, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IU Scott Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 13 minutes ago, KoB2011 said: Oh I'm with you on the fact that how we spend our money reflects our beliefs, I guess I just look at sports and entertainment a bit differently than how I look at a cup of coffee, what type of sandwich I eat and where it's from, etc. When watching sports you are spending your time and energy toward that sport..Will people spend their time which is a resource on things they don't find appealing to them or are against their beliefs. Like I said earlier that this political statements are not the reason I am watching or not watching a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrflynn03 Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 I only care about IU basketball/football and college football anymore, and my high school alma mater. To be blunt politics ruined the rest for me. Keep that crap out of sports. We all need someplace to escape to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrflynn03 Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 I really miss Larry Bird, The Worm, Jim McMahon, Walter Payton, and one of my favorites Bo Jackson among many more. And beastman Lyle Alzado, the guy an animal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrflynn03 Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 On 10/6/2020 at 10:27 AM, rico said: Absolutely. To a vast majority of the American people, sports doesn't affect their lives at all. I've been on staycation and catching up, but as my FIL says, just a bunch of adults playing kid games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrflynn03 Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 On 10/6/2020 at 12:02 PM, IU Scott said: Totally agree with this because when I was a kid you might see one NBA game a week and that was a Sunday afternoon game on CBS. In football you would see maybe 4 games a week with 3 on Sunday afternnon an done on Monday night. In the MLB you woud get one game a week on NBC on Saturday afternoon. Saying all of this is that back then getting to see a game on TV was a privilage and now it just does not have that excitement.     I still remember games from years ago from the rabbit ear antennas. 1993 when Boston College kicked a last second game winning field goal to beat Notre Dame. And many others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCHoosier32 Posted October 8, 2020 Report Share Posted October 8, 2020 eh, i'm a teacher and i'd venture to say more educated than many 18-22 year old athletes. of course there are plenty more educated than me as well. that said, i am not allowed to voice my opinion. i'm not allowed to have a voice. i love watching sports. i don't love politics. i think they are 100% entitled to their beliefs. i just don't care what they are or need them thrown in my face when i just want to watch a game for fun.  Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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